Brakes Recommendations

[00GTP4ME]

Hi All,

One of the things that amazed me about this car when I first bought it was the braking. This thing stopped on a dime. I did noticed that the rotors would warp a little though.
Well the day came when the rotors and pads needed to be replaced. So to try and get around the warping, I went and got some drilled and slotted rotors....off of....ebay (I know, I know.)
They sure looked cool when I first put them on, but then my braking distance about doubled. My Jeeps stops WAY better than my car does and my Jeep has crappy brakes.
Well that was a few years ago and the time to replace these things will be coming up soon. So I have a couple questions. First, the rotors:

Should I get regular solid cast rotors like I had before or should I get higher quality drilled and/or slotted rotors from somewhere else?

On the pads, the best stopping I had was when I was using ceramic pads on regular rotors. The only problem was the the rotors wore down fairly quickly and would get rather hot. I like the look of drilled/slotted rotors, but heard that you have to use soft pads on those kinds of rotors. I know I have soft pads on right now (they came with the rotors), and they are wearing fine with no warping to the rotors, but I also have no stopping!

The bottom line is that I want the best stopping power I can get without my rotors warping after a few weeks. Any suggestions?

Thanks!

[CrazyHorst]

Couple of things. Strut performance has a larger affect on your front brake life and duty cycle than you'd think....so that is something else to consider as a maintenance item if you are not getting the lift you want.

The softer pads, while not wearing out the rotor as fast, also perform better at low temperatures...the more aggressive pads need some warmup before they start working. The OEM pads and rotors are of course a blend of all the different characteristics.

But...they are what I've always used with good success in my thinking...but not sure my need for brakes is the same as yours.

Depending on how much salt they are digging out of the lake to put on the roads, it might also be time for some new/reman calipers...I did this project last year with good success as my cage had spent all previous years in Michigan. I did the 4-wheel brake flush at that time too.

Only advice is to go slow with longer distances and gentle applications after you put in new parts...(within reason...don't crash the car to preserve the brake-break-in schedule) give this a couple of tanks of gas before you get back into normal mode.

Also you mentioned solid rotors...I only have those on the back...the fronts are cast vented design. I think part of the issue with the drilled rotors is that they take away some of the contact area...not alot...but enough to be felt thru the seat of your pants, and most of us can't drive hard enough to take advantage of the extra cooling.

To go off on a tangent that might not add value, the Best Brakes I've yet owned were on a 2001 Trailblazer which I attributed to double piston calipers. My thoughts were that any warping which you'd normally feel thru a single-piston design was equalized right at the caliper...in other words as one piston is riding out the other is riding in and so there is no volume change that would be normally hydraulically transmitted back thru the master cylinder and pedal. In any case, nice brakes.

[grandprixgtx00]

just do the GXP brake conversion and call it a day

i was seriously concidering this, until i found out they wont fit with the original 16" rims

but anyways...i use ceramic raybestos pads and regular rotors. awesome stopping power, minimal brake dust, and i dont have a problem with warping rotors. but then again...I'm fairly easy on my brakes

[00GTP4ME]

Originally Posted by CrazyHorst

Couple of things. Strut performance has a larger affect on your front brake life and duty cycle than you'd think....so that is something else to consider as a maintenance item if you are not getting the lift you want.

I never would have thought the struts would do anything to the brakes at all, that's really interesting. And to top it off, I've been wanting to replace them for a while now because my Jeep has a much better ride than the GTP does and that's just sad. They definitely need to be replaced and it's definitely on my list.

Originally Posted by grandprixgtx00

just do the GXP brake conversion and call it a day

i was seriously concidering this, until i found out they wont fit with the original 16" rims

but anyways...i use ceramic raybestos pads and regular rotors. awesome stopping power, minimal brake dust, and i dont have a problem with warping rotors. but then again...I'm fairly easy on my brakes

Yep. I got the 16's.

That's the exact same set-up I had before and while it worked great for stopping, I got warping. Of course I used to be a little more aggressive a few years ago, and might not have that problem now that most of it is out of my system. Who knows.

I'm leaning on going with ceramic pads and drilled rotors and just seeing what happens, but I just don't know.

Does anyone know if rotors have grades and what they are? Is there like a standard that you can see if the rotor meets?

[tblake]

drilled and slotted rotors are actually sometimes mis-understood. Like Crazyhorst mentioned, the less surface area actually increases the stopping distance. The only real benefit of drilled and slotted rotors is that "gas fade" wont occur. Have you ever heated up a set of brakes so much that they actually wont stop no matter how har you step on the pedal? Its because the gas particles get trapped between the bad and rotor. Drilled rotors allow this gas to excape thus allowing to stop.

