04 4-Runner and Burning smell

frank69m · #1 05-05-2004, 01:07 AM

I was looking into getting an 04 Sr5 and test drove one last weekend...After some spirited test driving, I noticed the burning smell that everyone has been complaining about. The sales guy told me it is a new engine so it is breaking in...BS man....is this the catalytic converter...does anyone know if toyota is gonna fix it in the 05's?

Brian R. · #2 05-05-2004, 09:26 AM

This smell is not only in Toyotas. Many brands of cars smell like this, although most vehicles do not ever smell. Only some of them apparently smell.

Here is a link to a 4-Runner forum devoted just to this issue:

http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/[email protected]/0

Let me warn you that the majority of complaints in that forum are from a very small number of owners, so it seems that the problem is more pervasive than it really is. It is unclear what percentage of the vehicles have this problem.

The problem is a reaction of the catalyst with the sulfer combustion products. They sit on the catalyst until a rich mixture (hard acceleration) causes a chemical reaction to liberate hydrogen sulfide.

This is not something Toyota will fix. It is a problem with sulfur levels in the gasoline. You can avoid this by buying low-sulfur gas. In general, the premium fuel (93 octane) is lower in sulfur than the 87 octane fuel at any particular gas station. Some owners have not been able to solve this problem, probably because they are unable to get low-sulfur gas. Some owners never have the problem for unknown reasons. The vehicle you drove probably had 87 octane (the cheapest) gas filled by the dealer. That vehicle may not give off any odor at all with premium gas. 89 octane is a crapshoot for this odor.

Low-sulfur gasolines (in my area) are AMOCO (BP) Supreme, SUNOCO premium, and Shell premium. There are probably others, but I don't know about them.

There is an emissions law that is going into effect in the near future sometime that limits the sulfur levels in gasoline. This will provide a cure.

frank69m · #3 05-05-2004, 10:40 AM

Maybe toyota is saying this is the gasoline...

I've had about 10 cars in my life....and I've know many others who have purchased Toyota's and other vehicles...never heard of this issue before with them....so I'm not sure if it is the "gas"....

My first testdrive with an 04 4runner....then boom, i get the smell....and I've heard of others in reading edmunds reviews who have the same issue...so I'm not sure if Toyota blaming the gas is the answer...

frank69m · #4 05-05-2004, 10:41 AM

oh and i live in california by the way

Brian R. · #5 05-05-2004, 12:46 PM

"I've had about 10 cars in my life....and I've know many others who have purchased Toyota's and other vehicles...never heard of this issue before with them"

Like I said, most vehicles do not have this problem. There are many other Toyota vehicles, as well as other brands of vehicles that have this problem occasionally. I have smelled them and I have seen reports of them on the internet. Search and you will find complaints from any brand of vehicle you wish. You can also find unlimited numbers of descriptions of this problem from a chemistry point of view. This is a well-known and well-characterized phenomena.

"I've heard of others in reading edmunds reviews who have the same issue...so I'm not sure if Toyota blaming the gas is the answer..."

The forum which I linked to above is specific for the sulfur smell in 4Runners, so you will only find 4Runner owners complaining there. Remember that from all the 4Runners sold in 2003 and 2004 (a lot), there are only 5-10 or so owners who are complaining on that forum. Most of the complaints and rants are repeat posts from the same people. Reading that forum will provide you with some background, but it will also give you a distorted perspective of the problem, since only owners with complaints are posting. Owners without the sulfur smell do not find that forum and post that they don't have a problem. It is the nature of the internet.

The sulfur is definitely from the gas. Whether you blame the gasoline refiners for the sulfur, or blame the car manufacturers/catalyst engineers for the catalyst is your business. This is not a Toyota-specific or 4Runner-specific issue. It is a catalyst-specific issue and many vehicles use this catalyst. Please do not blow this problem out of proportion or hastily place the blame for this problem before you read alot about it and understand what is going on.

frank69m · #6 05-05-2004, 01:31 PM

perhaps you are right...it was just a coincedence that the one I drove had that problem .....also it it is a catalyst problem...then wouldn't all the cars that use the same gas in the same state..eg let's say mobil super unlead have the same problem....strange there wouldn't be more complaints.

