2000 Jeep Grand Cherokee Ltd DIES

[earmbru]

My JGC dies for no apparent reason. I have had the Crankshaft Positioning Sensor replaced but that did not solve the problem. It used to start right back up usually but lately it takes up to 40 minutes before it restarts and then it dies again, over and over. I haven't really been able to drive it for the last week.

Dealer hasn't a clue - thinks it might be a loose connection that could take hours to find and they claim they still may not be able to find it. I've been reading the web for hours and come up with the following possible causes:

fuel pump, fuel pump check valve, ignition coil, fuel filter, fuel pressure, ballast resistor.

Has anyone had a similar situation which was resolved? I hate to take it in to spend $ for hours of them trying to trace wires!

[Dale Aeppli]

Originally Posted by earmbru

My JGC dies for no apparent reason. I have had the Crankshaft Positioning Sensor replaced but that did not solve the problem. It used to start right back up usually but lately it takes up to 40 minutes before it restarts and then it dies again, over and over. I haven't really been able to drive it for the last week.

Dealer hasn't a clue - thinks it might be a loose connection that could take hours to find and they claim they still may not be able to find it. I've been reading the web for hours and come up with the following possible causes:

fuel pump, fuel pump check valve, ignition coil, fuel filter, fuel pressure, ballast resistor.

Has anyone had a similar situation which was resolved? I hate to take it in to spend $ for hours of them trying to trace wires!

HI, DID YOU CHECK TO SEE IF YOU HAVE SPARK AT BOTH COIL AND PLUGS AND DID YOU CHECK TO SEE IF YOU HAVE GAS. TURN KEY ON AND SEE IF YOU CAN HEAR FUEL PUMP RELAY CLICK. THERE IS NO BALLAST RESISTER ON YOUR JEEP (ONLY EARLY 90'S) DALE

[email protected]

[earmbru]

Originally Posted by Dale Aeppli

HI, DID YOU CHECK TO SEE IF YOU HAVE SPARK AT BOTH COIL AND PLUGS AND DID YOU CHECK TO SEE IF YOU HAVE GAS. TURN KEY ON AND SEE IF YOU CAN HEAR FUEL PUMP RELAY CLICK. THERE IS NO BALLAST RESISTER ON YOUR JEEP (ONLY EARLY 90'S) DALE

[email protected]

Thanks. I just got this Jeep in late February and still don't know much about it or where things are. My last two cars didn't have computers which complicates things further.

I'll see if I can check about the spark question. Is the fuel pump relay click something quite noticeable? The only click I notice is when it won't start is one shortly after I've tried to start it. I haven't been sure what that is. What is weird is that it used to start right up for the most part. Now, it just cranks, sounds like it wants to start but doesn't.

thanks for the info on the resister. I've been reading everything I can find on the web and making notes about any similar problems. I still haven't been able to buy a manual for my Jeep - they are always out, so I don't know where everything is yet.

Thanks for the answer!

[Dale Aeppli]

Originally Posted by earmbru

Thanks. I just got this Jeep in late February and still don't know much about it or where things are. My last two cars didn't have computers which complicates things further.

I'll see if I can check about the spark question. Is the fuel pump relay click something quite noticeable? The only click I notice is when it won't start is one shortly after I've tried to start it. I haven't been sure what that is. What is weird is that it used to start right up for the most part. Now, it just cranks, sounds like it wants to start but doesn't.

thanks for the info on the resister. I've been reading everything I can find on the web and making notes about any similar problems. I still haven't been able to buy a manual for my Jeep - they are always out, so I don't know where everything is yet.

Thanks for the answer!