Its confusing, try google.

I also have a complete set or Raybestos bads and rotors. (the coated kind of rotor) and I painted my caliper to match and applied a custom "grand prix" decal.





I know, I know, a little dirty. I was so proud of my new brake job I just had to take pictures, and it was going to rain that afternoon so no point in washing it.

[doctorhrdware]

What rain are you taking about?

[richtazz]

on the warping. Do you torque your wheel nuts to factory spec after doing a brake job? do you recheck the torque after a few hundred miles to insure they didn't loosend due to heat/cool cycles? If not, brake rotor warpage is almost guaranteed!

[00GTP4ME]

Originally Posted by tblake

I know, I know, a little dirty. I was so proud of my new brake job I just had to take pictures, and it was going to rain that afternoon so no point in washing it.

Dude. Do those tires have any tread on them?

Originally Posted by richtazz

on the warping. Do you torque your wheel nuts to factory spec after doing a brake job? do you recheck the torque after a few hundred miles to insure they didn't loosend due to heat/cool cycles? If not, brake rotor warpage is almost guaranteed!

By wheel nuts do you also mean lug nuts? If so, then yes; I torque them every time the tire goes on/off. I'm not sure what the factory specs are though, so I usually torque at 100 lbs. So maybe there's my problem?

[rkvons]

Originally Posted by richtazz

on the warping. Do you torque your wheel nuts to factory spec after doing a brake job? do you recheck the torque after a few hundred miles to insure they didn't loosend due to heat/cool cycles? If not, brake rotor warpage is almost guaranteed!

Yeah, about this. I've found that it is less critical how tight they are then how they are tightened. Naturally if your hub has rust on it, you are going to make your rotor conform to it and warp. But when I mount my wheels, I make sure the surfaces are clean, then I put the wheel on and tighten by hand each lug nut while trying to wiggle the wheel. I go around and around until I can't tighten any by hand anymore, and then I do the torque sequence. I do not think I go to 100 ft-lbs. I just snug them up good using a four-sided lug wrench. I do not have warpage on any vehicles anymore.

[tblake]

Originally Posted by 00GTP4ME

Dude. Do those tires have any tread on them?....

Yeah, about half used up. I thing I may have a toe issue because the outer edge is worn more than the inside. Stupid tires plus aligned to a bad wheel bearing, and when I went to replace it, is when i started to notice a tow in issue.

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by 00GTP4ME

I'm not sure what the factory specs are though, so I usually torque at 100 lbs.

Then that is correct. 100 lb-ft. Also, follow a star pattern.

It never ceases to amaze how people or shops do not properly torque the lug nuts. I guess everyone is properly calibrated.

Originally Posted by grandprixgtx00

but anyways...i use ceramic raybestos pads and regular rotors.

Good choice but I would use the Raybestos Advanced Technology rotors. Best deal going and excellent quality and stopping power even though they are now Made in China.

[grandprixgtx00]

Originally Posted by BNaylor

even though they are now Made in China.

yeah, along with 70% of other things here in America I'll have to try them next time i need rotors though

[00GTP4ME]

Originally Posted by BNaylor

Then that is correct. 100 lb-ft. Also, follow a star pattern.

It never ceases to amaze how people or shops do not properly torque the lug nuts. I guess everyone is properly calibrated.


Good choice but I would use the Raybestos Advanced Technology rotors. Best deal going and excellent quality and stopping power even though they are now Made in China.

Yes, yes, star pattern every time.

Raybestos Advanced Technology rotors? AKA "RAT" rotors? j/k. Are those a special order item or can you get them anywhere?

[HotZ28]

I concur with Bob concerning Raybestos Advanced Technology rotors. I have been using them for 2-yrs with much abuse! They are great even after bluing somewhat. I have completely worn out one set of Raybestos QS ceramic pads and the rotors are still vibration free! I recently replaced the pads with Akebono ceramic, (cost more) and they are good, but not quite the stopping power as QS when cold, but after they warm up, they are equal. Anyway, ATD rotors & QS pads are the best combination available for the money! BTW, you can order Raybestos rotors & pads from Rock Auto.

Speaking of China:

Yesterday, while speaking in Beijing’s Great Hall of the People, President Obama paid tribute to China for its economic successes. It’s amazing what can be accomplished with child slave labor. Jay Leno

[00GTP4ME]

So unless I'm driving NASCAR, drilled and/or slotted probably is going to be more of a disadvantage instead of an advantage?