Brian R. · #7 05-05-2004, 01:57 PM

Not a coincidence. The dealer is going to give you cheap gas. That is going to increase the probability of your vehicle having this problem.

Also not strange about the frequency. Most vehicles with this catalyst do not have this problem. Not everything about this problem is understood. It may be a contaminant in the gas or catalyst that causes it, in addition to the catalyst composition and sulfur in the gas. Driving habits are certainly a factor. For the smell to be noticed by the driver, the smell has to both be generated (which is not happening constantly) and enter the passenger compartment. Drivers who have the a/c on with fresh air blowing in and the windows closed will not normally smell the exhaust, unless it is from the car in front of them.

That web site for the sulfur smell is not very active any more. Note that the 5th most recent post is from February.

frank69m · #8 05-05-2004, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian R.

Not a coincidence. The dealer is going to give you cheap gas. That is going to increase the probability of your vehicle having this problem.

What do you mean by cheap gas? 87 Arco?

Brian R. · #9 05-05-2004, 11:40 PM

I guess...They think that 87 octane is all you need. Particularly with gas prices the way they are.

Brian R. · #10 05-05-2004, 11:45 PM

Actually, since you mentioned it earlier, Toyota may fix some of the problem related to this smell getting into the passenger compartment. One of the reasons 4Runner drivers smell the exhaust is coincidental location of the exhaust pipe and the HVAC air exhaust in the wheel wells. Relocating these further away from each other may help the driver ignore this smell.

frank69m · #11 05-06-2004, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian R.

Actually, since you mentioned it earlier, Toyota may fix some of the problem related to this smell getting into the passenger compartment. One of the reasons 4Runner drivers smell the exhaust is coincidental location of the exhaust pipe and the HVAC air exhaust in the wheel wells. Relocating these further away from each other may help the driver ignore this smell.

I'm really hoping they will fix this in the 05 4-Runner cause I really loved it when I drove it. However, that smell really turned me and my wife off....man it was strong...I may wait if they are actually going to do this...or buy a Honda Pilot :-)

Brian R. · #12 05-06-2004, 11:24 AM

It seems that trucks on the lot would be more likely to emit an odor since they have been driven and, if they smell, would have been rejected by a potential owner. So they sit, waiting for another test drive.

Considering the small percentage of vehicles that actually smell, you would be wise to just order a truck. Odds are that it won't emit an odor. This would even the odds to basically the same odds as finding a bad-smelling Honda Pilot. Remember, Honda is not immune from this problem.

ffUser · #13 05-13-2004, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian R.

Like I said, most vehicles do not have this problem.

What makes you think that most 4Runners don't have this problem? I haven't run across a 4Runner owner that hasn't had the smelly exhaust.

Brian R. · #14 05-13-2004, 07:42 PM

I have talked with many on line that have not. Only a few that have. I have also driven behind hundreds of new 4Runners. They can't hide if it from me if they have that smell.

Also, there would be a lot more on the Edmunds problem topic than there is currently. The topic is dead. To me that means very few are interested. That means very few have the problem other than the 10 or so posters on that forum who profess to have that problem. The few with that problem have said their peace.

That is what I base that statement on. I have been involved with this problem from the beginning since I was in the market for a 2003 4Runner. The problem is way overblown - also not particular to this truck. If every vehicle with this common catalyst had that problem, the highway would smell like a dead skunk. And you don't miss it when you smell it. It is not a subtle odor.

Maybe everyone you've talked to likes to run regular gas. Maybe they live in a state that has particularly high sulfur gasoline. The Edmunds forum is open to anyone from any state. I suggest you read that forum if you are interested in owners with that problem.

frank69m · #15 05-14-2004, 10:47 AM

like I said, maybe brian is right...

It was just a coincedence that the only 4runner I picked out of the lot just happened to have that burning smell. I don't think so...it is an issue....why?

I've had many many cars in my life....you said this can happen to any car...well, how come none of my cars had that issue in my whole life...and I life in California...not only that, but I've probably been in 100's if not thousands of other cars with friends, family, etc....and no one has ever mentioned a burning smell in their car...so there...answer that......it ain't other cars...

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