94 4.3L S10 Blazer Oil issues?

speedzonwheels · #1 04-21-2009, 01:04 PM

Hello, I currently have a 94 V6 4.3L Vortec motor in my s-10 blazer. It has 184,000 on it. When i started the vehicle today, i heard the lifters right away and seen no oil pressure in the vehicle what so ever. So i killed it immediatly and looked for options on what could be the issue. I decided to change the oil and filter to see if it was pumping oil at all. After changing it and putting 4 quarts into the truck. No oil was in the filter after starting it for a few quick seconds as I don't want to harm the motor. Now does this sound like a oil pump?

The shop told me that its most likely the bearings. Not an oil pump and the motors shot. But wouldnt' the vehicle not start? Im just trying resolve this see if it could be something else or its most likely just the oil pump? I just don't want to have to hoist the motor up as I don't have a hoist and would have to get one to get that oil pan off and put it all back in new. I know the parts cheap enough. Just trying to see if the trucks toast or its worth it as the truck is in mint shape body and interior and all

Please help!!
Thanks
Conrad

Rick Norwood · #2 04-21-2009, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by speedzonwheels

Hello, I currently have a 94 V6 4.3L Vortec motor in my s-10 blazer. It has 184,000 on it. When i started the vehicle today, i heard the lifters right away and seen no oil pressure in the vehicle what so ever. So i killed it immediatly and looked for options on what could be the issue. I decided to change the oil and filter to see if it was pumping oil at all. After changing it and putting 4 quarts into the truck. No oil was in the filter after starting it for a few quick seconds as I don't want to harm the motor. Now does this sound like a oil pump?

The shop told me that its most likely the bearings. Not an oil pump and the motors shot. But wouldnt' the vehicle not start? Im just trying resolve this see if it could be something else or its most likely just the oil pump? I just don't want to have to hoist the motor up as I don't have a hoist and would have to get one to get that oil pan off and put it all back in new. I know the parts cheap enough. Just trying to see if the trucks toast or its worth it as the truck is in mint shape body and interior and all

Please help!!
Thanks
Conrad

Whenever I change my oil and filter I ALWAYS fill the Oil Filter full of oil then install it on the engine. It can take a few seconds to fill the dry oil filter with oil, causing unecessary wear on the engine.

Remove your oil filter carefully and see if there is any oil in it. I would suggest that you fill the Oil Filter full with new oil and re-install it, then try starting the engine again.

speedzonwheels · #3 04-21-2009, 04:15 PM

Well since I heard the lifters immediatly, i wanted it to fill the oil filter to make sure it was getting oil. Since I don't want to run the motor for more than a few seconds as I didn't want to damage it. That wouldn't matter if I filled the filter as its not getting a drop of oil in it from the pump it seems.

Rick Norwood · #4 04-21-2009, 04:43 PM

O.K. Conrad, Did you remove the oil filter AFTER you started the engine? If yes, Was it still dry?
How Much oil is showing on the DipStick? 4 Quarts doesn't seem like enough.

There is one other trick you could try, Pull your coil wire so the engine doesn't start and crank the engine over with the starter for 30 seconds or so AFTER you fill the filter with oil. This should be enough to get the oil circulating and even build up a little pressure. Worst case senario is you may need to re-charge the battery.

speedzonwheels · #5 04-21-2009, 09:19 PM

Yes I did pull the filter back off after I had changed the oil and filter. There was no oil in the filter at all after putting the new one on and starting it for a few seconds. But I could try the cranking it over with the fuel pump unplugged or the ignition. Didn't really think of that at all. But will maybe try it, Im pretty sure though that there is no oil being pumped through the motor. Just guess I'm trying to see if it isn't getting oil, and the vehicle does start, than it would just need the pump wouldn't it? One auto mechanic told me it could be the bearing are shot, but than I told him it started and he said it could be the valve spring. Are fuel pumps that rare to go out? Also than the second mechanic said it could also be that the Oil pump rod broke, but I wouldn't think hard steel would break? Any info would be helpful and Im going to try turning it over a few times with out spark or fuel to see if it pumps oil into the oil filter. Thanks

speedzonwheels · #6 04-21-2009, 09:23 PM

Oh and it showed on the dipstick that there was a good amount of oil in it, Im sure after it pumps it, it would probably be lower and would need an additional quart of oil or so

