Bad ground on fans

[shorod]

Originally Posted by Gizrat

My fan also works when it is spun.

Are you saying that if you manually give the fan a kick-start, it will spin? If so, that would indicate a worn fan, probably the brushes. In that case, replacing the fan should fix the issue.

If you want to be sure though that it's not an issue of a connection that cannot support the startup current draw, you could try connecting the fan directly to battery voltage and see if it starts on its own reliably that way.

And since you realize how helpful it would have been if the original poster posted back with what it took to fix the issue, I hope you will take the time to report on what you find to fix yours.

-Rod

[FurryMcMonst]

Guys, Sorry for not following up. I was working on this car for my wife's friend and she suddenly decided to move a couple of hours drive away. (She drove the car and pulled over every time it started to heat up. Mostly highway driving.) It's been sitting in her new driveway all this time.

We'll be going out to visit this weekend and I picked up a couple of fans at a local wrecking yard for $30. They are from a '97 or '98 so I hope they work in a 2000 model. I hooked them up straight to a battery momentarily and they both fired up.

These fans only had two wires going into them so I assume that particular year did not use a braking relay. The connector was the same; it just had two wires and none on the connector in the middle.

I am going to grab three new relays (two cooling and brake relay) and just go ahead and replace the fans and relays and see what happens. She's in a small town so I need to take as much stuff with me as possible to avoid driving around for parts.

I bought the electrical manual for the 2000 model from eBay for $7 including shipping! With the exact pinouts from the schematics I should be able to narrow down the root of this problem with the trusty volt meter. The manual lists everything you would need to know for troubleshooting.

I will report back after the weekend.

[shorod]

Good luck!

-Rod

[Gizrat]

I replaced both fans I got from a local junkyard and my fans now run and to fix the heat issue i was having I replaced all metal lined rubber hoses going to the heater core from the water pump and after the heater core and removed the bypass. Car now has great heat.

[FurryMcMonst]

Success! I replaced both fans and also the low speed relay and everything worked fine.

It took me forever to get the car started. I think something was wrong with my jumper cables so after a long time of cleaning terminals, etc, I finally swapped batteries with the one in my car.

By the time I got to the fans, it was almost time for me to leave to get to a dinner engagement. I put the new relay in right up front and in retrospect, I should have later swapped in the old one to see if it was really bad or not.

My aunt's Taurus had the fans turn on right away when starting the car so I was under the wrong impression. The Taurus I was working on (and another one I checked) don't have the fans turn on until a certain temperature is reached. It actually took quite a few minutes of idling before it happened.

Thanks for all the help here.

[shorod]

Thanks for the follow-up.

Maybe your Aunt had either the A/C or the defroster turned on when you started it. Either of those settings will cause the fans to run. Additionally, the fans will turn on and alter speed based on engine temperature.

-Rod

[flivesay2]

Originally Posted by shorod

Thanks for the follow-up.

Maybe your Aunt had either the A/C or the defroster turned on when you started it. Either of those settings will cause the fans to run. Additionally, the fans will turn on and alter speed based on engine temperature.

-Rod

My fans don't come on with the AC--they do cycle on and off with temperature. what controls them for the AC??

[shorod]

The fans should at least be running when the PCM is calling for the A/C compressor clutch to engage. The fan function with A/C won't be function of the exterior temperature, although the A/C won't work below freezing-ish (might be more like 28 degrees F or something).

-Rod

[flivesay2]

Originally Posted by shorod

The fans should at least be running when the PCM is calling for the A/C compressor clutch to engage. The fan function with A/C won't be function of the exterior temperature, although the A/C won't work below freezing-ish (might be more like 28 degrees F or something).

-Rod

1998 sable with 3L OHC

I can't figure out what tells the fans to run full speed when the AC is on. They do cycle on/off with temp, but my understaning is that when the AC is on, then both fans should run constantly to cool the condensor. When the AC is on and no fan then the AC pressures are all over the map until the temperature cycles them on. Using the shotgun time saving approach, I ordered (rock auto) the temp sensor (ECT?), a new PCM relay and a fan relay this morning. I tried swapping the fan relay with another from the relay box (same number) but no joy and so will probably end up with a spare. If I wack (light wack) the PCM relay with a screw driver handle then all sorts of commotion begins--idles way up, AC compressor goes off, fans go off if they're on and no telling what other unknown functions are disrupted. I dont appear to have the CCRM module but a relay box on the fender side of the battery that I believe takes it's place ? Is there something specific that tells the fans to run when the AC is on??

[shorod]

Your 1998 Sable does not have a CCRM, as you determined. It has has an Engine Compartment Fuse/Relay Box (ECRB) that contains the relays for the A/C clutch and the low speed radiator cooling fan (amongst others). The high speed radiator cooling fan relay is not located within the ECRB, but instead in the Relay Center Box which is located left of the battery, behind the headlight. All three relays are controlled by the PCM. The PCM would turn on the fans at the same time that it engages the compressor clutch. Do you have a multimeter so you can check for signals to the various relays? If you send me a Private Message with an e-mail address for you I can send you a PDF of the cooling fan wiring diagram.

-Rod

[flivesay2]

Originally Posted by shorod

Your 1998 Sable does not have a CCRM, as you determined. It has has an Engine Compartment Fuse/Relay Box (ECRB) that contains the relays for the A/C clutch and the low speed radiator cooling fan (amongst others). The high speed radiator cooling fan relay is not located within the ECRB, but instead in the Relay Center Box which is located left of the battery, behind the headlight. All three relays are controlled by the PCM. The PCM would turn on the fans at the same time that it engages the compressor clutch. Do you have a multimeter so you can check for signals to the various relays? If you send me a Private Message with an e-mail address for you I can send you a PDF of the cooling fan wiring diagram.

-Rod

PM sent---thanks Rod

[Fido2231]

Same here. 2002 Taurus .3.0 New relays, sensor,thermostst,air all bled out of system. power to all 3 relays, no power at fans.. Power input to realy s -yes. & output - no.. Disconnect ECT, no fan movement.. Jumper wire installed on relay & fans run. Turned over junc/box #1 and checked connector's underneath. no obvious loose wires? I'm STUCK.

[flivesay2]

Originally Posted by Fido2231

Same here. 2002 Taurus .3.0 New relays, sensor,thermostst,air all bled out of system. power to all 3 relays, no power at fans.. Power input to realy s -yes. & output - no.. Disconnect ECT, no fan movement.. Jumper wire installed on relay & fans run. Turned over junc/box #1 and checked connector's underneath. no obvious loose wires? I'm STUCK.

It's been awhile, but mine turned out be bad connectors on the fans. Apparently it's a known problem. High resistance--fans would jump with 12v but not work with the harness until the connector was changed. Changed both.