cold transmission problems

[j2arch]

I have a 99 GC and have been having problems with the transmission for a while but it is getting worse with the coming of winter. When the transmission is cold, it will not shift from 2nd to 3rd. After driving for a while (1/2 mile) it then warms up and changes. I have changed the fluid (5 quarts) and the filter but still no luck. I am now be quoted prices of 1500 to 2500 to fix if somthing major is wrong. Has anyone else experianced this?

Thanks

[xj31]

Front clutch seals are probably worn

[dksob81]

check, recheck, and triple check the tranny fluid level. remember to check it while the jeep is idling and in NEUTRAL

[j2arch]

I have checked the fluid continously, and it is always good. In regards to the fronts seals being worn, any ideas on cost to replace?

[xj31]

its kind of expensive because you have to take the trans out.The parts aren't the issue(I spent $15 on mine)The $1500 you were quoted sounds about right,but I would have to say it depends on the shop and the area.

[j2arch]

I am kind of dumb (lol), but would a automatic still have front clutch seals?
Thanks

[xj31]

there are a couple of clutch packs inside the trans.The front clutch is the one right behind the front pump on this trans.it's the first one or in the front so I guess thats why they call it the front clutch.The next clutch pack is called the rear clutch,it's behind the front clutch

[McCann]

Hi J2,

There are a couple of threads deeper into the Grand Cherokee section that also address this problem. If you haven't read them, I recommend that you do as they are helpful.

We have a 97 GC with V-8 and about 74k miles. This tranny was rebuilt under warranty at about 10K miles.

A few weeks ago we also were having the shifting when cold problem.

I spoke to a friend who co-owns a tire/repair shop in Kearney, NE. I mentioned the things I read in these threads.

His suggestion was to do a chemical flush of the the tranny, torque converter and replace the filter. It cost about $150. It took a heckuva lot of new fluid. Something about they put this chemical in and drive it a few miles and drain/suck out the chemical...he said if they do not do it right it won't work.

We did what he suggested 3 weeks and 1 Hunting trip ago. Have put on about 600 miles and so far so good. I will keep you posted but so far we are pleased with the results!

Mike

[Off_Road]

Posted by j2arch - 11-19-2004 at 02:47 PMI have a 99 GC and have been having problems with the transmission for a while but it is getting worse with the coming of winter. When the transmission is cold, it will not shift from 2nd to 3rd. After driving for a while (1/2 mile) it then warms up and changes. I have changed the fluid (5 quarts) and the filter but still no luck. I am now be quoted prices of 1500 to 2500 to fix if somthing major is wrong. Has anyone else experianced this?

Thanks

In the transmission industry there is a symptom which is commonly called "Morning Sickness" (mainly found in Ford's). Sounds funny, I know. This is a problem that occurs when the neoprene seals (synthetic rubber which is resistant to hydrocarbon oil and gas) become hard and brittle.

Inside of the direct clutch housing (which is also referred to as the front clutch housing/or drum) there is an aluminum piston. On this piston and in the housing itself there are several neoprene lip seals. This same concept is also found in the forward clutch housing (or also known as the rear clutch housing). I prefer using the term forward and direct because your overdrive clutches are even more to the rear of the trans then (what they call) the rear clutches.

These neoprene lip seals sometimes become hard and brittle. Which as a result causes a loss of line preasure to the respective piston which apply the clutches. After the seals warm up they become soft and pliable again. At which point they can move the travel of the piston to apply the clutches without loss of preasure the way they were originally designed to function.

I have no idea if this is your problem or not. But I do absolutely agree with dksob81, always check the fluid level first. Check the fluid level and quality of the fluid. Usually and in most cases the fluid level and especially the quality of the fluid are always good indicators of any possible internal failure. And always remember (incase you might not be aware of this) transmission fluid expands under heat. So you will get different readings depending upon the temperature of the trans.

I believe Chrysler always recommends checking the level hot at operating temperatures. But I prefer checking the level cold then just compensating for the expansion of the fluid. To many battle scars over the years on my arms from removing transmissions in preparation for rebuilds that were next to hot catalytic converters. Tend more to stand back and look at hot vehicles now and not touch em (LOL).

Best of Luck

[j2arch]

Alright, here we go. The transmission was still failing to engage 3rd when first driven. Along with this problem, I also had a problem with the ignition tumbler (where the key is inseted). The key at times would be inserted and could not be turned, either to start (forward) or into accessory (backward). After much movement back and forth (and no, this had nothing to do with the steering lock), the key would finally turn and allow me start the jeep. The key would still not go into accessory position. I left town for the next 14 days and parked the jeep. When I returned, I started the jeep and drove it and noticed the transmission had got worse. That is when I started posting here.

Now to last week. The jeep was now failing to start. The starter would engage, but never fire (only after the second attempt). would it start. I took it to Jeep who said that the fuel pump was shot. So replaced the fuel pump and told them to check and replace the ignition tumblers if needed which they did. (this was Friday).

