Help deciding on the head gasket or new/er engine

[nmikmik]

My son's 95 Camry 2.2 with 221k on it, finally has shown where the coolant was disappearing - the head gasket developed a leak right in the front, above the freeze plug. I am not going to tackle it myself although I've done it before and know what's involved. My back is just too shot for this kind of job and he needs his car by the end of the week plus I am not that fast anymore
I called around and got a quotes for the head gasket $1500 - way above what I think is fare, although including all the parts like TB and WP
I also called a place where I've got engines before they gave me two options:
2.2 engine for $1250 - ouch!
2.0 engine for $550 more reasonable but still kind of ouch
plus the installation would cost me $900 from the local guy.

Any suggestions?

[Mike Gerber]

The answer to whether or not you do the head gasket really depends on how strong the engine was at 221,000 before you noticed the head gasket leak. You are the best one to answer that. You can't do an accurate compression check now that the head gasket is leaking, so you have to be your own judge based on what you already know about the car. Was the engine consuming any oil before this? Were the oil changes done regularly? Were the other fluids chnged regularly? How did the engine pull before this? Maybe you can pull the cam cover off yourself and try to visually inspect how clean everything on top is. Best suggestions I can think of off hand. The other thing to consider is that the engines you mentioned are used engines, judging from the prices you quoted. What do you really know about those engines. Used engines are like a crap shoot IMHO.

Mike

[MagicRat]

The gasket is leaking to the outside of the engine, correct? So, this implies that the gasket is still sealing elsewhere, and it is not burning coolant, there is no coolant in the oil and no compression getting into the cooling system, right?

If this is the case, I would just get some good-quality radiator stop-leak and put it in. You could get many months more use, or more, before you run into any more trouble.
For the $5 cost, its worth the effort.

Otherwise, imo, the car may be done. As noted above, that's a lot of miles and unless you have done extensive work elsewhere, other expensive failures may be just around the corner. So the car is not worth the cost of repair unless you know the rest of it is in exceptionally good condition.

[nmikmik]

thanks for your reply guys!
I realize it is a tall order to judge without seeing the vehicle and knowing it's history. The reason why I am so torn between different options is the amount of maintenance that was done on the car. I bought it with 145k from the lady that had extended warranty on it and I received a maintenance records about 2" high from her when I bought it. I always maintained synthetic oil and transmission fluid since I bought it, replaced struts, brake cylinders and calipers amongst other little things like tires etc. and it had a fresh coat (3) of paint last year. The problem is that my son is not as vigilant about the car as I am so many things go unnoticed until I remind him - hey it's time to check yada-yada. I am sure he is annoyed by me very much.
I think I am going to let him decide what he want's to do when he comes back from CES on Monday. He paid half for this car so now he can take responsibility and do whatever he feels the rite choice, I am out of cash anyway
thanks again for chiming in,
btw I still have a bottle of head gasket repair somewhere so that could be a good option ha?

[danielsatur]

I would consider a cheap new used car.

[MagicRat]

Originally Posted by danielsatur

I would consider a cheap new used car.

I thought of that too, and I looked st the San Diego Craigslist. For some reason, used cars are significantly more expensive there than here in Toronto..... maybe because thing rust to sh*t here

Judging by prices, it makes a bit of sense to fix this one.

[nmikmik]

yea I did look at the Craig's but they are too much. For about 3 grand you can get a high mileage Corolla that actually would be a little better choice considering the gas mileage.

[Mike Gerber]

If the body is solid and the paint is new as you say (You don't have a big rust issue in San Diego), the only other major problem could be the transmission. Has the fluid been changed regularly? Does it shift smoothly? I have a 94 5SFE and it still shifts as smooth as butter, but I only have 92,000 miles on it. Rethinking this with the new paint factored in, why not price a rebuilt 2.2 5SFE engine. You mentioned $1200 for a used engine with $900 to install it. If the rest of the car is solid, price out a rebuilt engine. The install will be the same and you should get a guarantee with a rebuilt you probably will not get with a used engine. You may get many more years out of the car with a rebuilt engine. Just another thing to consider. May be worth a phone call or 2.

Mike

[nmikmik]

No transmission feels fine, just that never ending vibration in gear (which is not the tranny issue) that is bothersome. I am actually more worried about the PS on this car, it has never been replaced although maintained. This transmission actually shifts smoother than my wife's 05. Considering the fact that (i hope!) he is out of the house in couple of years I don't give that car too much time to live. As soon as I am not there he is going to neglect the car as much as humanly possible. So I really don't want to spend any more money (actually can't) on the car that is going to be destroyed. I'll try the head gasket repair first if it doesn't work will revisit this issue again.
Thanks again for your help!

[JOET/CAMRY]

Originally Posted by MagicRat

The gasket is leaking to the outside of the engine, correct? So, this implies that the gasket is still sealing elsewhere, and it is not burning coolant, there is no coolant in the oil and no compression getting into the cooling system, right?

If this is the case, I would just get some good-quality radiator stop-leak and put it in. You could get many months more use, or more, before you run into any more trouble.
For the $5 cost, its worth the effort.

I had an external head gasket leak on an old beater 1983 Nissan 4+4 pickup I owned in the past. I cleaned up the area where the leak was with degreaser and patched the leak with epoxy putty. Here is a pic of the carton it came in.



The patch held for almost a whole year. When it eventually let go I scraped off all the old stuff and cleaned the area to make sure I removed any oil or grease and reapplied the stuff again. A cheap temporary fix.

JOET/CAMRY

[danielsatur]

I picked up a beautiful platinum silver s type jaguar for $3k 2years ago, they said it needed a new Engine.
Wrong, See AF-> jaguar -> S-Type
$3k + $1 in parts

[nmikmik]

I was not sure if i can reach the leaking spot well enough to seal it good or at least long enough to hold until he decides what to do. So I used Bars "head gasket repair" and it seems to work so far. I just have to leave it for another 24hrs airing it out according to instructions & we'll see how well it actually worked. For now I already spent about a $100 on sp. plug wires, sp plugs and the repair. Looks like will need a radiator as well because Bars stuff looks like (i have not flushed the system yet) plugs things pretty well. What I don't get is how come his radiator is so calcified, I always used either a distilled water diluted coolant or premixed 50/50.
As far as gasket goes I am still concerned with coolant going into the cylinder(s) or at least if it used to seep in. Please take a look at he spark plugs and let me know what you think. Not sure if the shot is good enough to see the thick brownish deposit on pretty much all four of them. From my previous encounters with leaking gaskets coolant/water usually cleans up the spark plugs pretty well. btw, this engine was sea foamed about 2 month ago.
Thanks & sorry for the rant

[Mike Gerber]

I can't really see your pictures well enough to get a clear image of the tips of the plugs. Maybe try to get a clearer picture. In my experience a well running engine will have just a very slight bit of a tan deposits on the plug tips.

Mike

[nmikmik]

thanks, that has been my exp. as well, these have a bunch more, unless I pull the head we'll never know why. I think I got an answer about 50/50 coolant. Here is a snipped from the parts store add:

Detailed Description

Prestone 50/50 Ready-to-use Prediluted Extended Life Antifreeze/ Coolant features a blend of 50% antifreeze/coolant for temperature and corrosion protection and 50% demineralized water for heat transfer protection.


demineralized does not mean distilled in my book. I'll stick with diluting it myself I guess.