Brake Lights - safe to drive?

[old89lsc]

I recently (1 week) had my brake pressure switch replaced under recall. It was leaking. Prior to replacement, the red brake light and ABS light came on together, once.

After the switch was replaced, drove about 230 miles over a couple of days with no problem, but driving home last night the red brake and ABS brake lights came on driving home. The brakes felt fine and the fluid level was okay as well. From searching around, this is indicative of a bad ABS control module. The question that I have is whether or not this is safe to drive on. If it was just the ABS light, I would not be as concerned.

Apart from the dealer, where could I go (Autozone? Meineke?) to get the codes from the brake system?

Again, my basic question is the safeness of the system. Apart from the obvious fact that if a problem should occur, the red light will already be on so that there will be no warning.

[Airjer_]

If just the brake light was on than I would be more concerned. In this instance I would bet the brake light is on because the ABS light is one. When the ABS light is on the ABS will not work. The ABS requires the use of the brake system in order to operate. The brake system does not require the ABS system to operate (in most instances). So the brakes should function as they would under normal driving/braking conditions however they ABS will not work if there is a situation where it would be needed.

[tomj76]

The red light could be indicating that the parking brake is set, or that the detection switch circuit is faulty. The switch is on the handle. I recall taking mine out once for cleaning or something.

[Airjer_]

I'm pretty sure the brake light is on because the ABS light is on.

[wiswind]

I would recommend you double check the brake fluid level in the master cylinder.
If it is even slightly low.....not all the way up to the FULL line, you could get these lights (both of them) due to the low fluid level sensor.
This is the most simple thing that it could be.....and a very common cause of this problem.....the fluid moves around in there while you are driving.......

After that.......I would have a shop read the code(s) to see if the ABS light might be caused by a wheel sensor.
If this is the case.....the code will tell you which wheel sensor is giving the indication.
It might be a simple need to clean brake dust or slightly adjust the distance of the sensor from the exciter ring.
The exciter ring looks like a big gear on the axle........and the teeth of the gear create a pulse when they pass the sensor.
It is common for the rear ones (but can happen to the front as well) to be bumped slightly out of place and be too far from the exciter ring to pick sense the teeth passing.

[old89lsc]

Originally Posted by wiswind

I would recommend you double check the brake fluid level in the master cylinder.
If it is even slightly low.....not all the way up to the FULL line, you could get these lights (both of them) due to the low fluid level sensor.
This is the most simple thing that it could be.....and a very common cause of this problem.....the fluid moves around in there while you are driving.......

After that.......I would have a shop read the code(s) to see if the ABS light might be caused by a wheel sensor.
If this is the case.....the code will tell you which wheel sensor is giving the indication.
It might be a simple need to clean brake dust or slightly adjust the distance of the sensor from the exciter ring.
The exciter ring looks like a big gear on the axle........and the teeth of the gear create a pulse when they pass the sensor.
It is common for the rear ones (but can happen to the front as well) to be bumped slightly out of place and be too far from the exciter ring to pick sense the teeth passing.

I can certainly add some fluid, it is not quite full (max) but is more than half full. That being said, the level had been lower due to the leaking switch, was about the min line, without giving much trouble (red brake light came on once).

I certainly need to go to a shop, but I would think that a wheel sensor error would give the ABS light and not the red brake light. Since they both came on at the same time, I would guess that it would be a problem that would trigger both. However, I really don't know the brake system on this van and will have to learn.

[Airjer_]

The brake light will come on when the ABS light comes on. The ABS light will not come on if the fluid is low. Only the brake light will come on if the fluid is low.

[old89lsc]

Originally Posted by Airjer_

The brake light will come on when the ABS light comes on. The ABS light will not come on if the fluid is low. Only the brake light will come on if the fluid is low.

I guess the point that you have been trying to get through my thick skull is that the red brake light is on because the ABS light is on. I think it was wrong of Ford to do it this way.

My intermittent problem continues to be intermittent. I took the van for a drive around the block in the evening last night, no brake lights. Will errors in the brake system remain in the system if the warning lights are out?

[Airjer_]

Most of the vehicle manufacturers do the same thing with the brake/abs lights. Vehicles with traction control will illuminate the traction off lights any time the check engine light is on and of course people think there is a problem with there traction control.

There should be something stored. Sounds like it could be an intermittent speed sensor issue to me as well but could also be a half dozen other things.

[tomj76]

I'm nearly certain that the ABS Warning light can come on without the Brake Warning light. For example, I've had the ABS Warning light on when the fluid was low, but not low enough to trigger the Brake Warning light.

http://autos.yahoo.com/maintain/repa...ques010_0.html

[Airjer_]

Originally Posted by tomj76

For example, I've had the ABS Warning light on when the fluid was low, but not low enough to trigger the Brake Warning light.

The ABS light will not come on for low fluid! the only thing that monitors low fluid is the fluid level switch. When it gets to a certain point it turns on the light. There is no in between. It doesn't know if its a little low, it only knows when its low enough to turn on the light.

[mark_gober]

Originally Posted by old89lsc

I guess the point that you have been trying to get through my thick skull is that the red brake light is on because the ABS light is on. I think it was wrong of Ford to do it this way.

My intermittent problem continues to be intermittent. I took the van for a drive around the block in the evening last night, no brake lights. Will errors in the brake system remain in the system if the warning lights are out?

Not too pick sides here, but I have something going on on my 2000 Windstar that will occassionally set the ABS light. (I suspect a marginal wheel sensor). Anyway, when my ABS light lights up, the brake light DOES NOT illuminate. (and it does work)

If it were me, I'd contact the dealer who performed your warranty work and describe the problem as present now and not present before the warranty work. At a minimum, you'd probably get them to pull the ABS codes for you.

Mark

[mark_gober]

Originally Posted by old89lsc

I guess the point that you have been trying to get through my thick skull is that the red brake light is on because the ABS light is on. I think it was wrong of Ford to do it this way.

My intermittent problem continues to be intermittent. I took the van for a drive around the block in the evening last night, no brake lights. Will errors in the brake system remain in the system if the warning lights are out?

Not too pick sides here, but I have something going on on my 2000 Windstar that will occassionally set the ABS light. (I suspect a marginal wheel sensor). Anyway, when my ABS light lights up, the brake light DOES NOT illuminate. (and it does work)

If it were me, I'd contact the dealer who performed your warranty work and describe the problem as present now and not present before the warranty work. At a minimum, you'd probably get them to pull the ABS codes for you.

Mark

[danielsatur]

If the front brake pads are worn bad it takes more fluid, thus can trigger an ABS light.
Make sure all wheel speed sensors are cleaned.