2005 Steering Rack gone bad again

[3echo9]

Anyone know of any root cause for a steering rack to go bad?

I had one replaced in March 2011 at around 84k miles by a highly reputable ASE certified master tech shop. Less than 20k miles later the symptoms have returned. The car shudders up through the steering column when braking or going over a speed bump. It cost over $1,000 for the repair last time.

I think something else may be causing the rack to fail early or there is something that becomes loose over time such as a power steering module.

Thanks

[Tech II]

Anyone know of any root cause for a steering rack to go bad?

I had one replaced in March 2011 at around 84k miles by a highly reputable ASE certified master tech shop. Less than 20k miles later the symptoms have returned. The car shudders up through the steering column when braking or going over a speed bump. It cost over $1,000 for the repair last time.


A steering rack was replaced because of a shudder in the steering column when braking? Was there any problem turning the wheel?


I think something else may be causing the rack to fail early or there is something that becomes loose over time such as a power steering module.

Power steering module? Is this electronic steering(not hydraulic)? If so, was the rack replaced or the the steering column/motor/module?

If electronic, I have seen in some vehicles, a water leak that lands on the steering module and corrodes the contacts in the harness....

[3echo9]

Originally Posted by Tech II

A steering rack was replaced because of a shudder in the steering column when braking? Was there any problem turning the wheel?

Not really. I mean it's not as easy to turn as my LeSabre but still pretty good.

Originally Posted by Tech II

Power steering module? Is this electronic steering(not hydraulic)? If so, was the rack replaced or the the steering column/motor/module?

It was definitely the rack.

Originally Posted by Tech II

If electronic, I have seen in some vehicles, a water leak that lands on the steering module and corrodes the contacts in the harness....

By contacts, do you mean bolts that would corrode and break loose allowing for the shudder? or electronic contacts?

Thanks for the response.

[3echo9]

This is the post that suggested a steering module issue.

"Also be sure to check out the electronic power steering module under the dash. There is a spline shaft that come out of the module. The mating part is held tight with a bolt. On mine i had to loosen it, push the mating part further up and tighten the nut back tight. I was getting a lot of steering wheel shake/shudder after going over bumps and what not. After doing this it stopped for a while. It just started doing it again slightly and I will have to recheck it. it also would do it when i was slowing down to get off the highway which made me think it was the rotors. It wasn't."

Does this seem like a possibility?

[Tech II]

I'm talking about the electrical contacts in the harness to the module being corroded by a water leak.....take apart and look for corrosion....

Also, thought about the rack for 1000 bucks....that rack is not expensive, and because it is not hydraulic, is one of the easiest racks to put in a car....have seen the rack only replaced for a clicking noise when turning left and right.....In some cases it just was a repositioning of the stub shaft on the intermediate shaft and sometimes it was isolating other parts in the engine compartment....

[3echo9]

Originally Posted by Tech II

I'm talking about the electrical contacts in the harness to the module being corroded by a water leak.....take apart and look for corrosion....

Also, thought about the rack for 1000 bucks....that rack is not expensive, and because it is not hydraulic, is one of the easiest racks to put in a car....have seen the rack only replaced for a clicking noise when turning left and right.....In some cases it just was a repositioning of the stub shaft on the intermediate shaft and sometimes it was isolating other parts in the engine compartment....

Going to put the car up on ramps today and do a visual. I'm not sure how the harness having corrosion would allow the rack to physically move. Can you explain that for me?
I did remove the cover to the firewall under the drivers side to check the steering linkage coming through the firewall. There was a little slop in the linkage but that may be by design.
Thanks, again.

[Tech II]

Seems to be a little confusion here......

Going to put the car up on ramps today and do a visual. I'm not sure how the harness having corrosion would allow the rack to physically move. Can you explain that for me?

This is not a hydraulic sstem, so the power to move the rack left and right comes from the motor on the steering column, and is controlled by the module attached to it....if there is corrosion at the harness, due to a water leak, this affect the operation of the electrical motor.....this could be in the form of no power assist, or jerking of the steering wheel as you turn it.....

As I said before, the only times I have seen this rack replaced was due to a clicking sound, when moving the wheel left and right....and this was done after adjusting the intermediate shaft on the stub of the rack....

only way the rack can move is if it is not properly secured to the cradle...

[3echo9]

Originally Posted by Tech II

Seems to be a little confusion here......

Going to put the car up on ramps today and do a visual. I'm not sure how the harness having corrosion would allow the rack to physically move. Can you explain that for me?

This is not a hydraulic sstem, so the power to move the rack left and right comes from the motor on the steering column, and is controlled by the module attached to it....if there is corrosion at the harness, due to a water leak, this affect the operation of the electrical motor.....this could be in the form of no power assist, or jerking of the steering wheel as you turn it.....

As I said before, the only times I have seen this rack replaced was due to a clicking sound, when moving the wheel left and right....and this was done after adjusting the intermediate shaft on the stub of the rack....

only way the rack can move is if it is not properly secured to the cradle...

Thanks for the post. I did see some water that had been dripping in the location of the steering rack but aside from the rust that was starting on the car frame no visible corrosion.

Maybe I didn't describe the symptoms well enough. I'm getting a vibration that feels like something has come loose when braking. If I turn the wheel left or right, the vibration lessons or goes away.

I took a look under the car yesterday and banged around with a rubber mallet looking for anything out of sorts. I smacked everything attached to the wheels. The only thing that rattled was the passenger strut spring. The drivers side was solid.

