No action on Marine who shot hurt Iraqi

[drewh4386]

Originally Posted by AlmostStock

Do you honestly think escalating the use of force will ever make them give up and create a happy ending? I don't.

No. I don't either. It will get worse. Its 2005. Never have and probably never will.

[Franko914]

Originally Posted by AlmostStock

OK this incident was justified, but let's not forget who started all of this. Iraq never attacked us, never threatened to attack us, and didn't even have the means to attack us. So in that respect it's our fault there are insurgents at all.

Point of fact is that Saddam started "all of this" by attacking Kuwait, then, refused to abide by UN resolutions, then made it clear that he would acquire WMDs and use them against Israel and the US, then got his ass kicked out of power. Yes, absolutely, let's not forget who started all of this.

Originally Posted by AlmostStock

I don't blame the insurgents for using what ever means are available to them. If a much stronger force tried to take over me or my country, I would do the same. You can say we use fancy technology and they use dirty tactics but you know who's killed more, and who set the ball rolling.

The insurgents have killed more Iraqis than the Americans. If you cowardly place civilians, women and children around you as shields while you fire over/through them at Americans and they fire back, well, you've killed them yourself.

Originally Posted by AlmostStock

Do you honestly think escalating the use of force will ever make them give up and create a happy ending? I don't. Unfortunately I'm afraid our folly has left us with no good options.

We haven't escalated the use of force, they have, but in cowardly wanton ways: suicide bombing markets, mosques, funerals, weddings, etc. What you call "our folly" has bought us security and safety but you're entitled to your own opinion, but remember that all wars are follies in themselves.

Here's my opinion: what enemies we have now were enemies before Iraq was invaded (1st and 2nd times), so let them come and meet as for battle -- so long as it's not here. We'll seek them wherever they are. We'll take the fight to them. F*ck them and all who support them. We need fresh weapons and ammo anyway.

[Flatrater]

Originally Posted by AlmostStock

Do you honestly think escalating the use of force will ever make them give up and create a happy ending? I don't. Unfortunately I'm afraid our folly has left us with no good options.

Dead insurgents can't give up. Saddam posed a problem and he is gone for now. If one side is removed form the planet how could that not be a happy ending for the remaining side? Isn't that what the insurgents are after? Do you hnestly think the insurgents will be happy with the Americans leaving and stop there?

[AlmostStock]

Originally Posted by Franko914

Point of fact is that Saddam started "all of this"

Oh really? Then why was it called a PREEMPTIVE STRIKE? History has been written, and it says the war began when we started bombing Iraq. They never attacked us. I know you think our action was justified but that doesn't change what really happened.

Originally Posted by Franko914

The insurgents have killed more Iraqis than the Americans.

We don't actually know who or how many we killed. We may not be doing it intentionally but most likely we have killed way more innocents. Even civilians killed by insurgents are at least partly our fault. If we didn't start the war there wouldn't be any insurgents doing that crap.

Even if you think launching this war was necessary, it's hard to pretend that its planning and execution wasn't botched at almost every turn. Even Rumsfield admitted he never expected us to be in the unfavorable position were in now, two years out.

[Gotti]

Originally Posted by AlmostStock

We don't actually know who or how many we killed. We may not be doing it intentionally but most likely we have killed way more innocents. Even civilians killed by insurgents are at least partly our fault. If we didn't start the war there wouldn't be any insurgents doing that crap.

What about the fact that more iraqis died every year when Saddam was in power than during the war?

[Franko914]

Originally Posted by AlmostStock

Oh really? Then why was it called a PREEMPTIVE STRIKE? History has been written, and it says the war began when we started bombing Iraq. They never attacked us. I know you think our action was justified but that doesn't change what really happened.

For the smart ones who know the axiom, "Once burnt, twice shy," it matters not who dropped the first bomb: Gaddam Hussein threatened to use WMDs against us, he had HISTORY of using WMDs, he refused to cease his quest for acquiring WMDS. History has also been written that Saddam is no longer in power and that's what really happened. You can nit-pick as much as you want (the insurgents and their supporters are counting on it) "but that doesn't change what really happened."

