Question on new models

[guiwee]

Originally Posted by PeterGrave5

tamiya did the mustang from the 90s...*shrugs* but really why fight revell its not like revell is fighting them, everyone comfortable in they're markets.

I thought the idea of big business was to expand your markets
Look at the car manufacturers its what they do theyre constantly
trying to open new markets.

On second thought maybe the fact that they dont do that or have that
philosophy Little off topic..sorry

[scale auto style]

Originally Posted by guiwee

Wow!! Thanks guys that really clears things up. But just raises other questions.
I.e. fujimi and revell dont have these problems also? They seem to make a lot more
of kits. I think fujimi is based in japan. revell in germany so whats their approach because they put out way more kits.

fujimi don't do more kit.. check theire line..

skyline ( over 25 different boxing )
lancer .. etc...

if you took one of each kit by year and manufacturer. ex: skyline from 89-94 etc.. you will se fujimi doesn't produce a lot of kit.

because when they license for the qty... they split it in different boxing.

for revell... they release in average 2 kit per years ( including the miltary ) but a lot of RE-issuing or RE-poping kit. ex: the charger. they release it originally and a couple time after RE-release it with a different boxing and put DUB wheel in the box. if you took that for a new kit. fine... but not for me. instead of releasing a complete kit i will prefer they release un aftermarket part for the original kit. byt his way they will produce a highr volume of the original and the price will also be affect. less expensive.

but this is my philosophy..

yours

[hirofkd]

While you were on hiatus, Tamiya has transformed into an R/C company with a surviving/dying (depending on your perspective) plastic model division. In order to keep it open, they have to pick profitable items, and only a few automotive subjects have made to their to-do list, such as GT-R and 370Z.

Also, in case you didn't know, the self-proclaimed F1-fanatic Shunsaku Tamiya retired from the position of CEO in June 2008 (although remains as the chairman), and the company was succeeded by his son-in-law who was a banker, so expect the company to be more financially strict. In other words, it'd be hard for them to produce money-losing plastic kits just to advertise the company's heritage.

As for why Japanese companies don't make American subject, well...Japanese are Japanese! But seriously, it all come down to profitability. If the North American market had a high demand for a certain subject, even Japanese companies would jump on it. But with the value of US dollar falling like crazy, and even the American domestic manufacturers are struggling in their home market, it wouldn't make sense for non-US companies to release local subjects, like American muscle cars.

Same goes for EU. During the peak time, more than 70% of Tamiya F-1 kits were consumed in Europe, and the demand for WRC, touring and Le Mans cars were always higher in Europe than Japan (which I personally heard from a Tamiya sales person), so if there was a demand, an international company like Tamiya would try to fulfill it. But I've repeatedly read interviews to Mr. Tamiya saying that the demand fell so much that he could no longer give such subjects a go, even though he personally wanted to.

So, when any of the major companies don't release your favorite subjects, you know they are not kit-worthy.

Originally Posted by guiwee

fujimi and revell dont have these problems also?

I don't know about Revell Germany, but Fujimi is a comany of only 30+ people, and its core business is plastic kits, so they MUST to make money by selling plastic kits. Meanwile, Tamiya is an R/C company of 360 employees, so the two companies have different business models.

Originally Posted by guiwee

I thought the idea of big business was to expand your markets

Exactly. That's why the kit manufacturers are focusing "less" on shrinking market. The good news is that Asian plastic model market is expanding, and the export from Shizuoka city actually increased last year.

[MPWR]

Originally Posted by hirofkd

The good news is that Asian plastic model market is expanding, and the export from Shizuoka city actually increased last year.

Really? That is good news if true. I thought the only thing they were making more of were figures of すずみや　ハルヒ.

[BVC500]

I just have to say that I'm glad Fujimi stepped up to the plate after Tamiya gave up.

[guiwee]

Originally Posted by BVC500

I just have to say that I'm glad Fujimi stepped up to the plate after Tamiya gave up.

From everything Ive seen heard and read tamiya is tops. Then fujimi,revell(or hasagawa),then amt and everybody else.


So the multi-media guys are not making money also? Or at least a lot?
The model factory hiros..studio 27s,and renassisance? I sure see a lot of the f1 subjects and theyre $200 and up!! Is that why theyre so expensive ? To make up for development cost? I like those kits but theyre for the very advanced modeler and are priced so even I who have a decent job are hard-pressed to get one. Also I hear alot of people complain about fit issues and such. IMHO for that amount of money they
should go together like a tamiya. Or is that just me!!

