Why should I buy American Again?

[kentuckyjoe]

This car has been nothing but a headache every sense I turn the key.
It will be hard to buy another American Made car after this one.
The old saying” this is not your dad's Oldsmobile” sure holds true, my dad would have drive to Detroit (if the car would have made it) and kicked some butt.

I am glad the Oldsmobile’s days are numbered,

They can’t say I didn’t try to stay with an American car.
But this car has me to the end with over priced, over engineered, American Junk.

[scruff]

My parents had a '95 that was a POS...2 CD players, numerous plugs, wires, distributors, and every sensor at least once. My dad warned me when I got one for my wife, but 168k now and just the normal repairs (brakes, rotors, blets, etc). Cars are just like women...a lot of work, but you still love'm.

[oldsdad]

Joe just remember that a lot of the foreign autos are now also made here in the USA , Toyota, Mercedezs. A couple of years ago my sister in law bought a Nissan pickup and within 6 months the dealer put a new motor in, replaced the steering assy., and the rear axle hell they couldnt keep the truck on the road. Even after the motor replacement it still burned oil at 2 Q a month dealer finally bought it back. I own a 96 aurora and couldnt be happier, 96k miles $5000 price tag and runs like a top. My vehicle before was a 1980 Ford f100 pickup with 385K miles and still starts and runs fine.

[jjdewd]

I've owned a ton of foreign cars :Saab, Volvo, BMW, Audi, Toyota, Nissan ...heck I even had a Puegeot LOL And all of them had their problems.
I too have a "96"Aurora w/112k on it paid less than 5k for it. Beautiful Blk. on Blk. looks and runs like new. Love the unique styling, power and ammenities. I'm quite pleased

[Indy8]

You know Indy couldn't resist this thread! I think these cars are very sensitive to any sort of abuse, meaning "leaving the driveway". I have had no serious problems with mine. Everything works, car is in pristine California condition, was impeccably maintained by the original owner(owns three local NAPA stores)up to 50k miles when I bought it. Now, with only 73k, it sits in the garage needing a brand new $6k engine while I continue to make the payments. Therefore, oldsdad, don't even try and bring up ratios and percentages on customer satisfaction or percieved quality versus quality in fact. And jjdewd, of all those makes that you've owned that had their problems, how many were purchased new and properly maintained and treated with respect? Resale values don't lie.

[meatpimp]

$6k motor? What are you looking to put into it? Look used, you can buy low mileage (~60k) for under $1500 all day long. Most times you can get the tranny thrown in for a couple hundred more, so you can do a remove-and-replace for under $2000 in a weekend...

[97 silverbullet]

i bought mine at 80k put 70 k on it hard miles too, I drove that thing like a race car and i just now had problems and it was only the intake manifold and radiator and radiators can go on any car especially if they are made with plastic and metal (now thats stupid engineering) i love this car, its the best car i 've ever had. my friend has this honda and its constant problems.

[jon@af]

Originally Posted by kentuckyjoe

This car has been nothing but a headache every sense I turn the key.
It will be hard to buy another American Made car after this one.
The old saying” this is not your dad's Oldsmobile” sure holds true, my dad would have drive to Detroit (if the car would have made it) and kicked some butt.

I am glad the Oldsmobile’s days are numbered,

They can’t say I didn’t try to stay with an American car.
But this car has me to the end with over priced, over engineered, American Junk.

Opinions galore. That's fine if you dont think you'll buy another American car because of what happened to you with this car, but it's also a bit sad, because you're condemning the rest of the American market based on a bad experience with a manufacturer that is going out of business soon. Im not going to say import vehicles are bad, because many of them are great cars, however there are also lots of great American made cars, also.

[dsatt12]

<brace yourselves...>

Originally Posted by ILike2DriveCars

Opinions galore. That's fine if you dont think you'll buy another American car because of what happened to you with this car, but it's also a bit sad, because you're condemning the rest of the American market based on a bad experience with a manufacturer that is going out of business soon. Im not going to say import vehicles are bad, because many of them are great cars, however there are also lots of great American made cars, also.

Do you actually believe that there is a discernable difference in Oldsmobile from any of the other divisions of GM? Everything I have read about why Olds is being phased out has to do with a their design teams being tasked to compete with a loss of market share to foreign manufacturers; they failed. I don't think it had anything with Oldsmobile having having any worse (or better) track record for quality than the other divisions. GM plants build cars based on platform and common parts, not by any brand name. That being said, with only one other car sharing much in the way of components with the Aurora they have more than their fair share of issues. Low sales volume meant that less engineering work was put into fixing and/or redesigning problem areas. Every new platform has issues that usually get addressed in short order. Just wait and see about the current crop of GM pickups with their new powertrains for example.

Olds continued to lose sales due to a better value -and I think it is undeniable that Honda and Toyota were leaps and bounds ahead of GM (and all the other american manufacturers) in terms of quality and warranty back in the early 90s or so when Olds shifted direction to (try to) change their image.

The ONLY reason I own- and fairly happily I might add- my Aurora is it was DIRT CHEAP to buy used. I could get luxury features, ideal styling for my tastes and decent power in exchange for no resale value and a whole slew of fairly expensive problems. I do feel I got a better deal with the factors I mentioned rather than a midsize import that I'd have paid more for but likely had fewer troubles with, but there are no gaurantees there either with a used car. I am not a new car kind of guy, I'll take a well maintained 1 owner used car any day. In fact I pity the poor bastard that I bought my Aurora from; he took one doozie of a beating on the depreciation. I think it was to the tune of around 75-80% in five years, though I don't know exactly what he paid new.

