Canada Lawmakers OK Gay Marriage Bill

[2strokebloke]

Originally Posted by Gotti

Wow.. that was easily the most retarded statement i've read on AF in a long time.

One retarded statement deserves another.
As though getting worked up over the use of a word isn't retarded.
Two people = marriage. Two companies = marriage. Two ideas = marriage. The contents of two ketchup bottles = marriage.
When two persons/places/things come together it is a marriage, marriage means uniting, get over it already.

Not to bash gay people but if if it was really "right" to marry and love another of the same sex, Why isn't there just one sex? Everybody would be asexual(sp)
That would solve everything then. I say if women like women, then there would be no need for men and vice-versa. It would be pointless. God created a man and a women. (at least that what they tell me) Not a man and a man.

Why do we have more than one phone company? Why does KFC sell original and extra crispy chicken? Why is there more than one continent, and why do some people choose to live in Australia?
What is so wrong about letting people choose to do what they want to do? Shit, if "God" or whatever (if anything) wanted things to work by your logic, then we would only have one continent, with one phone system, and KFC would only sell one kind of chicken.

[illegal_eagle187]

[lazysmurff]

Originally Posted by Gotti

Are you serious? A wedding is the bonding of 2 people before god. Thats what it has been for thousands of years. If it didnt have anything to do with god or church, i wouldnt have any problem with gays doing it. Thats why i said, let them have their civil unions, but keep it out of the church. Call it something else.

ill attack this statement in two steps:

1: civil unions DO NOT allow gays the same rights as a marriage. if you want to claim marriage originated in the christian church (thats point 2) thats fine. for the sake of arguemtns ill grant you that (until #2 at least) but the fact remains marriage has become institutionalized by the state, who affords rights with it. what was once just some fancy party the church threw, now has legalities behind it. civil unions just dont cut it. having a civil union instead of a marriage is like ordering a happy meal and not getting the fries.

2: and most importantly MARRIAGE IS NOT SOLELY A CHRISITAN IDEA. there, i said it. bout time people recognized this. There are a number of religions out there, many of which accept and endorse gay marriage. to deny gay people of these religons the right to marry is, in fact, denying them the right to practice their religion, which in a sense destroys one of the basic founding principles of our country. to deny gay marriage is to deny the very foundations upon which our country was built.

[drewh4386]

I think somebody mistaked MY post for somebody else.
Seriously.

Why? Cause nobody wants to be subject to the same thing all the time. I know one thing.....

from a scientific stand point that has been prove and proven, opposite attract. Something like magnets. THERE WOULD BE NO POINT to have the positive and negative side attract if 2 positives could attract or 2 negatives. There are so many more ways that this could be viewed. If everybody thought the same, then you'd see what I posted above has many loopholed ways to look at. From a mathematical stand point,
2 evens are even. 2 odds are even. I have more stupid comparisons if needed. It no different the what government try to do. Keep everything un-looped so it can't be used against them. Its weird that way.

[carrrnuttt]

Originally Posted by Gotti

I care.. A wedding is a holy thing between a man and a woman.

I dont give a shit if they want to be a couple under law, let them do it. They can call it something else. But it doesnt belong in the church.

Not that I give a shit if they marry or not, since I don't care about religion in general, but you DO know that religions have their own by-laws, where they can choose to marry/not marry anyone, right?

As in, although I was born, and raised Roman Catholic, and was baptized into two other denominations growing up, I had to get married in a non-denominational church, because my wife was never baptized into anything.

[lazysmurff]

w00p....add spain to the list.

http://edition.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/eu...n.gay.vote.ap/

the netherland, belgium, and now spain, and soon to be canada (unless im behind and canada already has). we're on a roll boys and girls.

[AlmostStock]

Not that long ago many states still had laws preventing inter-racial couples from getting married. (into the 60's and early 70's I believe!) We eventually realized that this was wrong and corrected it. It's only a matter of time until the same thing happens with gay marriage.

I dream of a day when a gay couple will be able go to Las Vegas, drive thru a "chapel" to be married by Elvis, only to go on to get divorced soon after.

[Knifeblade]

Inter-racial gene-pooling is a degredation to both races, simple fact. Right or wrong? I say wrong. I'd like to see how MJ's kid's turn out, not a great example, but it follows.

[lazysmurff]

call me crazy, but im going to say race is a social construction. not that this is off topic at all or anything.

[twospirits]

Originally Posted by Gotti

Are you serious? A wedding is the bonding of 2 people before god. Thats what it has been for thousands of years. If it didnt have anything to do with god or church, i wouldnt have any problem with gays doing it. Thats why i said, let them have their civil unions, but keep it out of the church. Call it something else.

Actually, it is not the bonding of two people before god. If you do some research you will see that the marriage as we think of it today has constantly changed from its original concept to what it is now. Your view of marriage is not the view of countless others. Monogamy, Polygamy and Polyandry are among the numerous forms of marriage practice throughout the world and accepted as norm. See History of Marriage on my website. The marrying of homosexuals is but one possbile next step of its evolution. It may not happen in your lifetime, and you may not like it but it will happen.

TS out

[Gotti]

Originally Posted by illegal_eagle187

getting married has nothing to do with religion, its about law, and state, not everybody who gets married believes in any type of religion

Ya in modern times sometimes it has nothing to do with religion. But saying marriage has nothing to do with religion is the most ignorant statement i've heard. Marriage was created by religion and it has always been a religious thing. If it wasnt then nobody would get married in a church.

Originally Posted by 2strokebloke

Two people = marriage. Two companies = marriage. Two ideas = marriage. The contents of two ketchup bottles = marriage.
When two persons/places/things come together it is a marriage, marriage means uniting, get over it already.

OK wedding then

get over what?

