Initial-D Realism

[LanEvo]

First Off, I would like to say this is not ment to bea FLAME post. It's nothing like that at all, it's just a comment on what's real and what's not.

I made this thread because this topic seemed to be dissrupting other threads. So anways here I am to share my views.

First, I love Initial-D the manga is great and a good place to geta person hooked on cars, they you use very modern terms, and explain drifting very well. Also it is a very good representation of what really does go on in the Japanese mountain passes. After all Initial-D is roughly based on true mountain pass illeagal drifting.

But that is just the problem, it roughly based on it, not true. This is wehre Initial-D fails many people. Many of the things that happen are just not plausible, we would like to think they are, but some situations are just not, I don't care how good a driver you are (takumi being the one in question) But you won't head out to your first race and beat the second best racer on a team. Or learn how to control understeer in the matter of a few turns (gumtape death match). It just will not happen, I mean the kid delivers tofu, he doesn't know the first thing about racing, i understand some people will have the innate ability to drive better tahn others, but how in hell did he learn to make a pass on another car, keep pace with another car, or any techniques that has to do with head on racing (as opposed to time trials). I will continue in another post.

[LanEvo]

heh my thoughts can't be contained in one post.

I believe in the other thread the question was wether, an AE86, could beat a skyline. Now let's for get most of the specs right now, just focus on one thing, horsepower, 120hp vs. upwards of 400hp. I'm sorry but if that 400hp driver at least has a driver liscence and can see over the wheel, he will most likely win. Now the brakes get down? In one race? I don't care how much you push your car, your brakes aren't gonna be screwed up that bad. And if someone decides to say, but maybe he raced a lot before that, no Japanese driver that is serious about racing is going to go in a race without spending that whole day reviewing his/her car over and over again. Now if the 86 driver had about 30 years of experience under his belt (Bunta i guess) I would then start thinking of it to be possible that the 86 might win. Remember this is before Takumi's car was tuned.

Also another thing that Dorikin was trying to get at was that Initial-D is an anime. You diehard fans have to realize that, it's only a cartoon, i've seen some kids finish watching it and think they are experts on drifting from HEARING those techniques, (i'm not implying that anyone here is), If you read a cook book, you will cook, if you read a an instructin manual you will understand, BUT if you read a book on swimming and try to swim, you will drown man. This is what Initial-D does, you understand all these drifting techniques, but if you dare go out and try them on a mountain pass, you might as well tell your insurance company to cough up the cash ahead of time, and you may wanna call up your life insurance company too.

[LanEvo]

Sorry for making you all read so much

I now some of you will disagree with what i put up here, and some of you will try to explain just how good takumi is. Well when Takumi comes and posts in this convo how good he is then I will believe him . . . oh what's that i hear "But, he's just a cartoon!"

PRECISELEY

Ill leave it at that, i want to say a couple things to finish tho, I am a fan of initial D, I've wasted loads of money on arcade stage, I have special stage on my PS2 (hahhaha had to guess what all the japanese said) tho my borther took it to his house *grrr*. I have watched all three stages and have them all on VCD, burned them so now iwatch it on my DVD player. So I am not a hater of initial-d, i love it, i just think you have to know when to draw the line between it and real racing.

Once again this is not a FLAME post, it is simply a comment on the realism of Initial-D

[Harlock]

I agree with you completly. i am also an avid fan of the initial d anime and espicially the manga. I feel it is the type of thing where you have to suspend disbelief. Kind of like in the star wars movies where there is sound in space or horror movies where the killer walks a 4 sec. 100 yard dash. I realize that it is not real and accept that, but it is still fun as hell to watch. The other thing with the skyline is if this guy is so good don't you think he would realize the downfalls of his car and do something about it. Like you said he is obviusly a very exprienced driver and would know to invest in some ss brake lines to control brake fade. Good post. You have at least one person that agrees with you.

[NSX-R-SSJ20K]

I'd like to refer to best motoring right now.

Keiichi Tsyuchiya's Truneo has 170ps which is a little under 160hp and he beats high powered vehicles quite easily on the downhill and he probably is the best driver at best motoring.

He also says Real men race downhill

Its better to beat higher powered vehicles with a lower powered car.

and let us not forget that they do take the piss out of initial D at some points only a little bit.

I wouldn't have thought that a trueno would beat Skylines and stuff but it seems to do so on the Touge.

[Harlock]

I agree it is possible to beat a higher powered car with a lower powered one in the right conditions. I compete regularly in a local auto-x and know small relatively low power cars can be as fast or quicker than much faster veichles, however, can you really compare a man who has been racing for decades to an 18 year old kid. There really is no comparisson. I also believe we are failing to take into account that this is all occuring at night where it is much more diffucult drive simply because there is a reduced ability to see.

[peter i]

You must watching Keiichi Tsyuchiya's Demo video "Only FR" , to see how he drive an AE86 . (945kg)

When drifting downhill , you put yours life in to big risk , so small power car have better control over high power mechine .

PS: Sure an animetion can add some "crazy" happening to making it more actractive to watch

[LanEvo]

Well it all comes down to the fact that it's an anime all over again, remember me saying

Now if the 86 driver had about 30 years of experience under his belt (Bunta i guess) I would then start thinking of it to be possible that the 86 might win

I know that it is possible espically for the drift king himself, Keiichi Tsyuchiya. But what I am saying is that due to the nature of the show, A CARTOON, Takumi could have turned around and use his ass cheeks to steer and he still would have won the race. It is not Takumi's skill that decides these racers, it is the writers who sit down at a desk and design the manga.