It all comes down to what is offered at what price to me. My latest purchase was a 2001 Hyundai Sonata GLS for my wife. I paid $8500 for a nice, comfortable car with 40,000 miles of bumper to bumper warranty left on it. If I perceive a value, I would absolutely buy an american car. They just have more to compete with these days and the market shares show it. I don't think they have lost yet though- the americans have improved a lot in quality while there are signs Honda and Toyota may have been slipping in the last couple of years. I feel like I can get a better deal today than other times I've bought vehicles. Now if my health insurance wold just quit going up 15% per year...

[oldsdad]

dsatt12 very well said and I could have bought a Toyota Avalon instead of the Aurora but I wanted a car that could seat 5 comfortable and the Avalon just wouldnt do it and I would have paid 3 times as much. For me buying a 35k car for 5k with the ride and room of the Aurora just couldnt pass it up.I feel your pain on the Health insurance we were told that the first of the year ours was going from 45 a week to 104 a week ouchhh!

[Indy8]

I felt the same way dsatt12, just didn't think I would have to eat an entire engine in the deal. I'm still not 100% on the diagnosis but it appears I'm experiencing the backing out of headstuds leading to the deteriorating of the headgasket(s). Outrageous pressure in the cooling system has exploded two radiators so far but it does not overheat, so we drive it only locally with a towel wrapped around the cap and reservoir for when it pukes all over the place. At 73k miles, this situation is completely indefensible from any pro-American point of view. And it's not a freak or isolated incident, as is demonstrated by the whole Time-sert fix. Come close to perfecting your product before moving on to play catch-up with the foreign companies. There is something to be said in respect to quality of assembly, not just engineering as I stated in a previous post. Is it coincidence that certain Toyota and Honda models are built here now and the quality IS slipping?? And oldsdad, I'm really not picking on you....but my wife and I drove a then new '01 Avalon before buying the rora, and the backseat head and leg room was much larger than our cars, we just could'nt afford the "big Camry". And as for the used engine suggestion, you've got to be kidding?

[oldsdad]

Indy no problem this is a forum isnt it.Again if Iam looking at an avalon at 400 a month for 4 years or the aurora for 200 a month for 2 years I have to go for the price and the styleing of the aurora. I was wondering what is a time-sert I have worked with all kinds of alum. in the aerospace industry for over 30 years there are ways to fix bad and stripped threads in all materials. If you can R & R the heads yourself then maybe we can come up with a real fix for the head bolt problem let me know. As far as american quality goes well I have to agree with you that for the most part it has gone to hell, most employees dont care anymore and companies dont take care of the employee they take advantage of them.In my eyes why should a manager of people make millions with bonuses and stock options on top while the workers live week to week barely able to pay for health insurance but I wont go there could be days before I stop.Indy you have to love the high desert wife and I were both born and raised in so cal. lived in Hesperia for several years. Now living in Georgia what the hell happened here! 2 more years and our son will be out of High School and we will be back out west out of the humidity.
Have a Good Day everyone
Mike

[Indy8]

We are just on the other side of the "river" in Apple Valley, it's pretty nice. Winters are awesome, though don't like the real heat in July/August but it's a dry heat, right? We survive it every year. Time-sert is the brand name, it's just a nice version of a Heli-Coil. I have been wrenching on cars for necessity and hobby for several years(I'm 36)and still own a couple of older vehicles that I have to keep running, and really don't need another one. I have built a couple of engines and am a Snap-On customer with a four-car garage, so experience and tools/facilities are not the issue. I just wanted ONE car that I just put gas in and wash once a week. Boo hooo! That leaves me with having it done or dumping it as is, and taking the loss. The Time-sert/headgasket job would be around $4500 mostly due to powertrain module R/R. I told one place where I got an estimate that I understood the PT mod removal only took 90 minutes(per caddyinfo.com)and he just laughed and said he would only perform a new engine install anyway. A new 4.0 longblock is $5250 w/o tax and crate/shipping fees. How long will the new one last? Another 73k mi, 300k mi? What about all the problems owners on this site have had that I have not? Kinda makes you a little leary about spending that much cash on it. I know at this point market value is a moot subject, I look at it like I've got a near new $38k car that needs a $6k part. Just scared the rest of it is going to start falling apart way too soon, especially the electrical problems. Not just power mirrors not working anymore, but serious running issues. Now, the sentinel is the only item on the car that's not functioning properly. The rest of the car is like my avatar, polished and near perfect. Thanks to all for letting me cry about it here.

[meatpimp]

Originally Posted by Indy8

And as for the used engine suggestion, you've got to be kidding?

Why would I be kidding? It doesn't make sense to put a new, $6k motor in a car that is not worth more than $6k, $8k tops... But, the boneyards are filled with Aurora motors. Why? because for the most part the 4.0 N* motors are stout. That means there is little market for the used motors. There are tons of Auroras running with 150k miles on them that have had no engine work.

So, buing a 60k mile motor from a boneyard for $1500, installing it in a weekend and driving it for another 60k+ miles seems like the most cost-effective and sane thing to do... unless you like throwing $6k at a problem with no chance of ever recovering it in resale...

[Indy8]

Okay, I understand your point. In two more months the car will be worth 10 cents anyway so that doesn't concern me. That's a lot of work to roll the dice on someone else's junk. I know the way 99 out of 100 people take care of their engines. "Change oil now, what oil"? Really, it's not so much the cost, it's the danger of the same thing happening or getting a great engine and start having all the problems others are having with the accessories.