Originally Posted by lazysmurff

ill attack this statement in two steps:

1: civil unions DO NOT allow gays the same rights as a marriage. if you want to claim marriage originated in the christian church (thats point 2) thats fine. for the sake of arguemtns ill grant you that (until #2 at least) but the fact remains marriage has become institutionalized by the state, who affords rights with it. what was once just some fancy party the church threw, now has legalities behind it. civil unions just dont cut it. having a civil union instead of a marriage is like ordering a happy meal and not getting the fries.

First of all i never said anything about marriage originating in the christian church. It has bin around in other religions thousands of years before christianity even began.

2nd it was not a "fancy party" it was the bonding of 2 people before God. The celebration comes after the wedding

3rd if civil unions dont cut it, make something that does. But make their own thing. A wedding was never meant to be for 2 men. What are they gunna rewrite the bible too? Those are rules that have bin in effect for thousands of years. I dont care if they have the same exact rights that a wedding would give a straight couple, but they can keep it out of the church. The church doesnt accept homosexuality anyway, it tolerates it and teaches us to not discriminate against homosexuals. So thats why I'm saying they can have all the rights a straight couple gets, but they dont have the right to re-write my religion.

Originally Posted by carrrnuttt

Not that I give a shit if they marry or not, since I don't care about religion in general, but you DO know that religions have their own by-laws, where they can choose to marry/not marry anyone, right?

Yes i know that, i'm just expressing my opinion on this subject.

Originally Posted by twospirits

Actually, it is not the bonding of two people before god. If you do some research you will see that the marriage as we think of it today has constantly changed from its original concept to what it is now. Your view of marriage is not the view of countless others. Monogamy, Polygamy and Polyandry are among the numerous forms of marriage practice throughout the world and accepted as norm. See History of Marriage on my website. The marrying of homosexuals is but one possbile next step of its evolution. It may not happen in your lifetime, and you may not like it but it will happen.

TS out

I know that. Its different in every culture and every religion. But I'm just speaking of it from my cultural point of view as a Polish Roman Catholic, we have very strong beliefs, our country has one of the highest number of practicing catholics in the world. We want to preserve our religion, theres no reason for it to be changed. If you dont like something about the religion, tough luck, switch to a different one. You know what i'm saying?

[lazysmurff]

Originally Posted by Gotti

I know that. Its different in every culture and every religion. But I'm just speaking of it from my cultural point of view as a Polish Roman Catholic, we have very strong beliefs, our country has one of the highest number of practicing catholics in the world. We want to preserve our religion, theres no reason for it to be changed. If you dont like something about the religion, tough luck, switch to a different one. You know what i'm saying?

then feel free to move back to Poland. but this is the united states, and just because YOUR religion doesnt like gay marriage, doesnt mean that everyone else in this country should be bound by those rules. as ive pointed out, and you so conveniently overlooked, marriage has happened in religions outside of christianity, in fact GAY MARRIAGES have happened in religions outside of christianity for hundreds, if not thousands of years.

so your religion doesnt like it. boo hoo. not everyone is america is chrisitian, and as such, we shouldnt be governed by christian dogma. if you want a government run by religion, i hear Iran is looking nice this time of year.

[AlmostStock]

Originally Posted by Gotti

...A wedding was never meant to be for 2 men. What are they gunna rewrite the bible too?.. ...I dont care if they have the same exact rights that a wedding would give a straight couple, but they can keep it out of the church... ....but they dont have the right to re-write my religion.

No one is trying force gay marriage into any church or rewrite the bible or anyone's religion. If this were the case I would be on your side. You have to separate state recognized marriage from a church wedding. They are two different things. Even when the state allows gay marriage they will not have the authority to tell your church they have to marry gays.

[Gotti]

Originally Posted by lazysmurff

then feel free to move back to Poland. but this is the united states, and just because YOUR religion doesnt like gay marriage, doesnt mean that everyone else in this country should be bound by those rules. as ive pointed out, and you so conveniently overlooked, marriage has happened in religions outside of christianity, in fact GAY MARRIAGES have happened in religions outside of christianity for hundreds, if not thousands of years.

Didnt I already say that I dont care if they get together as long as its not in the church? I already replied to those points

And you're conveniently overlooking my replies to what you thought i was conveniently overlooking:

Originally Posted by Gotti

First of all i never said anything about marriage originating in the christian church. It has bin around in other religions thousands of years before christianity even began.

As long as its not in my church/religion.. fine by me

Originally Posted by AlmostStock

No one is trying force gay marriage into any church or rewrite the bible or anyone's religion. If this were the case I would be on your side. You have to separate state recognized marriage from a church wedding. They are two different things. Even when the state allows gay marriage they will not have the authority to tell your church they have to marry gays.

Yeah thats true... I didnt think of it that way at first

[lazysmurff]

i see that:

Originally Posted by Gotti

Thats why i said, let them have their civil unions, but keep it out of the church. Call it something else.

but what your missing is this: calling it something else makes it something else. we've tried this "seperate but equal" thing before and it didnt exactly work that well.

so i know these two gay guys named robert and john. subjects of the award winning documentary "pink houses" (do a quick google search and see if its showing in your area at any point in the future. well worth seeing). John does my hair during the school year, and ive been to quite a few politcal events with the two of them. great guys. christian too. they'd like to be married by their minister, who believes the church SHOULD tolerate gay marriage. but they cant.

now heres an instance where the church would like to, but the government wont let them....whats to be done? cant just say its a civil union now can we? cuz the church is doing it, but people like you dont want to recognize it is "marriage" because of religious reasons.

so lets cut out the BS, legalize marriage for gays, and if they cant find a church to do it, do it at a courthouse or in their front lawn. but call it marriage. not seperate, just equal.