Oil filters revised

[movin2stereo]

Awhile ago there was some posts about oil filters and I want to share with you what I heard tonight.First off I will not fight with anybody about this info I heard,I'm talking about you BlazerLT.Well to start,I was at a NAPA tool show tonight and talked to a NAPA oil filter rep.He had alot of info on oil filters and to much for me to list.There was a little demo sitting there with a Napa Silver(Wix),Fram extra guard,Napa Gold (Wix)filters that were cut open so you could pull them apart and see inside.First thing I said was,ya I heard the Fram had cardboard in them and they were much better years ago.He said they always had cardboard in them.Just then a guy walks up and says,wow those things haven't changed since 1982.I was in shock.So I said well I read on the net.......He stopped me and said about the guy who cuts them open and compares them.I hear that one alot,he said.He said look here(at the demo with the filters cut open).Look at the NAPA SILVER and the FRAM extra guard.Which looks better.Well the NAPA SILVER has metal endcaps and the Fram has cardboard endcaps.I said the Silver looks better.He said ya the silver looks better but the Fram performs better.So looks don't mean shit.Even know Frams are junk they are actually better than that line of Wix.So I thought to myself,lets get a debate here.So I said how many miles before a oil change.He said,well before we go into that.......lets talk about the filter more.We started with the anti drain back valve.He said that no filter had a real VALVE.They just have a diaphram that works so-so.Talked about the filter media for a bit.Then he went into the bypass valve.This is a major part,if the filter starts to plug the oil will bypass because the spring is set at a certain psi like 35psi as a example.Chances are you will never plug one up.The major problem with this is you don't know for sure that the bypass isn't stuck open for some reason or not.There is no way to tell.Then he went on and said O.K. about that oil change.Would you want oil with 5,000+ mile on it getting bypassed and dumped back into your engine?Or would you want oil with 3,000 mile on it getting bypassed back into your engine?That's a no brainer!I personally change mine at 3,000 and I'm glad that I do cause it's cheap insurance.This is just something to think about.

[BlazerLT]

Well, the guy you talked about was right about the fram flowing better because you know why, because it has 1/2 the filter medium as any other filter out there. Of course it will flow better, it isn't filtering as well. The carboard will warp and will allow unfiltered oil to bypass your filter and back into the engine.

Someone saying that a cardbard reenforced oil filter is better than a metal end cap oil filter is an uninformed moron period and I would not give his advice any merit.

Secondly, if 3000miles OCI makes you feel good, by all means do it. BUT, as stated earlier and proved lots or times, it is a waste.

If you want proof, visit here and do some reading and get informed.

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php

Or read here for some more information...

http://www.motoroilbible.com/pre-one.html

I am not being mean or rude, I am just trying to inform people.

[movin2stereo]

Actually he said that the Fram had better filter media than the lower end Wix.The point of that was you can't go by looks by any means.Now the Fram didn't compare to the higher end Wix.I was just passing on what he said about the bypass valve and the truth is,you just don't know.Thanks for being suttle with me.

[BlazerLT]

Here, read this and learn that the guy you were talking to was completely wrong.

http://www.oilfilterstudy.com/

Honestly, check out the stats there.

Cardboard end caps will fail 1000% more than any metal capped oil filter.

[movin2stereo]

Don't get me wrong Blazer,I'm in no way defending Fram.They are junk.Not only do they have the cardboard ends that will fail,but the bypass valve is at the far end of the filter.What does this mean?When the filter bypasses,it washes the filter off and ends up back in your engine.How about that for a design?Thats why other(better)filters keep their bypass valves at the inlet,so there is no chance to wash the filter.I still have the Frams on my vechicles and I'm pround to say they will never go back on once I change oil again.

[BlazerLT]

All oil filters have a by pass valve that will allow the oil to bypass the filter when the filter plugs up and causes the oil pressure to rasise above a certain threshhold.

It will then open allowing unfiltered oil to circulate back into the engine rather than no oil going back to the engine when the filter is so plugged that oil cannot pass through at a certain rate.

Resistance to fluid flow creates perssure which actuates the bypass valve.

The fram cardboard ends are so feeble that they always warp thus not creating a good seal and it allows oil to bybass the filter element even when the filter is not clogged. This is the majoy problem with fram filters.

Couple that with the fact that it has 1/2 the filter medium which therefore means it will plug up twice as fast.

I hope you see what I am getting at.

I am in no wa attacking you, I am only setting the record straight. The guy that was talking to you was uninformed and his explanation is not backed by pure science and physics.

I haven't let anyone know yet, but I am a hydraulic and fluid system certified specialist.

[slimmy07]

i dont think changing your oil at 3,000 mi is a waste at all. i change my oil every 3,000 or 3 months regardless, because one like moving 2 said its cheap insurance and two oil DOESNT get any cleaner and thicker with time and i want my engine protected. bottom line i think of the oil in my truck like the blood in my veins.

[BlazerLT]

Believe what you want.

I will be laughing all the way to the bank with an engine that is just as protected as yours.

[atomicpulse]

I totally agree with BlazerLT on this one

[movin2stereo]

Originally Posted by BlazerLT

All oil filters have a by pass valve that will allow the oil to bypass the filter when the filter plugs up and causes the oil pressure to rasise above a certain threshhold.

It will then open allowing unfiltered oil to circulate back into the engine rather than no oil going back to the engine when the filter is so plugged that oil cannot pass through at a certain rate.

Resistance to fluid flow creates perssure which actuates the bypass valve.

The fram cardboard ends are so feeble that they always warp thus not creating a good seal and it allows oil to bybass the filter element even when the filter is not clogged. This is the majoy problem with fram filters.

Couple that with the fact that it has 1/2 the filter medium which therefore means it will plug up twice as fast.

I hope you see what I am getting at.

I am in no wa attacking you, I am only setting the record straight. The guy that was talking to you was uninformed and his explanation is not backed by pure science and physics.

I haven't let anyone know yet, but I am a hydraulic and fluid system certified specialist.

Yes your right and that sales rep said the same thing you did.I just didn't feel like typing that much more,seeing how the post was already long.Lets just keep in mind guys that this is just info and there is no need to start a debate over it.We all know and seen how the oil and filter wars will go on forever.To each there own.

[vtmecheng]

As you may guess, I am a mechanical engineer. Being the gear head perfectionist that I am, I did some research on filters before putting one on my truck. Fram is poop, no doubt about that. As many have said already, it doesn't filter as well as others (this is measured in "microns"). After spending some time looking at different filters I went with the AC delco brand. Not only can you get these at most autoparts stores but they actualy work very well. My truck has 138000 mi on it and doens't even pretend use oil and can still tow a 3500 lb boat on the highway.