Need Help with spark timing please!!!

[Technical_Automan]

After much procrastination I finally got my engine put back together after replacing the intake manifold gasket...but when I took it apart I marked the wrong thing on the distributor and now the spark timing is wayyy off. The car starts, but barely and I have to hold the gas down to keep it running (which I didn't want to do for too long). I don't know how to set the ignition timing, can anyone help? I know the distributor rotor just needs to be turned to the right cylinder correct?

[Philo]

Need more info. Year of car, engine.

[hotrod_chevyz]

Bring piston number 1 to TDC.To do this it is simple.Just remove spark plug #1,and put your finger over the hole sealing it ,as to monitor air moving in and out of the combustion chamber.with your finger firm on hole 1, barely tap the starter until the piston rising pushes the air out the spark plug hole,wich will in turn cause your finger to come off of the hole.You are finding the motors compression stroke when you do it using this method.Now that you have found the engines compression stroke,its time to make sure its exact by lining up the timing marks.it should be within twenty degrees of the actual TDC mark,if the previous steps were done properly.Once you have achieved true TDC, remove the distributor cap,and make sure the rotor inside the distributor is pointing towards plug wire 1.If its not arrange the plug wires to do so,using proper rotation and wiring sequence,or adjust the base of the distributor until the rotor and cap agree to what wire controls spark plug number 1.You may have to restab the distributor.If i was to make a guess,i would think you missed stabbing the distributor by one tooth.as this is a common occurance if it is not anticipated.You may have to use a long screw driver and flash light to adjust the oil pump drive,wich is located down the distributor hole,and is ran by the distributor.This Usually has to be done because the distributor will not go all the way down into the intake,because the oil pump drives relation to the bottom of the distributor shaft changes when you pull the distributor.once you line it up,you can't get much closer than that if you follow these steps properly.If you have no timing marks,or you suspect yours are fibbing to you,or if the car doesnt run after lining it up with the timing marks,follow these instructions below.

.(If you cannot find any timing marks to guide you, get a screwdriver,and push it down the spark plug hole.If you guide it straight down the hole,you will touch the top of the piston with it.Use a ratchet on the center bolt of the harmonic balancer or crankshaft pully,and rotate the engine slowly using the engines natural rotation direction.All the while keeping your hand on the screwdriver.The purpose behind this is you must feel* the piston to the top.you may have to go back and forth several times to get the feel of using this method but it is an exact science.as you go back and forth,the screwdriver should go up and down as you pass back and forth over TDC.The objective is to get piston number one to absolute top or closest to the head as possible.Rotate the engine slightly back and forth until you can anticipate the activities of the screwdriver in the spark plug hole,until you are comfortable with believeng you have achieved TDC.Its easier than it sounds.)

And for future reference,mark stuff so you know exactly where it goes.By simply marking the intake and distributor base,you could have saved this entire headache

[hotrod_chevyz]

sry that was a longer reply than i had anticipated.i almost fell asleep reading it.....

[Technical_Automan]

lol well thanks a lot, that's very helpful although i'll save myself from reading the second paragraph until the first paragraph doesn't work. Now when I took it off I marked the cap in relation to the manifold...I should have marked the rotor or whatever that piece is called that's under the cap correct?

[hotrod_chevyz]

You should have put a small notch with a sharp pointed object and marked the actual distributor housing,and followed it to the intake.After that on the inside of the distributor,you can put a mark to line up the rotor with the housing.once the two marks are matched back up,you will end up with the exact timing you started with.thats always been my trick.

[Technical_Automan]

Ok well here's what I just did, I took out the number one spark plug, and used the timing mark on the harmonic balancer (crankshaft pulley?) to line it up with TDC. I got it within 1 or 2 degrees ATDC, is this bad? Then I took a screw driver and felt in the hole, but couldn't tell what I was feeling so just put the plug back in. But I figured it was either at TDC or BDC because the timing mark was on 0. Then I took out the distributor, used a long screwdriver to turn the thing down in there, put the distributor back in and after a few adjustments got it the point toward the number 1 cylinder. Put everything back together and tried starting it, and none of the sparks hit. So I figured well good it's 180 degrees off if it doesn't spark at all and I just did all that. So I take the cap off, mark where it's pointing and marked 180 degrees from there. I rotated it 180 degrees, maybe a little bit less or more however you want to look at it, put it all back together (breaking both dist. cap bolts ) and tried starting it again. It fired up instantly, then instantly died. Fired it up again and it stayed on this time, but only above 1000 RPM, and with a few shakes and shudders every second or two. So is my timing off only by a little bit now? if so what's the best way to adjust it? Or could I have a vacuum leak because I don't know IF that vacuum line off the back of the EGR solenoid goes anywhere and if it does I don't know where. Thanks for reading all that lol, and your help.

[FormulaLT1]

Have you ever vacuum tested your vehicle?

[Technical_Automan]

nope lol procrastination is a friend of mine.

[hotrod_chevyz]

It sounds like the timing is okay,and now you just have to reset the idle,and maybe clean or replace the plugs.Its very possible they may be fouled from running the engine with the timing off.I would say any shakes and shudders are tune up related.I wouldnt worry too much about the hose problem.For diagnostic purposes,just unplug the egr*temporarily* *wink*,and cap the hose.see how it runs after you do that.You can usually feel with your fingertips if an orfice is taking on air or not.The uneven or jittery idle would have me sniffing for a leak at any of several possible orfices on the body of the carb,that sucks in air at idle.When leaking they tend to make the idle go up,instead of down like you would witnedd from somthing like a pcv valve hose leak.Spray some wd-40 around the base of the carb,and see what happens.If you witness a idle change,it needs a fresh seal .high idle shows signs of a definate possible vaccum leak.And it can also throw off the timing of a vaccum advance distributor,as well as throw off track vaccum-electrical driven devices that control and monitor injected engines fuel mixture delivery and timing advance.

Remember that if you adjusted anything such as fuel mixture and idle,they will have to be re-adjusted because the timing or leak was the original problem.i would get a vaccum gauge and retune it.

[Technical_Automan]

It's fuel injected (TPI), I re-did all the timing stuff and got it just about perfect, and it runs smooth now and holds idle where it should. Now I want to advance the timing but my timing light is broken! I think I will need to replace the plugs soon because when I took the one out it was black w/ oil, not horrible but it could probably do with some new plugs, which are a pain on this car. So thanks for all your help, without it I would still be stuck wondering what to do, I appreciate it.