a problem instruments bouncing around

[reble]

This problem is in a 2000 Ford Windstar sel. I got this minivan from a used car dealer on Aug 3rd. About 2 weeks after I got the van the gas, RPM, speedometer and temperature gauges started bouncing around. If I bang steering column just right with my hand. The gauges star working fine again. I am a retired 2 way radio tech. I found a Youtube video saying there is a cold solder joint on a pin on the ribbon cable that connects the 2 pc boards together. I tried to fix that cold solder joint and I used a bit to much heat on the joint and I seprated the the pin from the foil trace. I used a small piece of solid copper wire to bridge the break. That stopped the gauges from bouncing. All of the gauges are working fine except for the gas gauge. When I turn the key on the gas gauge jumps up past full and stays there until the key is turned off. By my calculations (the tank was filled up on Aug 3rd) there should be about 1/4th of a tank left. But the gas gauge still reads past the full mark. Were is the problem?

[tomj76]

You might have a problem with the anti-slosh module, which is found in the instrument cluster. A few months ago my gas gauge was reading too high (I ran it completely out of gas). I found that the diode in the circuit was faulty, replaced it and it works fine now.

[reble]

Is there any chance that you can send me a jpg picture of your cluster as to were that diode is?

Steve

Originally Posted by tomj76

You might have a problem with the anti-slosh module, which is found in the instrument cluster. A few months ago my gas gauge was reading too high (I ran it completely out of gas). I found that the diode in the circuit was faulty, replaced it and it works fine now.

[12Ounce]

I wonder if you are pounding on the column to cause the "power" relays in the cabin fuse junction panel to make/break?

You may want to pull each fuse and relay, one at a time, and dope up the male spades with an anti-oxidant such as Ideal's "Noalox". The power relays make have dirty contacts ... replacement may be helpful.

[reble]

Since I fixied the cold solder joint on the ribbon cable. The gauges don't bounce anymore. But I still have a problem. See the attached picture. The gas gauge is past full, and drops to empty when power is off . The RPM and the speed are with the motor running and parked. The RPM reading is around 3,500 and I can tell by ear that the motor isn't turning over at that rate. The speedometer is at 35mph when parked. Tempiture gauge says the motor is boiling over when there is no other signs of boiling over. This is getting frustrating. Pulling the cluster in and out, tring this, that and the other thing and getting a BIG FAT NOTHING.

Originally Posted by 12Ounce

I wonder if you are pounding on the column to cause the "power" relays in the cabin fuse junction panel to make/break?

You may want to pull each fuse and relay, one at a time, and dope up the male spades with an anti-oxidant such as Ideal's "Noalox". The power relays make have dirty contacts ... replacement may be helpful.

[Ferno]

I find it fascinating that every 1999 and 2000 Windstar I've owned (5) have had bouncing gauges and Ford has NEVER come forward with a simple fix.

My current one only bounces in warmer weather. If I smack the top of the dash really hard it will calm down for a second or maybe for an entire trip. This tells me it's an electric connection somewhere.

My first 99 Windstar only did it three times after running over a deer. The Van only had about 3000 miles on it. I was headed to Arizona from Oregon when I ran over the deer (Just outside Vegas, it was already dead) and the gauges started bouncing on the trip back. About a week after we got back it bounced the third time and never did it again in three years we owned it.

[reble]

Ferno I fixed the bouncing gauges. But the gas gauge is stuck past the full mark until the ignition key is turned off. I was told there mite a shorted diode in the anti-slosh unit. I just bought the complete schematic diagram in a book form from Ebay for my 2000 Windstar. Since I used to fix 2 way radios, tv's and vcr's for a living. I should be able to fix this problem. Thank god that I can pull the instrument cluster and work on it in my air conditioned work shop. I can only work outside for a few hours in the morning before it starts heating up. I over heat very easy.

A ps. The bouncing gauges is a simple fix if you know how to solder on a pc board. It is very delicate work.

Originally Posted by Ferno

I find it fascinating that every 1999 and 2000 Windstar I've owned (5) have had bouncing gauges and Ford has NEVER come forward with a simple fix.

My current one only bounces in warmer weather. If I smack the top of the dash really hard it will calm down for a second or maybe for an entire trip. This tells me it's an electric connection somewhere.