Originally Posted by AlmostStock

... and they use dirty tactics but you know who's killed more... We don't actually know who or how many we killed...most likely we have killed way more innocents <snip>

Rhetoric, inferrence or wishful thinking?

Originally Posted by AlmostStock

Even civilians killed by insurgents are at least partly our fault. If we didn't start the war there wouldn't be any insurgents doing that crap.

If Saddam didn't behave the way he did, we wouldn't have gone in there the first place.

Originally Posted by AlmostStock

Even if you think launching this war was necessary, it's hard to pretend that its planning and execution wasn't botched at almost every turn. Even Rumsfield admitted he never expected us to be in the unfavorable position were in now, two years out.

If you think war planning and execution is so simple, which war's planning and execution was never botched at all? Give me one example, just one... If you can't, then, it's just another case of Monday night QB'ing. I suppose you also strongly believe that the A-bombs should not have been dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

[Raz_Kaz]

Originally Posted by Gotti

What about the fact that more iraqis died every year when Saddam was in power than during the war?

Saddam was overthrown and captive somewhere for his responsibilaty of the deaths. So who does the time from the Americans?
Saddam killed Iraqi's and becomes a crazy dictator...Americans kill Iraqi's and become the bearers of "freedom".

Originally Posted by Franko914

For the smart ones who know the axiom, "Once burnt, twice shy," it matters not who dropped the first bomb: Saddam Hussein threatened to use WMDs against us, he had HISTORY of using WMDs, he refused to cease his quest for acquiring WMDS. History has also been written that Saddam is no longer in power and that's what really happened. You can nit-pick as much as you want (the insurgents and their supporters are counting on it) "but that doesn't change what really happened."

Looks like he had some empty threats now didn't he? Or else the US would be shoving the uncovered WMD in the faces of the countries that doubted them, but you don't see that hapening...I wonder why?

If Saddam didn't behave the way he did, we wouldn't have gone in there the first place.

Try going back a little further and who once supported Saddam and offered them some tactical war advice. If it wasn't for the encouragement from the US, maybe Saddam wouldn't have turned out so evil?

[Gotti]

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

Saddam was overthrown and captive somewhere for his responsibilaty of the deaths. So who does the time from the Americans?
Saddam killed Iraqi's and becomes a crazy dictator...Americans kill Iraqi's and become the bearers of "freedom".

Things have to get worse before they get good.... thats life, when communism ended in eastern europe it got alot worse before it got better. 15 years later things are starting to get better, you have to go through that time so future generations benefit.

[Raz_Kaz]

Originally Posted by Gotti

Things have to get worse before they get good.... thats life, when communism ended in eastern europe it got alot worse before it got better. 15 years later things are starting to get better, you have to go through that time so future generations benefit.

Let's hope you'r right. Remember, this is the Middle-East not Eastern Europe.

[Franko914]

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

Looks like he had some empty threats now didn't he? Or else the US would be shoving the uncovered WMD in the faces of the countries that doubted them, but you don't see that hapening...I wonder why?

Well, served him f*cking right, didn't it? (Ahhh, that was a rhetorical question, Raz)

BTW, the US found the WMDs and are keeping them to frame another oppressive regime, i.e., a country that's being led asunder by lies, deceit and unethical actions by its leaders: Canada.

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

Try going back a little further and who once supported Saddam and offered them some tactical war advice. If it wasn't for the encouragement from the US, maybe Saddam wouldn't have turned out so evil?

Try going back and learn about the "phenomenon" in the region of shifting alliances/animosities. Man, you really have to read what's already been posted.

As for the Canadian government's evil practices, who are you going to blame? The only major incursions of late by Americans across the border was when Dubya won in 2000 and again in 2004, so if you want to blame America, blame those American Liberal comrades of yours.

[Franko914]

Originally Posted by Gotti

Things have to get worse before they get good.... thats life, when communism ended in eastern europe it got alot worse before it got better. 15 years later things are starting to get better, you have to go through that time so future generations benefit.

Yup! When it was going bad, guess who they blamed? Ah, well, they earned that right to blame whomever they want -- they are, after all, "FREE" now, aren't they?