Rick Norwood · #7 04-22-2009, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by speedzonwheels

Yes I did pull the filter back off after I had changed the oil and filter. There was no oil in the filter at all after putting the new one on and starting it for a few seconds. But I could try the cranking it over with the fuel pump unplugged or the ignition. Didn't really think of that at all. But will maybe try it, Im pretty sure though that there is no oil being pumped through the motor. Just guess I'm trying to see if it isn't getting oil, and the vehicle does start, than it would just need the pump wouldn't it? One auto mechanic told me it could be the bearing are shot, but than I told him it started and he said it could be the valve spring. Are fuel pumps that rare to go out? Also than the second mechanic said it could also be that the Oil pump rod broke, but I wouldn't think hard steel would break? Any info would be helpful and Im going to try turning it over a few times with out spark or fuel to see if it pumps oil into the oil filter. Thanks

If there is absolutely no oil in the filter, the pump in all probability is not working. If the bearings were shot, your oil pump would undoubtedly pump SOME oil into the filter.

My next suggestion was that the oil drive rod was broken or something too. Has any work been done to this engine? Has the distributor been removed from the engine for any reason? I agree that it would be rare to have the drive rod go out, But I have heard of it before.

I think my next step would be to inspect the Drive rod and the socket in the top of the oil pump where the rod inserts. While you are at it, inspect the Distributor shaft as well, I just replace my daughter's entire distributor due to over 1/2 inch of play in the shaft. The distributor shaft was wobbling so bad that it snapped the contact off of the rotor.

And BTW, Just for information only, AutoZone used to have a loaner tool that basically a long rod that is used to turn the oil pump. You have to pull the distributor completely out of the engine and attach the tool to a drill motor and insert the tool into the drive of the pump deep inside of the engine. You have to make sure if the pump rotates Clockwise or Counterclockwise so you know how to set the drill motor. I suggest that you use at least a 1/2 Horse drill motor if you decide to do this. This is normally used when installing a brand new motor into a vehicle. Anyway this procedure will spin the pump and and pressurize the lube system without even turning the motor over. If you do pull your distributor out to inspect the drive rod, this procedure only takes a minute and will tell you if your oil pump is working.

Good luck.

speedzonwheels · #8 04-22-2009, 09:41 AM

That is very interesting and I had no clue that there was a tool like that. I did wonder if i pulled the distibuter off with the rod/gear and all that i could see the rod and than i could tell if it broke. So that is very informational for me to know. If it ends up being the rod, than i can take out easily after i pull the oil pump? Since I would do that, i would replace the pump also. I will definently have to check that out soon. Hope I can get to it before the weekend as Im sure to see down in that hole im going to have to pull the hood off quick as its hard to see as it is. Ive pulled the distributer and replaced that before on my other 89 s15 jimmy. I love these vehicles and don't want to just leave this truck as its a great truck and everything works on it and nothings damaged at all. I appreciate your time with me as you are very helpful. I will update once i get this tool from autozone

Conrad

PS. Is it just a rod? or is it some sort of spring loaded rod? I was looking online and seen that there is a oil pump kit that has the rod and spring and sorts included. Than on ebay I seen just the rod? Wondering what all that deal is? Also if i should just replace it if its not broken and the pump is?

Rick Norwood · #9 04-22-2009, 09:55 AM

The easiest thing to do is to go to your local parts store and ask to see a brand new distributor. You will see exactly what yours should look like. Don't be afraid to ask a ton of questions while you're there.