Today is Monday and I drove the jeep Saturday, Sunday and today and it has not falted at all in shifting (yesterday was 32 degrees when i drove). Could replacing the full pump or the ignition have corrected this problem? Could codes have been reset?

Thanks to all who have or will replied.

[j2arch]

Could disconnecting the battery for ignition repair have caused the memory to loose this info and therefore corrected itself? Or could the new transmission fluid finally be getting into the valves (1-1/2 weeks later, 40 miles per day on average)?

[Off_Road]

Posted by j2arch - 12-06-2004 at 07:12 AMAlright, here we go. The transmission was still failing to engage 3rd when first driven. Along with this problem, I also had a problem with the ignition tumbler (where the key is inseted). The key at times would be inserted and could not be turned, either to start (forward) or into accessory (backward). After much movement back and forth (and no, this had nothing to do with the steering lock), the key would finally turn and allow me start the jeep. The key would still not go into accessory position. I left town for the next 14 days and parked the jeep. When I returned, I started the jeep and drove it and noticed the transmission had got worse. That is when I started posting here.

Now to last week. The jeep was now failing to start. The starter would engage, but never fire (only after the second attempt). would it start. I took it to Jeep who said that the fuel pump was shot. So replaced the fuel pump and told them to check and replace the ignition tumblers if needed which they did. (this was Friday).

Today is Monday and I drove the jeep Saturday, Sunday and today and it has not falted at all in shifting (yesterday was 32 degrees when i drove). Could replacing the full pump or the ignition have corrected this problem? Could codes have been reset?

Thanks to all who have or will replied.

You know that trans holds a total of about 12 quarts of tranny fluid including what's inside the lock-up torque converter. You've mentioned you changed the fuild (5 quarts) which is common for just a basic pan drop and filter change. Once you've finished a basic trans service as mentioned above. If your interested in doing a more do it yourself trans flush. What you would want to do is after you've changed the filter, re-installed the pan (with new gasket of course). Tighten up all pan bolts then add your 5 quarts. Run it, check the level (Chrysler products usually always check in neutral). Shut it off then disconnect the cooler line (one fluid enters the radiator). Shove a hose over the end of the cooler line, insert that hose into some containing device (bucket, empty anit-freeze container). Set your emergency brake, go start it up in neutral and as fluid begins to drain into your container. You in turn add fluid into the dip stick tube. So you've got 5 new quarts in it already. Doing this procedure and another 7 quarts to go (ta da all new fluid = complete tranny flush).

I'm really glad to hear that as of now your problem has gone away (knock on wood). And yes j2arch could be right and what fluid you did change might have loosen a few sticky valves (either governor valve or throttle preasure valve, 1 or 2 out of a 100 cases where I've come across a sticking 2-3 shift valve in the valve body).

But Congrats again, fingers crossed for contined success

[j2arch]

Doing this, does it change the 5 qts I already changed (or this a sealed area) and as I change, do I drain then add or add as I change.

Thanks

[Off_Road]

Posted by j2arch - 12-06-2004 at 08:53 AMDoing this, does it change the 5 qts I already changed (or this a sealed area) and as I change, do I drain then add or add as I change.

Thanks

The 5 original new quarts of fluid you added during the pan service you preformed are now after this amount of time mixed in together with the rest of the fluid.

You can still do this method of which I described. You won't need to pull the trans pan again, theres no need for that. And this procedure is the way we use to do it long before there was a special transmission flushing machine. Same as the $150.00 jobber, except - (minus) the pump/machine. Your allowing the vehicle to act as the pump for you by having the engine running.

Just figure out which cooler line that is going into the radiator is the inbound presure line. Disconnect that cooler line. Attach a hose onto it (slide the cooler line fitting a few inches back from the end (flared end) of the cooler line. Attach a hose that fits snuggly over the flare and a couple of inches down the line. Get yourself a case of good tranny fluid (I use Amsoil trans fluid myself, but $$ awful expensive). Set the emergency brake. Start the engine. And as fuild squirts out into your container. Start filling the trans with new fluid through the dip stick tube.

It's easy, don't pull the pan. Remove the exhaust cooler line (one with presure going into radiator). Start engine, let old fluid pump out as your pouring new fluid in. If you hadn't changed the 5 quarts it's easier to tell when to stop. Every so often you check the discharged old fluid. You'll know when you start to see new fluid being discharged, That's when it's time to stop. Well that indicator and you've probably just added the last of 12 quarts of new fluid lets you know also.

System's all flushed out now. $150.00 bucks minus fluid in your pocket. Congrats, your done.

p.s. Disclaimer ----> If you have serious major existing internal damage to your transmission. This procedure would more than likely help to speed up any possible failure, rather than slow the process down.

Again, best of luck.

[msrjeep]

i would recommend only using chrysler ATF+4. but we could debate this all day long. you might also consider a flash to the tranny module.