2000 windstar 3.8 transmission oil level high when cold

[gus fairley]

My 2000 3.8 windstar shows the proper transmission oil level when it is hot,
at the top of the crosshatch marks,--but when the transmission is cold
the oil level is about 4-6 inches up the dipstick, it is now banging into 2nd
gear, and the od light is flashing, but the van is driving fine in od.
Could one of those oil feed pipes on the underside of the trans be leaking
back past a seal, or could the thermostatic fluid control valve be stuck open.
Thanks gus fairley!!

[12Ounce]

Originally Posted by gus fairley

....., or could the thermostatic fluid control valve be stuck open......?....!!

....could be the fluid control valve. Of course, the level is only meaningful if the fluid is warm, and the engine idling.

But if the fluid is not flowing down to the pump inlet properly ... the pump may be starving. How is the fluid for cleanliness? Have you dropped the pan lately?

[gus fairley]

Hi 12ounce,
gus here, long story short,
Trans started slipping in od on way to toronto, got back to london, used 2 code readers,
said bad VSS, put in new one, changed oil in the pan and the filter, this was 2 weeks ago,
I had the battery disconnected overnight.
Now the od works fine, no slipping, but bangs into 2nd and od light flashes after about 10 miles, and when cold the oil level in the trans is about 4 to 6 inches up the dipstick, but when hot the level is perfect. I have since found out that what I changed was the output shaft speed sensor located on the drivers side slightly above and to the left of the drivers
side front axle--Ford Dealer----so how did it cure the slipping?????
Have a great weekend my friend!!
Gus!

[wiswind]

I would try to read the code(s) again.
The flashing OD light is indicating some failure is being sensed.
You are not the first person to get the 2 sensors confused.
The Output shaft sensor (aka Turbine Speed Sensor, TSS) is measuring the speed of the shaft that is coming OUT of the torque converter......
That shaft goes INTO the different gear selects of the transmission.
I know that the location seems like it would be measuring the drive shaft coming out of the transaxle.....that that is not what it is measuring.

The Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS) is on the back side of the transmission.....very roughly the middle of the vehicle.
It is a bear to change.
If you have the mechanical speedometer......the speedometer cable connects to it.
If you have the electronic speedometer......then a wire goes to it.
It is pretty much above the catalytic converter that is below the back side of the motor/transaxle.
It is held in place by 1 bolt and would be easy to change, except for the catalytic converter and heat shield.
If you buy a replacement part from the FORD dealer (in person or online) make SURE to use the Vehicle Identification Number (VIN) to look up the correct part as there are several different parts that were used.....and they are NOT interchangeable.

[gus fairley]

Gus here,
I did the codes again, same thing, so I disconnected the battery overnight, next day took a drive,no flashing light overdrive perfect.
I found out that high trans oil level on dipstick when cold is quite normal.
went to a trans shop, got the tests done, no electronic problems found,
but it still sometimes bangs into 2nd, trans shop said it is an internal problem,
could it be the valve body, or the low to intermediate servo.
will keep motoring for now.
Thanks
Gus!

[12Ounce]

Originally Posted by gus fairley

.....
I found out that high trans oil level on dipstick when cold is quite normal.
......

I'm not sure what you are saying here. If you mean the level is high when the engine is cold and not running ... then, yes, the fluid will be high. It will be high whenever the engine is not running!

If you are checking with the engine idling (correct way), and find the level higher when cold than when hot .... then I am mystified!

[gus fairley]

Hi there,
sorry I took so long to get back to you, you are correct, oil level is high when trans is cold and engine is off, but the level is perfect when the trans is hot and the engine is idling. the trans is still banging into 2nd gear, but not as bad as before, other than that the van runs great.
Thanks for your help my friend,
Gus!!

[Windstartled]

Originally Posted by 12Ounce

I'm not sure what you are saying here. If you mean the level is high when the engine is cold and not running ...

I think it is worth mentioning here that the owners manual is misleading regarding this issue. It states that a lower than normal dipstick reading of trans fluid level is to be expected when the engine is off and cold, but that the fluid will "expand" to a normal level under normal running temps. This may be true of some models but on the Windstar the opposite occurs. This could prompt some owners to draw some of the fluid to a dangerously low level. IMHO Ford should be more clear on the matter by simply stating that *any* level reading when the engine is not running should be disregarded, instead of hinting that it should be lower than normal.

[12Ounce]

The text writers probably confused information about the engine oil and the tranny fluid. I think the text writers are given notes from engineers and afterwards the engineers never do any proof reading. Therefore, Ford's documentation can be very stupid. (I'm sorry, there is no other word that really works like "stupid".) I could point to several examples, but two really impressed me:

Escort glovebox manuals: ... in the mid nineties listed a particular lamp to be used inside the cabin ... that did not exist. This typo that was repeated for several years.

In the early editions of the '99 Windstar shop manual, there was a drawing used showing the proper tightening sequence for the upper intake manifold. The same drawing is used over and over. Problem: The drawing must have been an early proposed layout that was not changed when engineering made updates ... the number of screws shown was off by the count of 2.

[Windstartled]

Originally Posted by 12Ounce

The text writers probably confused information about the engine oil and the tranny fluid. I think the text writers are given notes from engineers and afterwards the engineers never do any proof reading.

Very likely indeed, also I noticed that owners manuals contain a certain amount of generic text that is repeated over decades and is not always relevant to the model it was supposedly written for.

As for the shop manual I wholly agree it is not the best written or best indexed in the business and can be confusing even to Ford mechanics. Personally I mostly refer to the WM for material not covered by Haynes, and keeping in mind that it was written for dealers, not independent or backyard mechanics. This is the reason why when I see instructions that say "replace part x" in the workshop manual I often translate it into "inspect part x" instead. Much less costly when you don't have barrels of parts at your disposal.