My first 99 Windstar only did it three times after running over a deer. The Van only had about 3000 miles on it. I was headed to Arizona from Oregon when I ran over the deer (Just outside Vegas, it was already dead) and the gauges started bouncing on the trip back. About a week after we got back it bounced the third time and never did it again in three years we owned it.

[tomj76]

Sorry, I don't have any photos of the module in the back of my cluster.

Here is a photo that I found online by searching "Ford Windstar Anti-slosh module":
http://www.supermotors.net/getfile/4...that-thing.jpg

The anti-slosh module is mounted in the back of the instrument cluster. There are YouTube videos that discuss it. Ford has several versions of the module, so the exact electronic circuit is different for each version. The actual schematic for the module (internal circuit) is not documented in the Windstar wiring manual. However, it is simple enough that you can visualize the circuit (or draw a schematic) from the layout. I believe there is only one diode.

The purpose of the module is to "steady" the gas gauge so that the needle doesn't fluctuate as the gas slushes around in the tank. The module also sets the low fuel warning light.

The module will only affects the gas gauge. Any problem that is also causing other gauges to move erratically will be due to a different problem.

The module converts the resistance of the fuel tank sender into a voltage, then it averages that voltage and drives the fuel gauge. Problems in the module cause the fuel gauge reading to be wrong. In my case the gauge said that I had 1/4 tank when it was totally empty. FYI, bad wiring and/or connectors can also cause a faulty reading. You can check the wiring by probing the fuel gauge sender wires that plug into the instrument cluster to see if a reading is present, and also by disconnecting the connector to the sender and checking the gauge with the sender pins shorted and open circuited (one will cause the gauge to read empty, the other full).

A faulty module can be bypassed so that the fuel gauge reads directly from the fuel tank sender. The reading is accurate, but fluctuates due to the gas moving around.

There are YouTube videos on how to do this. It is as simple as shorting out two pins on the module.

Search for "Ford Windstar Anti-Slosh Module" to find the videos.

Also, the fuel gauge can't move without power applied to it (current flowing). If the gauge moves when power is turned from on to off, then you might have another problem.

[reble]

Thanks. Between what you told me Tom and what I will find out when the Windstar wiring manual that I just payed for on Ebay, when it arrives. I should be able to fix the gas gauge. As to the RPM and speed goes. I am not worried about the RPM reading been high. I can tell by my ear as to how the motor sounds. I used to do short hall trucking during the day while I went to electronics class's at night. The speedometer, I have a backup plain for that. A GPS receiver mounted on the dash and set to ground speed. An as for the temperature gauge saying the motor is boiling over when there is no other sign of boiling over. The temperature gauge jumps up to half way when the key is turned on and the motor is stone cold. I also have a spare instrument cluster that I got from a scraped outed 2000 Windstar at the junk yard. Now when I put the spare cluster in and connect the wires up. The motor won't start but the gas and temperature gauges don't act funky. When the backup cluster is in place the gas gauge says that I have a bit above a 1/4th of a tank left right now. That tells me that the problem is in the cluster. I shouldn't have any problems taking parts from the 2nd cluster to fix the original cluster.

Originally Posted by tomj76

Sorry, I don't have any photos of the module in the back of my cluster.

Here is a photo that I found online by searching "Ford Windstar Anti-slosh module":
http://www.supermotors.net/getfile/4...that-thing.jpg

The anti-slosh module is mounted in the back of the instrument cluster. There are YouTube videos that discuss it. Ford has several versions of the module, so the exact electronic circuit is different for each version. The actual schematic for the module (internal circuit) is not documented in the Windstar wiring manual. However, it is simple enough that you can visualize the circuit (or draw a schematic) from the layout. I believe there is only one diode.

The purpose of the module is to "steady" the gas gauge so that the needle doesn't fluctuate as the gas slushes around in the tank. The module also sets the low fuel warning light.

The module will only affects the gas gauge. Any problem that is also causing other gauges to move erratically will be due to a different problem.

