'92 lesabre R12 A/C out of gas since a year

[feniks]

hi guys,

have a question about A/C system (original, no conversion to 134a) and since it's expensive or impossible to get old freon type nowadays i never bothered with repairing the a/c on this car. it has some leaks, but radiator for A/C was replaced 4 years ago and system was able to hold cooling efficiency for a year or two after each refill in a shop that still had R12.

I recently learned that there is still a R12 gas equivalent (Freeze 12) being sold (e.g. at amazon) and is the direct fit for old R12 A/C systems.

I found this:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...ZGVKTWD6FTST1V

Will this revive the a/c ? it's a set of 2x 12oz cans of gas with a can of oil plus hose adapter.

Have any one tried it ? thanks for input!

[feniks]

i actually found a better Freeze 12 kit for a compelte empty system refill:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Freez...item4ceec3107c

The kit has more stuff in it (including a leak stop):
3 (12oz.) Cans Freeze-12 Refrigerant
1 (4oz.) Can Freeze-12 Oil Charge
1 (4oz.) Can Freeze-12 Leak Stop
1 Freeze-12 to R-12 Can Tap
1 Universal Check Gauge
1 Installation CD

I think I will give it a shot.

[jpawl]

retrofit it to 134A.it's simple and works fine on your car.high side pressure usually go up a bit after conversion but you won't notice that much of a difference.only thing to remember is 134A takes only 80% of what the old system used to hold.

[feniks]

Originally Posted by jpawl

retrofit it to 134A.it's simple and works fine on your car.high side pressure usually go up a bit after conversion but you won't notice that much of a difference.only thing to remember is 134A takes only 80% of what the old system used to hold.

thanks. i think i will pass on conversion, this car is in poor shape (body and some metal parts rusted out), so i don't want to put any real money into it.
it actually was close to be junked 3-4 times already, because of serious failures it had over years, i was lucky to repair those quickly and save the car.
i think i will only try charging a/c system with Freeze 12 and see what happens. if it works then great, if it doesn't i leave it like it is hehe

will post back once i get the above kit.

[maxwedge]

Keep in mind r134 tends to find leaks much easier than r12, so any weak seals or hoses will leak.

[feniks]

Originally Posted by maxwedge

Keep in mind r134 tends to find leaks much easier than r12, so any weak seals or hoses will leak.

yes, i heard that too. i'm pretty sure 134a wouldn't last a day in this car

[HotZ28]

"Freeze 12" works fine for toping off an R12 system, I have been using it for years for that purpose. "Leak stop" will congest & clog the system, do not use it! BTW, most NAPA & Pep Boys stock Freeze-12; however, they may ask for, (but not always) an EPA #609 MVAC license to purchase it.

ASE/EPA MVAC Certified Technician

[feniks]

Originally Posted by HotZ28

"Freeze 12" works fine for toping off an R12 system, I have been using it for years for that purpose. "Leak stop" will congest & clog the system, do not use it! BTW, most NAPA & Pep Boys stock Freeze-12; however, they may ask for, (but not always) an EPA #609 MVAC license to purchase it.

ASE/EPA MVAC Certified Technician

thanks for input! will leave leak stop alone. i heard that a/c mechanics can still buy it, but yeah stores ask for papers... on shelves they have 134a only.

[feniks]

dang. i'm dumb. i wasted 2 cans of gas before i realized that compressor is not kicking in and pulley is not turning at all ... i guess i won't have a/c anymore in this car LOL

any specific fuses or relays i can check to make sure a/c circuit is right ?
i can test resistance/current at a/c plugs, i think they are easy to access. any detailed info please before i assume it's a lost case ?

thanks.

[HotZ28]

Have you tried to jump the terminal on the pressure switch, which is located on the accumulator?

[feniks]

Originally Posted by HotZ28

Have you tried to jump the terminal on the pressure switch, which is located on the accumulator?

good question
no, i haven't, not sure where that pressure switch exactly is. need to take another look. by jumping you mean shorting it with a paper clip or rather applying battery voltage to terminals ?

so far i have seen only 2 high pressure ports/pipes on windshield side and 1 low pressure port/pipe on opposite side of accumulator (it's an R12 model). and the mounting bracket at lower part of it.

I looked through my Bonyville Haynes, but it sucks honestly per a/c system troubleshooting (nothing in there).

on running engine i tried "pushing" the compressor pulley with long plastic stick and it rotates freely, so nothing is seized up, i think it's not getting power or something inside it failed and e.g. clutch doesn't engage.

are there any other fuses or relays that I should check besides the switch you mentioned ? i guess i will need to run through all fuses in cabin on both driver and passenger side behind the knee panels.

[HotZ28]

You need to remove the shroud from the fuse/relay panel under the hood. Once removed, you can see the accumulator, with the switch on the side. You can use a "paper clip" to jump the terminal, however, it is best to use a fused jumper for this purpose in case something makes contact with ground. BTW, have you removed the negative (-) battery cable and let it set for a few minutes before reconnecting? If not, try that first. BTW, be sure the climate control is set to OFF (with engine running) before removing the cable.

[feniks]

Originally Posted by HotZ28

You need to remove the shroud from the fuse/relay panel under the hood. Once removed, you can see the accumulator, with the switch on the side. You can use a "paper clip" to jump the terminal, however, it is best to use a fused jumper for this purpose in case something makes contact with ground. BTW, have you removed the negative (-) battery cable and let it set for a few minutes before reconnecting? If not, try that first. BTW, be sure the climate control is set to OFF (with engine running) before removing the cable.

ok, did as you asked. first i made sure climate control is set to off on running engine. then shut it down and removed battery negative for 5 mins.
reconnected, restarted and checked if compressor starts after switching control to max or norm (with fans at full blast) - still nothing.

I found the switch on accumulator, i though it was second high pressure pipe before, did not notice wires coming out of it.
anyways i shorted it with paper clip on running engine and still compressor does not turn. is it dead ?

[brcidd]

'92 C/H cars were famous for bad a/c relays- on relay center rack-top of fiewall-- should be first on your left-- tap on relay- if compressor comes on- then you have your answer...

[imidazol97]

Originally Posted by brcidd

'92 C/H cars were famous for bad a/c relays- on relay center rack-top of fiewall-- should be first on your left-- tap on relay- if compressor comes on- then you have your answer...

That's a really good point about the relays. The standard AC units used that relay to turn the compressor on and off while cycling IIRC from my 93.

The relays in the MaxiFuse Center are mostly the same part number. So the poster can switch the next one for the first one and see if that makes the unit turn on. IF it doesn't they should bypass the pressure switch to see if it turns on with a different relay.

The relays slide in with a spring bar that snaps over a hook. To remove use a steak knife blade to hold that spring up so the relay pulls out. Ask me how I learned that the hard way.

Hope the relay fixes your problem.