Told you's so!!

[RahX]

As an ASE L1 certified Tech with 10 years of official 'under the hood' and an additional 6ish years of unofficial 'under the hood' experience, Electric power steering is here and it isn't going anywhere. Just like drive by wire and other electrical replacements for traditionally mechanical devices. They fly newer planes with electronics and no direct control and in the near future cars will be on the same path. They already have cars that can park in a spot by themselves.

[RidingOnRailz]

Originally Posted by RahX

As an ASE L1 certified Tech with 10 years of official 'under the hood' and an additional 6ish years of unofficial 'under the hood' experience, Electric power steering is here and it isn't going anywhere. Just like drive by wire and other electrical replacements for traditionally mechanical devices. They fly newer planes with electronics and no direct control and in the near future cars will be on the same path. They already have cars that can park in a spot by themselves.

I'll be sure to look you up when I need the electric PS disabled should I end up driving a car with it.

[shorod]

Originally Posted by SmoothHandler

Do I look like someone who works in DC? I've actually been under a hood you know. The current generation Optima(2006.5 to present) has a good ole fashioned PS reservoir and plumbing reaching into the nether reaches of that engine bay.

I know VW's electric PS has been so far transparent(indistinguishable from its hydraulic predecessors) according to the serious magazines, but that is the exception - not the rule.

So you "suspected" my car has EPS? You must not be one of AF's "scratched knuckles" or "greasy elbow"s. I know they're on here somewhere!

Interesting, every car I've owned since my 1998 Taurus SHO has had some form of electronic assist for the power steering. Since Kia is doing a pretty good job of looking forward, I hoped such technology had found its way in to their cars as well. Maybe their next generation of Optima will have it.

I do spend a fair amount of time under the hood of cars, I've been under the hood of cars since I was in preschool, shadowing my dad at his shop after being picked up from morning preschool. When I got to be a sophomore in college Dad told me I needed to stop working on cars and find a job more related to my electrical engineering career path. So I am not a licensed or even professional technician, cars have just been one of my hobbies for the last 15 years and I haven't had a lot of opportunities to work on Kias.

I too can tell a difference between hydraulic and electric power steering. Personally I like the feel of steering that is easy at parking lot speeds, but stiffer (and not over-boosted) at highway speeds or on the track. To each their own, and I'm not about to suggest that the feel I prefer needs to be mandated, just like I would not suggest that non-electric power steering (which other drivers may prefer) be banned. Based on my experience in the engineering field, no matter how much debugging and qualification takes place in the laboratory or demonstrations, it's not a surprise when more widespread use allows issues to be discovered.

-Rod

[RahX]

Kia uses it but i'm pretty sure it only on the Forte and Soul as an option. Disabling it would leave you with a manual rack at whatever ratio it is :o

[RidingOnRailz]

Originally Posted by shorod

I too can tell a difference between hydraulic and electric power steering. Personally I like the feel of steering that is easy at parking lot speeds, but stiffer (and not over-boosted) at highway speeds or on the track.

-Rod

Agree with you 110% on the above statement. My challenge to the industry: Achieve that exact combination, achieve it well, and achieve it economically for the 80% of drivers who cannot affort a German or high-end Japanese luxury sedan which usually have VPS.

I even suggested this elsewhere - and it might actually be easier to achieve with electric/electronic PS: A dashboard push-button solution where the driver can pick the amount of assist/road feel from, say, three options. ALL would have the same level of assist at parking, but would taper down at different ratios. Max would barely taper down at all before highway speeds, Normal is, well, NORMAL. And Sport, the assist would drop off to nonexistent above 20mph.

Perhaps: "Max"(Buick feel), "Normal", and "Sport"(somewhere between my Kia and what a Ferrari might feel like). And of course the selection could be made only with a foot on the brake pedal - sensors, anyone?

Rod if there exists - which it does - a software that will adjust the volumes of all your mp3s so you never have to rush for the volume knob again, couldn't the above be achieved for power steering? Let's see here . . . Bluetooth mp3 playing phones, 1080 lines of HD resolution in our living rooms, MRI machines in hospitals, the International Space Station - aannnd:

complaints of numb steering on the cars most folks buy every day.

Which of the things I named doesn't fit into this picture? Will the auto mfgs get it??

[shorod]

The manufacturers will probably look at it as an added expense for a switch and software modifications that few people will want to pay for and even fewer will do anything with. Some of those German and Japanese sports cars, even some American cars, already offer this feature which is integrated with throttle responsiveness, when the stability control kicks in, suspension settings, etc. The switchable feature tends to be in cars where people may actually use it and know when to use it.