The module converts the resistance of the fuel tank sender into a voltage, then it averages that voltage and drives the fuel gauge. Problems in the module cause the fuel gauge reading to be wrong. In my case the gauge said that I had 1/4 tank when it was totally empty. FYI, bad wiring and/or connectors can also cause a faulty reading. You can check the wiring by probing the fuel gauge sender wires that plug into the instrument cluster to see if a reading is present, and also by disconnecting the connector to the sender and checking the gauge with the sender pins shorted and open circuited (one will cause the gauge to read empty, the other full).

A faulty module can be bypassed so that the fuel gauge reads directly from the fuel tank sender. The reading is accurate, but fluctuates due to the gas moving around.

There are YouTube videos on how to do this. It is as simple as shorting out two pins on the module.

Search for "Ford Windstar Anti-Slosh Module" to find the videos.

Also, the fuel gauge can't move without power applied to it (current flowing). If the gauge moves when power is turned from on to off, then you might have another problem.

[reble]

I just looked at the photo for the (Here is a photo that I found online by searching "Ford Windstar Anti-slosh module": http://www.supermotors.net/getfile/4...that-thing.jpg)
That cluster in the picture doesn't look anything like the one in my Windstar.

[tomj76]

The unit pictured in the link I provided earlier is the "analog" instrument cluster and has a mechanical speedometer/odometer. There is also a "digital" cluster that I have not seen, but the images that I've seen appear to not have any mechanical needles like yours.

I believe the key to finding the antislosh module is that it is a separate board from the instrument cluster and plugs into it.

FYI, in the analog cluster, the gauges (tach, temperature, fuel level) are magnetic devices that depend on the current ratio running in two coils. In general the two coils are wired in series with one contact to B+ a contact to ground from the second coil, and the sensor connects to the common node. The gauge deflects according to the amount of current drawn out of the common node. See this youtube video for a good explanation https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2vb4oVdOCk

My guess is that your gauges read high because there is a relatively high resistance to ground. Although there are multiple ground wires connecting to the cluster, these join to a common wire before connecting to ground.

Maybe you can find an online picture of a cluster that is a closer match to yours.

[reble]

I got the wiring diagram book in the snail mail today, see attached picture. It is not any help when it comes to the gauges. There is a reference to the gauges > fuel gauge on pages 60-1 and 2 in the index but nothing on the pages it self about the fuel gauge.
I did find something new about this Windstar today, an other bell and whistle. The on board computer knows how much fuel was put in. The tank was filled on Aug 3rd. And about $20. was put in the tank on Aug 20th. The computer says that I have about 55 miles of fuel left before the tank runs dry. So that tells me that the sender unit in the tank is ok. And that the wiring from the sender to the computer is ok also

Originally Posted by tomj76

The unit pictured in the link I provided earlier is the "analog" instrument cluster and has a mechanical speedometer/odometer. There is also a "digital" cluster that I have not seen, but the images that I've seen appear to not have any mechanical needles like yours.

I believe the key to finding the antislosh module is that it is a separate board from the instrument cluster and plugs into it.

FYI, in the analog cluster, the gauges (tach, temperature, fuel level) are magnetic devices that depend on the current ratio running in two coils. In general the two coils are wired in series with one contact to B+ a contact to ground from the second coil, and the sensor connects to the common node. The gauge deflects according to the amount of current drawn out of the common node. See this youtube video for a good explanation https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2vb4oVdOCk

My guess is that your gauges read high because there is a relatively high resistance to ground. Although there are multiple ground wires connecting to the cluster, these join to a common wire before connecting to ground.

Maybe you can find an online picture of a cluster that is a closer match to yours.

[reble]

An update on the fuel gauge problem. The low fuel light came on today at the same time the computer display in the dash panel flashed "LOW FUEL" and the computer says, before I put in more gas, that I had "27 more miles to empty tank". Even though the fuel gauge still reads full. From what I have been reading online about this magnetic analog fuel gauges. I think a ground return line is open or corrosion.

[tomj76]

>"I think a ground return line is open or corrosion."

I think you're on the right track.

[reble]

Now I have a bigger problem. The van won't start. The starter motor won't turn over ether. I have bin able to bypass the cluster and get the starter motor to turn over but there no power getting to the ignition coil. I am working on a bypass for that. But I can only work on the van a few hours in the early morning when it is cool outside. I over heat very easy, a side effect of the med's that I take.

Originally Posted by tomj76

>"I think a ground return line is open or corrosion."

I think you're on the right track.