Ashcroft wants Patriot Act widened

[Milliardo]

http://www.msnbc.com/news/922454.asp?vts=060520031620

Like I warned before and I'll say again, Bush and his buddies will turn the U.S. into one big police state. They're on the march, and have I not stated before they'll trot out anything to justify such acts? See Ashcroft do the very thing I have stated. Yes, they will justify anything for security.

[igor@af]

This is getting a bit scary..... Ashcroft is following in on McCarthy's footsteps....

[jon@af]

I can see it now HEADLINE: BILL OF RIGHTS DEMINISHED TO NOTHING; MARTIAL LAW INSTITUTED.

[igor@af]

Originally posted by ILike2DriveCars
I can see it now HEADLINE: BILL OF RIGHTS DEMINISHED TO NOTHING; MARTIAL LAW INSTITUTED.

[freakray]

Makes you wonder what ever happened to the 'Land of the free' :o

[Toksin]

Originally posted by freakray
Makes you wonder what ever happened to the 'Land of the free' :o

The what?

Pssst, come to NZ

[igor@af]

Yogs, Pick -

do even you guys agree with this?

[jon@af]

Originally posted by Toksin



Pssst, come to NZ

Oh trust me, Ive actually been planning to. New Zealand or Australia, one of the two.

[freakray]

Originally posted by Toksin



Pssst, come to NZ

Still got that spare room we spoke about Dave?

[taranaki]

But the law is there to protect you.....you have nothing to fear if you are a law-abiding citizen........right? Just keep one eye on the goalposts,because they are shifting all the time.I can't help wondering how long it will be before publishing 'unpatriotic' material will be officially frowned upon.It would help perhaps if people discarded the notion that terrorists are all AK-47 waving arabs on suicide missions....would the Oklahoma City bombing have been prevented by the Patriot act?I don't think so.Unless you cannot define what you are looking for,any law to allow you to go looking will always erode the rights to privacy of an unacceptably high number of decent and honest citizens.Sadly,this kind of law provides a window of opportunity for all manner of government agencies to rifle through your personal life using the pretext of 'patriotism and security' when their true purpose may be something less than legitimate.

[freakray]

Originally posted by taranaki
But the law is there to protect you.....you have nothing to fear if you are a law-abiding citizen........right? Just keep one eye on the goalposts,because they are shifting all the time.I can't help wondering how long it will be before publishing 'unpatriotic' material will be officially frowned upon.It would help perhaps if people discarded the notion that terrorists are all AK-47 waving arabs on suicide missions....would the Oklahoma City bombing have been prevented by the Patriot act?I don't think so.Unless you cannot define what you are looking for,any law to allow you to go looking will always erode the rights to privacy of an unacceptably high number of decent and honest citizens.Sadly,this kind of law provides a window of opportunity for all manner of government agencies to rifle through your personal life using the pretext of 'patriotism and security' when their true purpose may be something less than legitimate.

I can imagine that this new law would entail assuming everyone guilty until proven innocent though, giving them the excuse to do what they want.
I can also imagine that foreign residents of the USA will get the extra little bit of scrutineering on the premise of 'potential terrorist'.

I know I may be blowing things out a little, but I am just laying out a few random thoughts I would like to hear other people's thoughts on.

[Pick]

Originally posted by igor@af
Yogs, Pick -

do even you guys agree with this?

Here's my response:
WASHINGTON, June 5 — Attorney General John Ashcroft urged Congress on Thursday to expand the USA Patriot Act to permit the government to hold more suspects indefinitely and to extend the death penalty to more people accused of terrorist crimes. He also said the law, which critics say is eroding citizens’ legitimate rights, needs to be expanded to allow charges against anyone who helps or works with suspected terrorist groups as “material supporters.”

How is this eroding citizen's legitimate rights? They are talking about detaining foreign terrorists! And anyone who helps or funds a terrorist group is guilty of treason, so the "expansion" that was mentioned in this article is the same as the laws we have now, with more emphasis. Terrorist supporters deserve to die a traitor's death.

[Pick]

Originally posted by taranaki
Sadly,this kind of law provides a window of opportunity for all manner of government agencies to rifle through your personal life using the pretext of 'patriotism and security' when their true purpose may be something less than legitimate.

Something less legitimate such as?

[Pick]

Originally posted by Milliardo
http://www.msnbc.com/news/922454.asp?vts=060520031620

Like I warned before and I'll say again, Bush and his buddies will turn the U.S. into one big police state. They're on the march, and have I not stated before they'll trot out anything to justify such acts? See Ashcroft do the very thing I have stated. Yes, they will justify anything for security.

:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

Yes, that damn Bush its trotting out MY citizen's rights!


But not anymore than the left, who wants my free speach, right to defend myelf, and the right to my property.

[YogsVR4]

Originally posted by igor@af
Yogs, Pick -

do even you guys agree with this?

Which part? The one that says he wants to expand the act? Then yes, its clear he does.

Do I agree that the US is turning into a police state? That will only happen when the government comes and takes the guns away.

Do I agree that my rights have been eroded? When the AFLCIO is declared illegal I’ll believe that. The tax system here erodes more the Patriot Act ever could.

Do I agree in expanding the death penalty? Yes!

Do I agree that Milardo's assessments have no merit? Considering his track record of being wrong every assessment he’s made then, yes, I agree to that too.

Do I agree that the government bears watching and dissent is welcome? Then I agree to that too.

Do I agree that some of you guys are "Chicken Littles"? Then I agree to that too.


What I don’t agree with is comparing Ashcroft to McCarthy. I would also remind people that standing in front of congress spouting your views does not mean that something will become laws. I will also remind you that Chicken Little’s crying about the sky falling is getting quite tiresome.