The Rod that I used was on an 82 Olds and had a round collar that slid over the rod and the collar seated in the distributor hole and kept the rod centered so when you started the drill, the rod didn't tear up the hole in the block. I am sure there would be a difference between then and now.

Again a Recon mission to the parts store will be a big help.

djd99 · #10 04-22-2009, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Norwood

The easiest thing to do is to go to your local parts store and ask to see a brand new distributor. You will see exactly what yours should look like. Don't be afraid to ask a ton of questions while you're there.

The Rod that I used was on an 82 Olds and had a round collar that slid over the rod and the collar seated in the distributor hole and kept the rod centered so when you started the drill, the rod didn't tear up the hole in the block. I am sure there would be a difference between then and now.

Again a Recon mission to the parts store will be a big help.

The tool your talking about is a oil pump priming tool specifically for priming the oil pump on new engines. It will tell you if you oil pump is shot or not. It's a handy tool for your box I've used mine several times but I've also built many engines.

speedzonwheels · #11 04-22-2009, 10:12 AM

Well that sounds pretty good. Im going to have to get this tool and test it all out as I would like to know. Sounds great. I should have this than probably when I get the new oil pump in also so that its all primed once the pump is in anyways and to test it out correct? Or is it not necessary?

Thanks

Conrad

Rick Norwood · #12 04-22-2009, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by speedzonwheels

Well that sounds pretty good. Im going to have to get this tool and test it all out as I would like to know. Sounds great. I should have this than probably when I get the new oil pump in also so that its all primed once the pump is in anyways and to test it out correct? Or is it not necessary?

Thanks

Conrad

I would determine if the existing pump is bad before replacing it. My thoughts are the the pump is not turning due to the distributor rod being broken or stripped out.

Swapping out an oil pump is not an easy job. Make sure your Oil pump is bad before tearing the lower end out of the motor. This is a relatively easy way to verify whether your existing pump is bad or not.

speedzonwheels · #13 04-22-2009, 12:09 PM

Yes It does sound like it would be a good amount of work. I also heard that you can remove that oil pump rod from the distributer hole with one of those spring load finger grabber deals? Just wondering what my options are once i get off work to get that bugger out of there too? The mechanic that stopped in by my work said though if the rod is stripped, than the pump is toast as the pump seized up itself and will need replacing?

Thanks for all your help here, I know I ask a lot of questions. Just never had to do anything like this. Ive done transmissions, all the basics like starter replacements and alternators, timing the igntion and what not...

Conrad

djd99 · #14 04-22-2009, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by speedzonwheels

Well that sounds pretty good. Im going to have to get this tool and test it all out as I would like to know. Sounds great. I should have this than probably when I get the new oil pump in also so that its all primed once the pump is in anyways and to test it out correct? Or is it not necessary?

Thanks

Conrad

I'm going to disagree with the oil pump rod is broke, I think your oil pump rod is fine, these are not very common to break. Most likely you have one of 2 things going on here. I think your roll pin in the bottom of the distributor has snapped off or broke loose and the other is a fried oil pump, I'm leaning toward the roll pin in the distributor myself. What I would do is first is remove the distributor and inspect the bottom and see if your pin is broke and if not then I would pull the rod with a Extra long set of needle nose pliers and inspect both ends of the oil pump rod. If the pin in the distributor is fine then I would get yourself a new tool and prime your oil pump manually and then check your oil filter, if it's still dry then now through elimination you no you need a new oil pump. Remember your oil pump is driven by your distributor gear so also make sure that gear is not broke.

Rick Norwood · #15 04-22-2009, 01:01 PM

There are a multitude of possibilities as to what the exact problem is. Simply stated, I don't think the Oil pump is turning. It could be any thing from a broken gear to a broken Roll Pin to a Broken shaft. From pictures of this specific distributor from the Internet, the portion of the shaft that inserts into the oil pump looks basically like a Flat Screwdriver tang.

I think we all pretty much agree that the first order of business is to inspect the existing parts and not run out and spend a ton of cash or ripping the engine apart.

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