2000 fuel injector

toughguy5 · #1 07-31-2013, 07:35 PM

hi, can anybody point me in the right direction to find out how to replace the number 2 injector. I did all the trouble shooting I can think of..switching plugs, wires. checking Maf sensors, unless I am missing something I think its injector.

this is the CEL code...Cylinder #2 Misfire Detected

12Ounce · #2 07-31-2013, 08:29 PM

Just for information... the #2 cyl is the middle one.... on the "backside" (near the firewall) of the engine.

scubacat · #3 07-31-2013, 09:23 PM

Check that coil pack though. That's a MUCH more common failure item that will trigger a misfire.

12Ounce · #4 08-01-2013, 03:55 AM

I agree with scubacat ... the coil-pack is high on the list. Of course, you can switch the spark cables on the coil, end-to-end, that feeds #2 cyl plug and see if the code "relocates" ... this confirms it is the coil.

toughguy5 · #5 08-01-2013, 04:28 PM

I switched plugs 2 and 3, same code. I switched spark plug wires 2 and 3 same code. I am at a loss here, the only thing I can think of is the injector....

scubacat · #6 08-01-2013, 04:43 PM

not sure what you mean when you say switched wires... you just swapped the connectors on one end or both? I'm still betting on the coil pack. Coil pack failure is very common; injectors failing on these not so much. I think, in this case, you'd want to test by swapping #2 with #6 to keep the firing order intact, but others may have a different opinion.

#2 and #6 are the middle connectors on the pack.

toughguy5 · #7 08-01-2013, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scubacat

not sure what you mean when you say switched wires... you just swapped the connectors on one end or both? I'm still betting on the coil pack. Coil pack failure is very common; injectors failing on these not so much. I think, in this case, you'd want to test by swapping #2 with #6 to keep the firing order intact, but others may have a different opinion.

#2 and #6 are the middle connectors on the pack.

ok, will try this, ty.

toughguy5 · #8 08-01-2013, 06:38 PM

just checked the coil pack and it good,spark, ohms are up to spec. bad injector? how to check for this, and how to replace.

just checked out injectors, all six have 12.9 ohms. now after this I am getting codes for multiply cylinder misfires, and now Cylinder #3 is showing up WTF could it be.... still can it be a bad coil pack?

scubacat · #9 08-01-2013, 07:43 PM

Yes, I still say coil pack. The only way to test that for sure is to replace it. You can't test it with a voltmeter that way; it's the tiny hairline cracks that cause "arcing" in the electrical pulses. Buy it from a local store and hold on to the receipt so you can return if it doesn't fix the problem.

wiswind · #10 08-01-2013, 07:59 PM

It is still possible to have the coil pack cause this.
The coil pack is 3 coils sealed in an epoxy body.
The epoxy can develop a crack, through which the high voltage can arc....and it can be intermittent.....giving you a spark, with an intermittent failure.
Why 3 coils for 6 cylinders?,,, The Windstar, like many vehicles uses a "wasted spark" system, each time a coil fires, it sends a spark to 2 cylinders, ONLY 1 cylinder is going to fire, the other cylinder is not ready to fire......as in not with the gas/air mixture in it.
It is possible for the computer to not get the correct cylinder for the misfire.
Not common, but can happen....or you can have misfire on more than 1 cylinder, and the computer is catching just one of them. It takes a couple misfires for the computer to latch onto it as a fault.
A vacuum leak can cause a misfire on 1 or 2 cylinders......as in air leaking in close to 1 cylinder (upper intake manifold issue (isolator bolt TSB for 1999 and newer) possible).

I have kept my Alldata subscription current for the 1996 Windstar.
That is the only year that I can see, so unless they changed this (which I would guess they did not)......
The secondary (high voltage side) outputs of each coil are matched up as follows.
Cylinders #1 and 5
Cylinders #3 and 4
Cylinders #2 and 6

As far as the coil pack.....if you are going to do the work of removing it to check it, I would go ahead and install a new one.....it is possible for you to not be able to physically see the crack in the body.
The coil pack issue was more common on newer, 1999 and newer windstars than the older ones like I had.
This is from reading the posts from folks over the years.