HI, THE FUEL PUMP RELAY IS IN THE POWER DISTRIBUTION BOX RIGHT BEHIND BATTERY ON PASS. SIDE. IF YOU REMOVE THE LID AND HAVE SOMEONE TURN THE KEY ON YOU WILL HEAR A CLICK IF IT IS WORKING IT DOESN'T RUN TILL VEHICLE STARTS. BUT YOU SHOULD HEAR IT CLICK WHEN KEY IS TURNED ON. FOR A GOOD MANUAL GET A CHILTON TOTAL CAR CARE MANUAL CHECK www.chiltonsonline.com dale [email protected]

[earmbru]

Originally Posted by Dale Aeppli

HI, THE FUEL PUMP RELAY IS IN THE POWER DISTRIBUTION BOX RIGHT BEHIND BATTERY ON PASS. SIDE. IF YOU REMOVE THE LID AND HAVE SOMEONE TURN THE KEY ON YOU WILL HEAR A CLICK IF IT IS WORKING IT DOESN'T RUN TILL VEHICLE STARTS. BUT YOU SHOULD HEAR IT CLICK WHEN KEY IS TURNED ON. FOR A GOOD MANUAL GET A CHILTON TOTAL CAR CARE MANUAL CHECK www.chiltonsonline.com dale [email protected]

Thanks. I forgot to mention a couple things. When I took it to the dealer @ the 2nd or 3rd time they mentioned replacing the COMPUTER because every time they ran it through, it was blank, like the hard drive of a PC being erased. Instead, we opted for the Crankshaft PS. When that didn't work, they hooked up a co-pilot for some time. But, that was blank, too, even though I had the failure and captured the info. A mechanic friend tells me this is because the battery is losing power?

Also, it seems that this problem got worse once our weather went into the 90-100 range. Could that simply be a coincidence? Before that, it was very intermittent-once I went almost 4 weeks without it dying.

[Dale Aeppli]

Originally Posted by earmbru

Thanks. I forgot to mention a couple things. When I took it to the dealer @ the 2nd or 3rd time they mentioned replacing the COMPUTER because every time they ran it through, it was blank, like the hard drive of a PC being erased. Instead, we opted for the Crankshaft PS. When that didn't work, they hooked up a co-pilot for some time. But, that was blank, too, even though I had the failure and captured the info. A mechanic friend tells me this is because the battery is losing power?

Also, it seems that this problem got worse once our weather went into the 90-100 range. Could that simply be a coincidence? Before that, it was very intermittent-once I went almost 4 weeks without it dying.

hi if you email me direct i'll send you information can't send thru forum these are from personal files [email protected] dale
have you found any fuses blown in the power control box under hood test with 12 volt test light

[earmbru]

Originally Posted by Dale Aeppli

hi if you email me direct i'll send you information can't send thru forum these are from personal files [email protected] dale
have you found any fuses blown in the power control box under hood test with 12 volt test light

Hi. I took the car back to the dealer and after they got the car to die on them, narrowed it to the PCM, which was one of their first guesses. The car has run great ever since. Unfortunately, the sensor was replaced first but c'est la vie. It's finally fixed.

[JWTinDEN]

This sounds exactly like my problem. The 1999 JGC with 4.7L V8 dies ramdomly with no warning. The only indication is the instruments look like the key was turned off. Then a 30 minute wait and it will restart. It cranks fine but until the gauges indicate gas and engine temp it will not start. All electrical stuff works so again no electrical problem symptoms.

The other symptom is it dies after 30 to 45 minutes driving no matter the outside temp. Again it randomly picks the day to quit. There is no pattern.

The dealer insisted it was the fuel pump. I refused to allow him to replace it as the vehicle never displays gas starvation. His pressure test confirmed the pump was fine. Pity he broke my new windshield while road testing. His mechanic set the test box down without protecting the glass while on the road.

Also, there are never any codes stored. After 2 visits and 6 days he is clueless. I have talked it over with other mechanics and they believe it is the main computer due to the lack of codes. You have to have a working computer to store codes. The dealer has so far resisted even replacing that expensive part as a test.