-Rod

[consultIII]

Originally Posted by SmoothHandler

Agree with you 110% on the above statement. My challenge to the industry: Achieve that exact combination, achieve it well, and achieve it economically for the 80% of drivers who cannot affort a German or high-end Japanese luxury sedan which usually have VPS.

I even suggested this elsewhere - and it might actually be easier to achieve with electric/electronic PS: A dashboard push-button solution where the driver can pick the amount of assist/road feel from, say, three options. ALL would have the same level of assist at parking, but would taper down at different ratios. Max would barely taper down at all before highway speeds, Normal is, well, NORMAL. And Sport, the assist would drop off to nonexistent above 20mph.

Perhaps: "Max"(Buick feel), "Normal", and "Sport"(somewhere between my Kia and what a Ferrari might feel like). And of course the selection could be made only with a foot on the brake pedal - sensors, anyone?

Rod if there exists - which it does - a software that will adjust the volumes of all your mp3s so you never have to rush for the volume knob again, couldn't the above be achieved for power steering? Let's see here . . . Bluetooth mp3 playing phones, 1080 lines of HD resolution in our living rooms, MRI machines in hospitals, the International Space Station - aannnd:

complaints of numb steering on the cars most folks buy every day.

Which of the things I named doesn't fit into this picture? Will the auto mfgs get it??

That would be a great innovation; pick your level of assist. I like it!

[Moppie]

Originally Posted by SmoothHandler

I even suggested this elsewhere - and it might actually be easier to achieve with electric/electronic PS: A dashboard push-button solution where the driver can pick the amount of assist/road feel from, say, three options. ALL would have the same level of assist at parking, but would taper down at different ratios. Max would barely taper down at all before highway speeds, Normal is, well, NORMAL. And Sport, the assist would drop off to nonexistent above 20mph.

Honda have been doing this since 2000 in several Japanese models of the Accord, Civic and Stream.
They have a 3 position switch that adjusts both the amount of assist and the ratio.

[RidingOnRailz]

Originally Posted by Moppie

Honda have been doing this since 2000 in several Japanese models of the Accord, Civic and Stream.
They have a 3 position switch that adjusts both the amount of assist and the ratio.

That statement tells me everything. Either the majority of Americans want index-finger steering or the car companies presume they want it! I'd love to import that Accord or Civic!

[CL8]

This is interesting I now drive a 2010 Toyota Corolla and teach students to drive in it!

I was doing an "under the hood check" a couple weeks ago with a student and was trying to locate the power steering fluid container.
There was none I could find.

Do EPS cars not need power steering fluid because they don't use the hydraulic system?

Also the only steering problem with steering I have had in the 3000 miles I've driven it is a loud grinding sound when backing and turning (out of driveways)

Could this be related to the same problem?

Thanks

cl8

[RahX]

MOST electronic power steering is all built into the column or rack. Mazda uses and electric pump but still has a hydraulic system.

[shorod]

The loud grinding when backing and turning is more likely to be a problem with the rear drum brakes, a tire rubbing on a fender liner, or an outer CV joint. As RahX mentioned, some systems use hydraulic power steering with electric assist, others are fully electric and would not require any hydraulic power steering fluid. Maybe you should be teaching the students the importance of an owner's manual for their car which will explain what items to check periodically.

-Rod

[CL8]

Originally Posted by shorod

. Maybe you should be teaching the students the importance of an owner's manual for their car which will explain what items to check periodically.

-Rod

That we do, although in my Toyota Echo manual I found it said nothing about checking transmission fluid and very little about battery maintenance.

Those manuals aren't always as thorough as they should be!

[Moppie]

Originally Posted by CL8

That we do, although in my Toyota Echo manual I found it said nothing about checking transmission fluid and very little about battery maintenance.

Those manuals aren't always as thorough as they should be!

Sealed battery, so no need to maintain it, just replace it when it dies.
The manual gear box, like most manuals, requires the removal of the fill plug to check the oil level. Not something the average owner is able to do.

[CL8]

Originally Posted by Moppie

Sealed battery, so no need to maintain it, just replace it when it dies.
The manual gear box, like most manuals, requires the removal of the fill plug to check the oil level. Not something the average owner is able to do.

I thought we were talking about OWNERS manuals, not manual transmissions!

And even sealed batteries do get corrosion on them, so from time to time there is battery maintenance of cleaning the terminals.

Also one student Had a battery in the back of her vehicle in the bottom of the trunk, the owners manual didn't say where the battery was!