With a free Eastern Europe, don't you feel safer now that tens of thousands of Soviet nuclear warheads are no longer aimed at you? (I never heard a "Thank you" from our "allies/friends" in Europe, did you?). Now, we can focus more on the extremists groups/states that support terrorists hellbent on attacking the free world (and what better target than the "symbol of freedom") which, BTW, are outcrops of the KGB's efforts to destabilize countries on the other side of the Iron Curtain during the Cold War.

[Raz_Kaz]

Originally Posted by Franko914

Well, served him f*cking right, didn't it? (Ahhh, that was a rhetorical question, Raz)

BTW, the US found the WMDs and are keeping them to frame another oppressive regime, i.e., a country that's being led asunder by lies, deceit and unethical actions by its leaders: Canada.

The COT section is where the jokes are. We try and keep civil, serious discussions in this forum. Please try and abide by the conventions.

Try going back and learn about the "phenomenon" in the region of shifting alliances/animosities. Man, you really have to read what's already been posted.

If you are trying to proove a point, try and list or name some of your arguments.

As for the Canadian government's evil practices, who are you going to blame? The only major incursions of late by Americans across the border was when Dubya won in 2000 and again in 2004, so if you want to blame America, blame those American Liberal comrades of yours.

Since when is Canada in this discussion. Canada was not apart of the preemtive strikes. Try and stay focused on the topic at hand instead of playing the scapegoat game

[Franko914]

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

The COT section is where the jokes are. We try and keep civil, serious discussions in this forum. Please try and abide by the conventions.

I don't know, Raz. Whenever someone beats up on the US just for the sake of beating up on the US, especially if all posts by that someone regarding the US are critical, derogatory and judgmental, I get fired up and try to figure out what's eating them. Usually, it's either envy or chip-on-shoulder. I haven't been wrong, yet.

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

If you are trying to proove a point, try and list or name some of your arguments.

Nice try, but tough sh*t, Sherlock. You're gonna have to read back yourself...

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

Since when is Canada in this discussion. Canada was not apart of the preemtive strikes. Try and stay focused on the topic at hand instead of playing the scapegoat game

Whenever you disparage the US with your self-righteous hypocritical pronouncements while ignoring the fact that your government is sleazy and unethical. BTW, the topic is "No action on Marine who shot hurt Iraqi" and not preemptive strikes.

[Raz_Kaz]

Originally Posted by Franko914

I don't know, Raz. Whenever someone beats up on the US just for the sake of beating up on the US, especially if all posts by that someone regarding the US are critical, derogatory and judgmental, I get fired up and try to figure out what's eating them. Usually, it's either envy or chip-on-shoulder. I haven't been wrong, yet.

If you think you've never been wrong then you're already wrong. Ever wonder that maybe there's more to the hate towards the US other then just because?

Nice try, but tough sh*t, Sherlock. You're gonna have to read back yourself...

LOL, this again?

Whenever you disparage the US with your self-righteous hypocritical pronouncements while ignoring the fact that your government is sleazy and unethical. BTW, the topic is "No action on Marine who shot hurt Iraqi" and not preemptive strikes.

I can at least admit to the wrong doings of my goverment whereas some in here would rather die then to admit to the lies.
And btw, Canada is not involved in the shooting of the wounded Iraqi, an American soldier was.

[Franko914]

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

If you think you've never been wrong then you're already wrong. Ever wonder that maybe there's more to the hate towards the US other then just because?

I was talking about "either envy or chip-on-shoulder" and in your case, it's (drumroll, please)... "needs more fibre."

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

LOL, this again?

Yup, ROFL, let me know when you've caught up.

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

I can at least admit to the wrong doings of my goverment <snip>

So, don't be so hypocritical -- if you have no sin, I'll let you cast the first stone.

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

...whereas some in here would rather die then to admit to the lies.

You mean the wounded Iraqi soldier who died of lead poisoning?

Originally Posted by Raz_Kaz

And btw, Canada is not involved in the shooting of the wounded Iraqi, an American soldier was.

Oh, okay, back to topic. The US soldier (whose father was Canadian) was defending himself and his buddies-in-arms so that the US can continue to obtain oil from the region to support the profitable trade it enjoys with its major trading partner, Canada. So you see, we were doing YOU a favor.