The random nature of this problem is frustrating all of us. My wife is particuarly iritated since it's her daily driver and our tow vehicle. Mama wants to pull the trailer and go places.

Can we agree to email each other when we get a solution? I'm ticked off the dealership is so wedded to the diagnostic computer. Use your human intelligence and troubleshoot. At least we agree it's spark as there is fuel and air. Why no spark???

Regards and best wishes for a quick resolution,
JT

[H60swmr]

Originally Posted by earmbru

Thanks. I forgot to mention a couple things. When I took it to the dealer @ the 2nd or 3rd time they mentioned replacing the COMPUTER because every time they ran it through, it was blank, like the hard drive of a PC being erased. Instead, we opted for the Crankshaft PS. When that didn't work, they hooked up a co-pilot for some time. But, that was blank, too, even though I had the failure and captured the info. A mechanic friend tells me this is because the battery is losing power?

Also, it seems that this problem got worse once our weather went into the 90-100 range. Could that simply be a coincidence? Before that, it was very intermittent-once I went almost 4 weeks without it dying.

Earmbru,
Your problem sounds EXACTLY like what I'm dealing with. JGC will die while driving (especially when it's hot but not exclusively) and the guages fall to zero, I lose power steering, power brakes etc. While waiting, the starter will turn over but not catch. After 30-40 minutes, everything comes back on like magic and it will run fine until it dies again. The computer diagnostics come up with nothing. HELP ME!!! Like you, I've already spent way too much money on a problem they can't seem to fix.
Please e-mail me.
Thanks,
Jeff

[g1smith]

Mine Too!
My 1999 JGC 4.7 is doint the exact same thing yours is!. It started 4 months ago when the Crankshaft Sensor died. Replacing it gave me 3 months of care free driving. The intermittant stalls began 3 weeks ago. It will die more often when it's hot and all guages fall to zero. Waiting 20 - 30 minutes, (for cooling) and everything comes back on like magic and it will run fine until it dies again, usually 5 miles latter. The engine check lite is off and my OBDII reader shows no errors.

I believe that this is a PCM controlled shutdown of the Fuel and Ignition Systems due to a dangerous condition, maybe a missing signal from a heat sensitive Crank Position Sensor. The computer can shut down the gages via the "CC" Bus? My stealer says that the $450 PCM is on back order . . . perhaps because of premature failures?

I have tested and replaced the following things in an attempt to fix the temperature related stalling problem. None of them has fixed the problem.
1. Fuel pump/delivery (I have replaced the fuel pump),
2. Replaced the CPS (Crankshaft Position Sensor) 3 months ago and fixed a previous no-start problem.
3. Replaced the CPS (Crankshaft Position Sensor) again thinking I got a flakey one from the dealership.
4. Replaced the Camshaft Position Sensor.
5. I've read that the O2 Sensors should measure to 5 - 7 ohms between the two white wires. Mine measure 14 Ohms between the two black wires.
6. I have a K'nN Air filter. Another poster stated that the oil used in these filters can contaminate the MAP sensor. I removed and cleaned the MAP sensor.
7. Removed and measured the TPS (Throttle Position Sensor) throughout the entire range of movement with both a digital and an analog ohm meter. Measured smooth from 5,000 ohms down to 500.
8. Removed and cleaned the IAS (Idle Air Motor).
9. Measured the Engine Coolant Temperature sensor at 1600 ohms.
10. Measured the Intake Air Temperature sensor at 3000 ohms.
11. Removed and cleaned numerous grounds from the PCM to the engine block,
12. I don't hear any gush of air when removing the Gas Cap, but neither does any of my other cars, so I don't think this could be a faulty gas cap.
13. Coils? My 99 JGC is equipped with "Coil over Spark Plug" technology, e.g., 8 little high voltage ignition coils build into the individual spark plug caps. I doubt that all 8 are failing at once. Another post states that changing out the plugs every 3 months seems to help but believes that's just masking some other problem.