[guiwee]

Originally Posted by hirofkd

While you were on hiatus, Tamiya has transformed into an R/C company with a surviving/dying (depending on your perspective) plastic model division. In order to keep it open, they have to pick profitable items, and only a few automotive subjects have made to their to-do list, such as GT-R and 370Z.

Also, in case you didn't know, the self-proclaimed F1-fanatic Shunsaku Tamiya retired from the position of CEO in June 2008 (although remains as the chairman), and the company was succeeded by his son-in-law who was a banker, so expect the company to be more financially strict. In other words, it'd be hard for them to produce money-losing plastic kits just to advertise the company's heritage.

As for why Japanese companies don't make American subject, well...Japanese are Japanese! But seriously, it all come down to profitability. If the North American market had a high demand for a certain subject, even Japanese companies would jump on it. But with the value of US dollar falling like crazy, and even the American domestic manufacturers are struggling in their home market, it wouldn't make sense for non-US companies to release local subjects, like American muscle cars.

Same goes for EU. During the peak time, more than 70% of Tamiya F-1 kits were consumed in Europe, and the demand for WRC, touring and Le Mans cars were always higher in Europe than Japan (which I personally heard from a Tamiya sales person), so if there was a demand, an international company like Tamiya would try to fulfill it. But I've repeatedly read interviews to Mr. Tamiya saying that the demand fell so much that he could no longer give such subjects a go, even though he personally wanted to.

So, when any of the major companies don't release your favorite subjects, you know they are not kit-worthy.


I don't know about Revell Germany, but Fujimi is a comany of only 30+ people, and its core business is plastic kits, so they MUST to make money by selling plastic kits. Meanwile, Tamiya is an R/C company of 360 employees, so the two companies have different business models.


Exactly. That's why the kit manufacturers are focusing "less" on shrinking market. The good news is that Asian plastic model market is expanding, and the export from Shizuoka city actually increased last year.

FUJIMI ONLY HAS 30 EMPLOYEES WOW! What do they do outsource the injection moldings or something. Same with tamiya..Ive seen pics of their headquarters looks like more than 360 people!!!!

[jano11]

Originally Posted by hirofkd

...but Fujimi is a comany of only 30+ people, and its core business is plastic kits...

They must be working like crazy to come up with a couple new 1/24 kits + a couple 1/20 kits every year, not to mention a lot of military kits too.

[Layla's Keeper]

On top of licensing, kit tooling is ridiculously expensive. Tamiya's lost a LOT of ground in their military kit sales to Trumpeter (who's been going like gangbusters releasing high demand big scale kits) and to Hasegawa (whose 1/72nd scale aircraft line has been the cream of the crop recently).

The automotive kit market has been soft for nearly ten years now. That's a long time to watch sales slide. There have been a few positive spikes here and there (Revell's found some stability, particularly after the Hobbico takeover, and Lindberg managed to reinvent themselves yet again) but for the most part it's the doldrums.

To invest the capital required for a new kit is a big BIG risk, and Tamiya isn't seeing it as a worthwhile risk. I don't particularly blame them, although I do wish they'd reconsider for the sake of their classic sports car line. A Tamiya Austin Healey 3000 MkIII, Aston Martin DB5, or Triumph TR6, I think, would be fairly successful.

[AustinMartin]

I just want a new Aston Martin 1/24 kit!

[CrateCruncher]

I think some injection molded car kit manufacturers are still stuck in a '70s era development/production cycle. They figure out what the kiddys crave to own when they grow up and kit that (I mean this figuratively not in a literal sense). The shelf life on that stuff is pretty short. Tamiya has a warehouse somewhere with row after row of barely broken-in, hard steel tooling for '98 Toyota Supra's, Suzuki Samurai's, Cup-a-Noodles, HondaPons, Repsols, and on and on. That stuff likely won't ever be repopped and those beautiful tools were a waste of company resources in my opinion. The accountants see the losses and proclaim cars/bikes a loser segment to be avoided.

Armor/planes are a different market. They kit perennial classics from WW2 that seem to never lose appeal virtually guaranteeing a steady ROI on the permanent tooling they invested so heavily in. (I'm always amazed at all the olive drab speckled tables at model shows in the U.S.)