Initial-D is not real life real life. I'll say it again, sure some people have the naturaul born ability to drive better than others, i understand that. THough there is no way that an 18 year old with 160 hp, in his . . hmm i believe it was his second race, is going to beat the leader of a racing team with 400+hp (we don't know how his skyline was tuned).

[peter i]

The Fact inside the story.........

He drive downhill in the same location for 5 year (every morning) , he push him self to go fastest ,so he can get some rest before go to school.

ps: Human mind are fresh in the morning ... (easy to memo..)

after he get use to high speeding , the danger & fear is gone ...
the "traning" become his motion for every morning . it's autometic !

[tegusdrifter]

Now if the 86 driver had about 30 years of experience under his belt (Bunta i guess) I would then start thinking of it to be possible that the 86 might win

One must keep in mind that Takumi had been racing every day for the last five years. That's 1826 days of experience, this is more than 30 years of saturday night drifting experience. In Japan it's common to see good cars get beaten by underpowered ones on downhill races. The mountain passes there are very steep and dangerous. This makes most of the races very plausible. The skyline did crash after all.

[Maxy]

<--- n00b to these forums but im gonna post my opinion anyway.

I find it hard to believe that anyone thinks the stuff done on initial D is real, it is a cartoon and im pretty sure anyoen over the age of 3 can see the difference between a cartoon and real life.

Initial D has a huge following because it is fun, it is enjoyable to watch and to play, noone goes around saying 'man i can drift my 86 straight past that noob in his FD' its just not right.

Remember the days of mortal combat and such? well i didnt see kids running aroudn trying to do crazy moves on adults.

[Fliquer]

In real touge battles, pretty much the WHOLE COURSE is turns. Almost NO straights. Now consider the fact that a 86 with suspension and tire mods can safely maintain a higher cornering speed than even a RX-7 FD.

If the course is 99% corners, and the 86 can corner faster than a FD, why would you say the 86 has a small chance of winning? The only problem here is the fact that initial D has portrayed the courses as having a lot of straights.

Im not saying the kind of driving in Initial D is possible. In fact that kind of drifting is actually nearly IMPOSSIBLE - to sucessfully execute a perfect drift in every corner of a course is just not reality.

[LanEvo]

Thanks i fianly got some feed back, i will give my views and reasons a bit later, but rite now i gotta go BBQ some pork chops so bare with me, i'll be back tonite.

An btw nomatter what is said in this thread i just hope everyone knows like the first thing i said in this thread this is not ment to flame initial D

[Layla's Keeper]

There is something about ink and paint that makes you wonder about the reality of a series, isn't there?

Did the series exaggerate? Naturally. After all, if it was one-hundred percent real it wouldn't have been very entertaining to the mass public.

There is reality buried in the series. The courses are well depicted, the cars (save for the outrageousness of the tofu-shop 'Roku) are fairly accurate, and the characters are generally people you'd expect to meet in everyday life.

LanEvo, you're right. It was a bunch of screenwriters who decided when, where, and how Takumi won each race. That's television.

But you know what, I like my TV, especially my anime, and I'll gladly take a bit of fantasy over the new reality drek anyday.

[LanEvo]

MMMMMM Mighty good pork chops

First off, i don't mean to degrade you Tegus, but pray tell, how do you know what happens on the underground racing in Japan.

In Japan it's common to see good cars get beaten by underpowered ones on downhill races

A down hill race certainly does even up the hp differnece, but at a max of 50 hp not much more.

Next i'll correct you on this statement.

One must keep in mind that Takumi had been racing every day for the last five years.

The point where you mention racing, makes this statement a complete fraud. Takumi has experience drifting, but he has no experience what so ever with racing. Ask anyone here who Autocrosses. A time trial when your all alone, is completley different from a race with other people on the track. I mentioned this when i first opened the thread. He has no clue about racing.

Now Fliquer, you said a tough course is composed mainly of turns. Have you watched actaul racing clips of drifting? Or even Wanga? They are not, they are typicaly composed of three to six difficult turns that will require drifting, those turns make it a drifting course, the rest of turns are impractical to use drifting on. That is why most drifting in the world (including Japan) is kept off the mountains and on the tracks where it is possible to use drifting techniques more often.

Now it's not that I am refusing to believe that it's possible for an 86 to win, it most certainly is possible, just highly unlikely. You all treat it like it's the car of god's. Well it's not. Take the anime for example, you see how people ridicule a person for using an 86 to race. Well that would happen in real life. They are outdated, an FD or FC has superior . . . everything. the only thing that the 86 tops them on is it's weight, but nowadays that no longer matters, as with proper engine management components, this is very easy to even out.

Another thing i thought of (as people bring up matters of cornering), some might bring up the topic that an NA engine will corner better than an FI engine. First tell me why? The fact is when you stop accelerating, the turbo stops spooling, making for no or very little induction. Making it an NA engine for a very short time. Espically when talking about an FD or FC, a rotary engine. Then when it comes to the straights, the turbo will leave the NA behind, note the turbo will lose some times in the corners, though it will take the corner typicaly the same way.

I'll say it on more time IT IS A CARTOON IT IS NOT REAL, IT IS ALL UP TO WRITERS AS TO WHAT HAPPENS! TAKUMI HAS NO SKILL!

If you have more thoughts post away, i'll be glad to here them i love crticsm as long as it's not constructive and doesn't put down anyone.