My 1996 Windstar had issues with the fuel injectors building up junk on the spray end and causing what you describe. It does not seem to have been so much of an issue on the newer windstars as it was with mine.
I tried MANY different fuel additives to clean it up....and the ONLY one that would work for me was Berryman's Chemtool B-12 in the metal can.
This is sold in many auto part stores.

toughguy5 · #11 08-01-2013, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wiswind

It is still possible to have the coil pack cause this.
The coil pack is 3 coils sealed in an epoxy body.
The epoxy can develop a crack, through which the high voltage can arc....and it can be intermittent.....giving you a spark, with an intermittent failure.
Why 3 coils for 6 cylinders?,,, The Windstar, like many vehicles uses a "wasted spark" system, each time a coil fires, it sends a spark to 2 cylinders, ONLY 1 cylinder is going to fire, the other cylinder is not ready to fire......as in not with the gas/air mixture in it.
It is possible for the computer to not get the correct cylinder for the misfire.
Not common, but can happen....or you can have misfire on more than 1 cylinder, and the computer is catching just one of them. It takes a couple misfires for the computer to latch onto it as a fault.
A vacuum leak can cause a misfire on 1 or 2 cylinders......as in air leaking in close to 1 cylinder (upper intake manifold issue (isolator bolt TSB for 1999 and newer) possible).

I have kept my Alldata subscription current for the 1996 Windstar.
That is the only year that I can see, so unless they changed this (which I would guess they did not)......
The secondary (high voltage side) outputs of each coil are matched up as follows.
Cylinders #1 and 5
Cylinders #3 and 4
Cylinders #2 and 6

As far as the coil pack.....if you are going to do the work of removing it to check it, I would go ahead and install a new one.....it is possible for you to not be able to physically see the crack in the body.
The coil pack issue was more common on newer, 1999 and newer windstars than the older ones like I had.
This is from reading the posts from folks over the years.

My 1996 Windstar had issues with the fuel injectors building up junk on the spray end and causing what you describe. It does not seem to have been so much of an issue on the newer windstars as it was with mine.
I tried MANY different fuel additives to clean it up....and the ONLY one that would work for me was Berryman's Chemtool B-12 in the metal can.
This is sold in many auto part stores.

thanks Wiswind, going to get a coil pack tomorrow, keeping fingers crossed..

toughguy5 · #12 08-02-2013, 05:37 PM

ok, just spent money we don't have on a coil pack, installed it and now, I get

P0302 and now I get p0303, NOW WTF IS GOING ON !!!!! HELP ME......LOL

wires are ok, plugs are ok, coil is new. switched spark plug wires and still

same cylinder #2, switched spark plugs and still same cylinder #2. deleted

codes, start van P0302 comes up only. I got pissed and removed neg cable

to reset computer.... ill try anything now.... the van is un-drivable. and we need this van...help.

12Ounce · #13 08-02-2013, 07:56 PM

Did you try switching cable-ends (not the entire cables), just the cable-ends at the coil pack ..... between the cable-terminals for cylinders #2 and #6? If this does not change the code from cyl #2 to cyl #6 get back to us.

toughguy5 · #14 08-02-2013, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12Ounce

Did you try switching cable-ends (not the entire cables), just the cable-ends at the coil pack ..... between the cable-terminals for cylinders #2 and #6? If this does not change the code from cyl #2 to cyl #6 get back to us.

just did compression test, cylinder #2 3 times 180psi.

since I removed battery cable. no codes are coming up, but van runs the same, and when I put in drive engine stalls, stumbles and chugs. so I cannot drive van at all.

12Ounce · #15 08-03-2013, 03:35 AM

Huh! A compression test is meaningful if done on all cylinders ... with all plugs removed ... and with the throttle plate blocked/held open.

Did you try the cable-end swap I suggested?

If so, and the compression test turns nothing up ... it is indeed time to turn some attention to the injectors. Remove them all, (clean injector bases first, to keep crap from falling into combustion chamber) but keep up with which injector goes to which cylinder. DO NOT SOAK THE INJECTOR BODIES, but give each injector-inlet a sideways blast with aerosol brake cleaner. Mount all injectors upright on a work bench and drop a bit of clean motor oil, or injector cleaner, into each injector inlet ... let stand for a few hours. Reinstall injectors but swap locations .... bank #1 to bank #2. Restart and read new code.

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