If this is the problem..I'm confused as to how replacing the steering rack two years ago took care of these same symptoms.

I think it's time to take it to a dealer.

[Ruley73]

Originally Posted by 3echo9

Thanks for the post. I did see some water that had been dripping in the location of the steering rack but aside from the rust that was starting on the car frame no visible corrosion.

Maybe I didn't describe the symptoms well enough. I'm getting a vibration that feels like something has come loose when braking. If I turn the wheel left or right, the vibration lessons or goes away.

I took a look under the car yesterday and banged around with a rubber mallet looking for anything out of sorts. I smacked everything attached to the wheels. The only thing that rattled was the passenger strut spring. The drivers side was solid.

If this is the problem..I'm confused as to how replacing the steering rack two years ago took care of these same symptoms.

I think it's time to take it to a dealer.

I still don't think you're still understanding Tech II correctly. The electric motor and module are located inside the cabin under the dash so they are protected from the outside elements. Unlike a hydraulic-assisted setup, the electric motor does not provide assistance at the rack. It provides assistance by propelling the steering shaft in the steering column. In other words, rather than making the rack easier to move with the steering wheel like in a hydraulic-assisted setup, the electronic assist helps you turn the steering wheel.

The only part of the steering system that is visible from under the hood is the rack itself. The rack on the Equinox is similar to a manual rack on a vehicle without power steering. It does not wear out like a rack in a hydraulic-assisted setup so they rarely need replacement.

steering_diagram.JPG

What Tech II is saying is that he/she has observed instances where water somehow leaked inside the cabin and onto the motor/module causing the contacts to corrode which caused the electric assist to malfunction or not work at all.

[3echo9]

Originally Posted by Ruley73

I still don't think you're still understanding Tech II correctly. The electric motor and module are located inside the cabin under the dash so they are protected from the outside elements. Unlike a hydraulic-assisted setup, the electric motor does not provide assistance at the rack. It provides assistance by propelling the steering shaft in the steering column. In other words, rather than making the rack easier to move with the steering wheel like in a hydraulic-assisted setup, the electronic assist helps you turn the steering wheel.

The only part of the steering system that is visible from under the hood is the rack itself. The rack on the Equinox is similar to a manual rack on a vehicle without power steering. It does not wear out like a rack in a hydraulic-assisted setup so they rarely need replacement.

Attachment 49345

What Tech II is saying is that he/she has observed instances where water somehow leaked inside the cabin and onto the motor/module causing the contacts to corrode which caused the electric assist to malfunction or not work at all.

I guess I was confused as to how the rack should have behaved given the corroded connectors. Mine works fine outside of braking at speeds above 50mph where it shimmies/bounces/vibrates (hard to describe).

I did pull the cover under the dash to view the steering linkage as it comes through the firewall. Everything looked fine. I did notice a little slop in the shaft.

Thanks for the help.

[gmtech1]

Originally Posted by 3echo9

I guess I was confused as to how the rack should have behaved given the corroded connectors. Mine works fine outside of braking at speeds above 50mph where it shimmies/bounces/vibrates (hard to describe).

I did pull the cover under the dash to view the steering linkage as it comes through the firewall. Everything looked fine. I did notice a little slop in the shaft.

Thanks for the help.

Are you sure you're not experiencing a brake pulsation and not a steering problem at all? If the steering shakes when braking, it's a brake pulsation caused by warped rotors. They will either need to be replaced or resurfaced.

[Tech II]

I agree GMTech1.....but he was adamant that these were the same symptoms that were fixed by replacing the rack, previously....didn't make sense to me either....

[3echo9]

Originally Posted by Tech II

I agree GMTech1.....but he was adamant that these were the same symptoms that were fixed by replacing the rack, previously....didn't make sense to me either....

I can see how you would come to that conclusion but I'm very familiar with how warped rotors feel. In fact, they replaced the rotors when they replaced the rack less two years ago. My wife worked from home for most of the last two years which is why there was only about 16,000 miles on these rotors since they were replaced with the rack.

These suspension problems are extremely difficult to diagnose from someones description of symptoms.

I'll just have to admit that I'm not going to be able to fix this one and take it to the dealer this time.

Thanks for the advice though.

[Tech II]

I can see how you would come to that conclusion but I'm very familiar with how warped rotors feel. In fact, they replaced the rotors when they replaced the rack less two years ago.

Now we hear the rest of the story.....how do you know that it wasn't the rotors that solved your problem and not the rack, the first time?

[3echo9]

Originally Posted by Tech II

I can see how you would come to that conclusion but I'm very familiar with how warped rotors feel. In fact, they replaced the rotors when they replaced the rack less two years ago.

Now we hear the rest of the story.....how do you know that it wasn't the rotors that solved your problem and not the rack, the first time?

LOL it was two years ago. OK, luckily I have the invoice.

4/01/2011 with odometer 78,958.

Replace: Complete Power Steering Rack and Pinion Assembly Using; HD Premium Davidson Brand parts
Reset PCM & Perform Relearn Procedures
Resurface Front Disc Brake Rotors (my mistake, my recollection was that they replaced them)
1.00 1,063.88 (plus tax)
Complete Power Steering Fluid as Required
Chemically Power Flush & Fill Using; Service Pro Power Steering Flush Chemicals & Additives & Pennzoil Premium Power Steering Fluid as Required
Complete Four Wheel Computerized Thrust Alignment Includes: adjusting, caster, camber, toe & SAI as Required