I too have spent way too much money on a problem most likely due to a factory design problem.
Please e-mail me too.
Thanks,

[earmbru]

Hi. Well, ever since I replaced the PCM I rid myself of the shutting down problem. I've run into others but those are other stories. I'm sorry you've had to do all that other stuff. I don't know anything about cars so I was at the mercy of those that worked on my Jeep.

An interesting note though - the PCM went out AGAIN around Thanksgiving, which was only a few months after being replaced. The dealer replaced it for free since it was under the warranty period but I think that is odd. Of course, they "never heard of THAT happening before." I have to say that I'm glad I didn't take the advise of my sister who thought I should buy a used one from a wrecking yard. At least the dealer offers a guarantee on their parts.

I hope all my problems are resolved. The worst thing? I bought this Jeep from my sister and then had to put $5,000 into it just to get it running properly. We no longer speak...

Originally Posted by g1smith

Mine Too!
My 1999 JGC 4.7 is doint the exact same thing yours is!. It started 4 months ago when the Crankshaft Sensor died. Replacing it gave me 3 months of care free driving. The intermittant stalls began 3 weeks ago. It will die more often when it's hot and all guages fall to zero. Waiting 20 - 30 minutes, (for cooling) and everything comes back on like magic and it will run fine until it dies again, usually 5 miles latter. The engine check lite is off and my OBDII reader shows no errors.

I believe that this is a PCM controlled shutdown of the Fuel and Ignition Systems due to a dangerous condition, maybe a missing signal from a heat sensitive Crank Position Sensor. The computer can shut down the gages via the "CC" Bus? My stealer says that the $450 PCM is on back order . . . perhaps because of premature failures?

I have tested and replaced the following things in an attempt to fix the temperature related stalling problem. None of them has fixed the problem.
1. Fuel pump/delivery (I have replaced the fuel pump),
2. Replaced the CPS (Crankshaft Position Sensor) 3 months ago and fixed a previous no-start problem.
3. Replaced the CPS (Crankshaft Position Sensor) again thinking I got a flakey one from the dealership.
4. Replaced the Camshaft Position Sensor.
5. I've read that the O2 Sensors should measure to 5 - 7 ohms between the two white wires. Mine measure 14 Ohms between the two black wires.
6. I have a K'nN Air filter. Another poster stated that the oil used in these filters can contaminate the MAP sensor. I removed and cleaned the MAP sensor.
7. Removed and measured the TPS (Throttle Position Sensor) throughout the entire range of movement with both a digital and an analog ohm meter. Measured smooth from 5,000 ohms down to 500.
8. Removed and cleaned the IAS (Idle Air Motor).
9. Measured the Engine Coolant Temperature sensor at 1600 ohms.
10. Measured the Intake Air Temperature sensor at 3000 ohms.
11. Removed and cleaned numerous grounds from the PCM to the engine block,
12. I don't hear any gush of air when removing the Gas Cap, but neither does any of my other cars, so I don't think this could be a faulty gas cap.
13. Coils? My 99 JGC is equipped with "Coil over Spark Plug" technology, e.g., 8 little high voltage ignition coils build into the individual spark plug caps. I doubt that all 8 are failing at once. Another post states that changing out the plugs every 3 months seems to help but believes that's just masking some other problem.

I too have spent way too much money on a problem most likely due to a factory design problem.
Please e-mail me too.
Thanks,

[g1smith]

Good news! The ECM is covered under the Federal Emissions Standard Warranty for 8 years or 80,000 miles! Bad news, I have 132,000 kilometers on the JGC, thats about 82,000 miles! You know, I'm the first person to have experienced this problem . . . according to Chrysler. A friend worked for Ford and his job was to travel to dealerships to fix the problems their mechanics couldn't. He states that he saw alot of engines shutting down because of over-heated electronics in the beginning. This Chrysler (Jeep) is a great little SUV . . . if you only expect it to last 80,000 miles!