Learned a new trick (not too important)

[ales]

OK, had to share with you:

it's snowing like hell here, and I love driving in snow (on proper studded tyres, of course). The problem is that my handbrake get's stuck (LR wheel) when it's too cold outside, so I have to avoid using it Imagine that! what I learned, is that to make sharp U-turns and correct understeer you can use the foot brake. You just put your left foot on the brake and press it, pressing the accelerator at the same time. Oh, should have mentioned that it will only work on FWD cars. So, the front wheels don't lock because of the engine rotating them, but the rear wheels will! Or almost will, which is enough to get the rear end sliding. I haven't played with this technique much, so I'm not sure how hard it is to modulate the rear-end sliding. I found that it not only works with U-turns, but also with O-turns (180 degrees) and OOOOOOO and OOOOOOU-turns

Comments?

P.S. probably the better way would be to brake and accelerate with the right foot, keeping the left one free for the clutch, but it's too much for me at the moment :cry:

[flylwsi]

left foot braking is actually taught in rally racing, as it transfers the weight to the front of the vehicle, and the weight on top of the drive wheels... and in your condition, it will, of course lock the rears.... similar to gravel, which allows you to control steering b/c of the weight, and still slide...

[ales]

Yesterday spent around 15 minutes continuously doing that (there's an area where we may basically practice driving in the snow in winter - safely). After that I stopped and threw some snow on the front wheels... the snow hissed and evaporated LOL! But I got a hang of it

[NSX-R-SSJ20K]

yea left foot braking just shifts weight making you turn more

and you can always drift the corner!!

Turn into it drop down a gear blip whilst engaging clutch and then floor it when you release it and it slides weeeeeeeee

countersteering is a good idea

[ales]

Originally posted by NSX-R-SSJ20K
Turn into it drop down a gear blip whilst engaging clutch and then floor it when you release it and it slides weeeeeeeee

Does it work with FWD?

[NSX-R-SSJ20K]

yep that works on FWD you won't drift tho it slides alot .... you can do that in auto's too

[Gonthrax]

Originally posted by ales


Does it work with FWD?

Well the theory of giving the throttle a quick blat as the clutch is almost out works on any car. Basicaly it keeps engine breaking from disrupting the balence of your car and keeps your weight shifted the way you want it with rev matching. Double clutching works as well but heel and toe is easier and just about as effective. As for the drifting part, I suppose in snow you could coax some brake bias overstear out of a FF drivetrain car and countersteer to hold it. It would be quite a task to master it though

[Cbass]

Yeah, this is why racing schools teach you to brake as hard as you can before you turn in. You get all the weight on the front wheels, for really quick turn in. As you go through the corner, it balances out, heavier on the outside of course. You can hit the brakes in the middle of the corner to brake/slide/transfer weight.

We used to call this heel toeing back in the good ol days, because you drove with your heel on the brake and your toe on the clutch.

[Pennzoil GT-R]

yeah, heel and toe! i cant stop doing it on the road cos before i could drive properly/legally thats the way i always used to practice. racing drivers actually use a combination of heel/toe and one foot 4 accelerator and one foot for brake. i have a video on the old Group B rally cars (if you remember the old Audi Quattros and Lancia Delta's). Ari Vatanen has a camera by his feet showing all his movements during the rally. I cant believe how fast he moves his feet changing between the different clutch/brake/accelerator techniques

[Cbass]

Yeah, there are multiple techniques for heel toeing. I'm not really good enough to do proper gas/brake heel toeing, but I knew one guy, who welded a bar onto his clutch pedal, so he could relocate the pedal right next to his brake. Hey, makes for easier braking

[Pennzoil GT-R]

here is a good way to induce oversteer that is used by racing drivers to bring the rear round on a car understeering mid corner:
First you will need a RWD car, and second you need to invest in adjustbale brakes. Power doesnt matter. Set the brake balance so all the brakes are on the front. Then when you come to the corner, brake and accelerate at the same time. if you can control the balance between power and brakes you will drift perfectly!

[unconvinced]

here is a good way to induce oversteer that is used by racing drivers to bring the rear round on a car understeering mid corner:

First you will need a RWD car, and second you need to invest in adjustbale brakes. Power doesnt matter. Set the brake balance so all the brakes are on the front. Then when you come to the corner, brake and accelerate at the same time. if you can control the balance between power and brakes you will drift perfectly!

As a former racing school instructor, and having raced for years before that in open-wheel cars and in karting, I can safely say I've never done that, nor seen it done in a racing context. I would imagine that's because the object of racing technique is to go fast.

However, I would imagine those drift contest drivers might do exactly as you describe, and I wouldn't doubt that hollywood stunt drivers often use that technique as well.

That said, a brake bias adjustor is a good idea. For balance in slippery conditions, you would set the bias a bit more to the rear than normal, and balance the car properly as you're coming off the brakes.

The technique of kicking the brake with the left-foot while maintaining throttle became popular in rallying once FWD and 4WD cars gained prominence. It works best with properly adjusted brake bias as well.

SS

[Pennzoil GT-R]

Originally posted by unconvinced


As a former racing school instructor, and having raced for years before that in open-wheel cars and in karting, I can safely say I've never done that, nor seen it done in a racing context. I would imagine that's because the object of racing technique is to go fast.

However, I would imagine those drift contest drivers might do exactly as you describe, and I wouldn't doubt that hollywood stunt drivers often use that technique as well.

That said, a brake bias adjustor is a good idea. For balance in slippery conditions, you would set the bias a bit more to the rear than normal, and balance the car properly as you're coming off the brakes.

The technique of kicking the brake with the left-foot while maintaining throttle became popular in rallying once FWD and 4WD cars gained prominence. It works best with properly adjusted brake bias as well.

SS

i first heard of it being done in the Ferrari GT race cars to bring the rear end round on slow corners. not powerslide as such, just a quick burst to bring it back into line. since then ive heard some people mention it every so often, and in the Ari Vatanen video i mentioned, he does it while driving the 205 T16

[Clarko]

Eric(on the roof)Carlsson used this technique back in the early 60's rallys in his 3 cyl. Saabs.It helped him win the Monte.On FWD cars you also can handbrake for much the same result.

[unconvinced]

Set the brake balance so all the brakes are on the front.

I've never heard of any racer besides a drifter giving up half his braking potential.

On FWD cars you also can handbrake for much the same result.

Supports the notion that you'd want a largely rearward brake bias in the loose.

SS