2003 t/c

[valente]

my wife has a 2003 town and country with 108,000 miles on it.with the 3.8,and today she went out to start it but it wouldnt start.so i had to go out (in 90 something degree weather)and see what was the problem.it wouldnt start for me either,so i took the hose that goes from the airfilter to the throttle body and i open and closed it a couple of times,then i went and took one of the spark plug wires out to see if i had spark,so i told my wife to try and start it,and it started.
she went out there for about 5-7 minutes trying to start it and it wouldnt start,i tried to start it for a couple more minutes and it wouldnt start for me either.any ideas what could of prevented it from starting at first.thank you

[Alphabravo]

Aside from the obvious of checkeing the fuel guage, do you know how to do the "key dance" and check to see if there are any codes?

If you don't know how, just search this forum.

If memory servese me right, here it is: Turn the key to the "on" position but do not start, then off, then on, then off then on and leave it on. The service engine light should then begin to flash. The first code should be 12, which is one flash then a pause then two flashes. Then a longer pause and then the beginning of the next code. The final code should be 55 (five flashes the a pause then 5 more flashes).

55 just means end of codes.

I am going off memory here so if this is not right someone please correct me.

This should help you get started.
Good luck.

[RIP]

First, it's turning over/cranking/rotating but there's no ignition/won't run correct?

The list of possibilities is long. Here's a few:

No fuel > Put your ear down near the fuel tank then have someone turn the key to run. You should hear the pump turn on momentarily then turn off. Try it several times. If you can hear it then at least you know the pump does run. Another test is to depress the stem in the fuel test port (cold engine) on the fuel rail. Engine should be off. Fuel should spirt out and not dribble. This proves the pump is producing pressure. Connecting a fuel pressure gauge to the test port would be best. Look for 55 PSI.

No spark > You had that handled. Did you see spark?

Crankshaft or camshaft sensor signal missing > If the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) doesn't see one or both signals, the engine will crank all day, just won't start. The PCM is the engine computer. Without that signal, power to the ignition coil, fuel injectors, fuel pump and O2 sensors is lost. A failed sensor should turn on the SES light and set a code but many times they don't.

[valente]

Originally Posted by Alphabravo

Aside from the obvious of checkeing the fuel guage, do you know how to do the "key dance" and check to see if there are any codes?

If you don't know how, just search this forum.

If memory servese me right, here it is: Turn the key to the "on" position but do not start, then off, then on, then off then on and leave it on. The service engine light should then begin to flash. The first code should be 12, which is one flash then a pause then two flashes. Then a longer pause and then the beginning of the next code. The final code should be 55 (five flashes the a pause then 5 more flashes).

55 just means end of codes.

I am going off memory here so if this is not right someone please correct me.

This should help you get started.
Good luck.

thanks for the reply will try it soon

[valente]

Originally Posted by RIP

First, it's turning over/cranking/rotating but there's no ignition/won't run correct?

The list of possibilities is long. Here's a few:

No fuel > Put your ear down near the fuel tank then have someone turn the key to run. You should hear the pump turn on momentarily then turn off. Try it several times. If you can hear it then at least you know the pump does run. Another test is to depress the stem in the fuel test port (cold engine) on the fuel rail. Engine should be off. Fuel should spirt out and not dribble. This proves the pump is producing pressure. Connecting a fuel pressure gauge to the test port would be best. Look for 55 PSI.

No spark > You had that handled. Did you see spark?

Crankshaft or camshaft sensor signal missing > If the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) doesn't see one or both signals, the engine will crank all day, just won't start. The PCM is the engine computer. Without that signal, power to the ignition coil, fuel injectors, fuel pump and O2 sensors is lost. A failed sensor should turn on the SES light and set a code but many times they don't.

at first it was turning over but it wouldnt start.the van starts right up now,after i did the throttle body and spark test.and the gas gauge shows more than a 1/4 tank.just dont know what happened at first when it didint whant to start.the wife had just gotten back from the fourth of july vacation she had.drove all the way down to kansas and back with no problems.then the van sat there for a couple of days till she tried to start it and this happened.anything that you guys think i should check for or replace now that its running.thank you

[RIP]

Ok, now that it's clear it is now starting consistantly I wouldn't do anything. If you have to, look in the area of what you disturbed just before you got it to start. You could get a spray cleaner and clean the throttle body. Check electrical connections in that area. The plug wire won't be your problem. If it pops up again do the key dance and read the codes off your odometer. Might not hurt to do it now.

If you have consistance starting problems after it sits a while you may be looking at a fuel leak, probably a leaking injector. The fuel system is always pressurised to aid smooth starting. A leak depressurises the system.

[valente]

will do the key dance this week and let you guys know if i got any codes.
thanks again

[valente]

ok,this is the code that it showed (p1388)
i did this 3 or 4 times waiting for the check engine light to come on and could not see anything.then i looked down to where the display for the milage is and thats where it showed the code.
thank you

[RIP]

On 4th gen vans as you found out, you read the codes off the digital odometer display and not the flashing SES light.

The code means you had a malfunction in the automatic shutdown relay circuit (ASD). If the PCM does not see the cam or crank sensor signal while starting or running, it turns off the ground to the ASD relay coil. The relay contacts open cutting power to the ignition coil, fuel injectors and O2 sensors killing the engine. The code indicates the circuit controlling the ASD relay or the relay itself had a problem.

If your problem returns swap the ASD relay with another identical relay in the fuse panel (IPM).

[valente]

Originally Posted by RIP

On 4th gen vans as you found out, you read the codes off the digital odometer display and not the flashing SES light.

The code means you had a malfunction in the automatic shutdown relay circuit (ASD). If the PCM does not see the cam or crank sensor signal while starting or running, it turns off the ground to the ASD relay coil. The relay contacts open cutting power to the ignition coil, fuel injectors and O2 sensors killing the engine. The code indicates the circuit controlling the ASD relay or the relay itself had a problem.

If your problem returns swap the ASD relay with another identical relay in the fuse panel (IPM).

will do,thank you

[valente]

the problem returned,i swaped the ASD relay with one bellow it,but that didnt help.didnt have time to take a good look at it.have to go to work.i will check and see if i have spark when i get back.anything else that i should check for besides the ASD relay.thank you
i just asked the wife to do the check engine light check and she said it showed p1684 and the other one.i will check it tomorrow just to be sure

[valente]

i just got time to check it and it does show the p1684 and the p1388.my wife was talking to a friend of hers and he said to check the coil is there a way to test the coil to see if is good.or what do you guys think could be wrong.thank you

[valente]

well,i found out what the p1684 code is
(The battery has been disconnected within the last 50 starts)
that happen cause before she left i cleaned the battery posts.so this one is clear,but i still cant get it to start