Fujimi seem to get it. The Enthusiast line and their new 917K, GTO, Testa Rossa are classics that people will continue to buy forever (or until another manufacturer leapfrogs over their tooling with a better kit). Hasegawa's "Historic Car" series has been successful too: Miura, Toyota 2000, Mazda Cosmo, VW van, etc. People will likely be buying all these subjects with every repop and the product planners can see when to reissue simply by watching online auction prices.

Trumpeter is enjoying the export-friendly benefits of an artificially low currency exchange rate right now. It's very similar to what Tamiya had in the early '70s with their 1/6 bikes and 1/12 F1. As the yuan is allowed to appreciate Trumpeters stuff will get smaller with fewer parts just as happened with Tamiya.

[kingkai]

Originally Posted by hirofkd

Same goes for EU. During the peak time, more than 70% of Tamiya F-1 kits were consumed in Europe, and the demand for WRC, touring and Le Mans cars were always higher in Europe than Japan (which I personally heard from a Tamiya sales person), so if there was a demand, an international company like Tamiya would try to fulfill it. But I've repeatedly read interviews to Mr. Tamiya saying that the demand fell so much that he could no longer give such subjects a go, even though he personally wanted to.

So, when any of the major companies don't release your favorite subjects, you know they are not kit-worthy.

I'm sure if Tamiya produced a Aston Martin DBR-9 kit back in 2006 they would have sold like no other kit had before. There are a lot of recasted MFH DBR9 bodies for 1/24 Slotcar racing. I guess not done with a Tamiya DBR-9. So they even would have made profit from that particular hobby direction.
I have 5 MFH, 2 Renaissance and 6 Spark (converted a few into other race versions with aftermarket decals (06 LMS Larbre, 06 FiaGT BMS for example)), making a total of 13 Kits/models of the 1/24 DBR-9 so far (and all being made into different versions) I would have bought dubble that amount and still will do so if Tamiya made it onto a nice kit. Still saving money for a few more MFH DBR9 kits...

[Some_Kid]

Has there been some sort of official statement from Tamiya that they do not make kits anymore?

It seems like every time they do make a new kit, its always some sort of sedan that is totally unappealing. I mean seriously no one wants to build that kind of stuff. Why not make some Saleen S7's or McLaren f1's? I saw a Tamiya Enzo at a hobby store yesterday that's been sitting there for maybe 2 years. And its still 64.99, talk about bs.

And I would agree with MPWR, the better cars are from past times. I recently got a Revell Diablo VT kit, and there are some inaccuracies but its quite possible the most well engineered revell kit I've seen.

[MarcoSaupe]

I would have bought dubble that amount and still will do so if Tamiya made it onto a nice kit.

Well, you would buy 20, I'd buy one, and many here, too, but I think we in the different modeling forums all over the world are simply not enough to make it profitable.
IMHO diecast cars are a big problem for us kit builders - if someone wants a model of a Spitfire, the Bismarck or a T34 tank, they usually have to buy a kit and build one, but for most cars people can simply buy a decent diecast model, without having to worry about building and painting. I'm in a forum for racing simulation enthusiasts, we also have a thread about car models there, and I'm the only one regulary building a kit, 2 or 3 have build maybe 1 kit in the last 2 years, or used to build and now sold their unused kits, everybody else buys diecasts...

[kingkai]

Originally Posted by MarcoSaupe

Well, you would buy 20, I'd buy one, and many here, too, but I think we in the different modeling forums all over the world are simply not enough to make it profitable.
IMHO diecast cars are a big problem for us kit builders - if someone wants a model of a Spitfire, the Bismarck or a T34 tank, they usually have to buy a kit and build one, but for most cars people can simply buy a decent diecast model, without having to worry about building and painting. I'm in a forum for racing simulation enthusiasts, we also have a thread about car models there, and I'm the only one regulary building a kit, 2 or 3 have build maybe 1 kit in the last 2 years, or used to build and now sold their unused kits, everybody else buys diecasts...

I know, but I know a lot of modelers who would buy at least 10 tamiya versions if one existed. My guesses would be that if they released one back in 2006 it could have exeded the CLK-GTR amount of sales... But that is only speculations on my side...
The Spark ready made DBR9's I got where a lot more cheaper than the MFH kits. I got at least 2 Spark models for under $80,- on ebay