'96 3.8L Misfire / Engine Sputters when Fan Turns On

[12Ounce]

Jon,
When the fans are unplugged (and the problem goes away), and the ac switched "on" ... have you observed the ac clutch still/actually engaging?

[Jon04CTSV]

Originally Posted by 12Ounce

Jon,
When the fans are unplugged (and the problem goes away), and the ac switched "on" ... have you observed the ac clutch still/actually engaging?

Yes, they do.

[Jon04CTSV]

Originally Posted by wiswind

On my '96 3.8L the fuel injectors tend to get dirty at the spray end.
I have had this cause misfire AND P0171 and/or P0174.
The lean codes are from the PCM trying to compensate for the "misfire" that it has detected.

Thanks. I think I'm going to replace injector # 2 then.

[searcherrr]

What happened with this?

[Jon04CTSV]

Originally Posted by searcherrr

What happened with this?

Haven't had the time to replace injector 2 yet.

It's always cylinder 2 that misfires. As I stated before, plugs, coil packs, wires have all been replaced. Only thing left is the injector.

It always misfires after a car wash too. I wash the car almost everyday and it never fails. Always misfires afterwards. Or today when I went into an underground parking lot. Something to do with moisture in the air??

[searcherrr]

Originally Posted by Jon04CTSV

Haven't had the time to replace injector 2 yet.

It's always cylinder 2 that misfires. As I stated before, plugs, coil packs, wires have all been replaced. Only thing left is the injector.

It always misfires after a car wash too. I wash the car almost everyday and it never fails. Always misfires afterwards. Or today when I went into an underground parking lot. Something to do with moisture in the air??

Same thing used to happen to me in the rain. Imagine getting stuck in the parking lots of stores when its raining.... all the time and down here its very humid. Happened on high humidity days too. It could've been other grounds too now that I know what I know.... but I'm pretty sure back then it was the ground cable from the alternator to the frame.

Though the slimmest ground wire that comes out of the negative battery cable end goes to the C135 black 1 wire connector mounted above the radiator near the battery area which has a black/white stripe wire on the female end ... that black/white stripe cable leads to the PCM amongst many other important things. If that cable isn't grounded well at the battery you get the same thing you get when you pull the ground strap from the alternator..... dead silence.. no power ANYWHERE.... no dome lights.... no instrument panel etc... If you ask me these Windstars could use a ground wire kit and a lil grounding redundancy... like an extra cable for the alternator and an extra one to the battery for the C135 connection.

[mamato]

Originally Posted by Jon04CTSV

Haven't had the time to replace injector 2 yet.

It's always cylinder 2 that misfires. As I stated before, plugs, coil packs, wires have all been replaced. Only thing left is the injector.

It always misfires after a car wash too. I wash the car almost everyday and it never fails. Always misfires afterwards. Or today when I went into an underground parking lot. Something to do with moisture in the air??

I also have a '96 3.8 that experiences cylinder 2 misfires and has fan issues. Fan issues started way back in May 2007. The PCM never commands the fans to turn on (low or high speed) no matter how hot the engine gets or if AC is on. I got tired of tearing my car apart every weekend trying to fix it and ended up installing a manual fan switch.

About a year later, the misfires started. Only cylinder 2. It will misfire for a couple of minutes randomly and then magically get better like someone flipped a switch.

Here's the weird part. The misfires only occur if the temperature is above freezing. The whole month of Jan ranged from 5 to 25 degrees. The misfires stopped so consistantly that the check engine light turned itself off and stayed off. It's been warm lately and the misfire is back with a vengance. This pattern is very consistent.

I have long suspected that bad grounds may be at the root of the fan problem and the misfire problem. In addition, about 50% of the time, when I turn the key, I hear a single click and the starter motor does not turn. I keep trying and within about 4-5 key turns, the motor starts perfecly. Could be more ground issues as the lights do not dim during the click tries.

When the weather breaks, I am going to add more ground wires. If that does not do it, I am going to perfrom the old EGR port cleanout. I just can't seem to factor in the temperature issue.

[Jon04CTSV]

Ok guys... It's finally been fixed for good.

Replaced injector # 2 and dielectric grease was applied to all connectors. Runs like a dream again. Woohoo!

[searcherrr]

I think this is a very interesting indirect find that when there are issues with the rad fans cutting on or off that our Windstars are likely to have an injector (and/or fuel delivery) problem.

In my case it was happening when my fans would turn OFF. The CCRM adjusts fuel flow rate (I'm sure of it) when the fans kick on or off. It must be in this minute fuel delivery change at idle that the bad injector is no longer able to handle subtle fuel delivery changes for either being stuck open or closed or just stuck not moving in either direction leaving "whatever" amount of orifice open at the spray end to cause problems.

I never in my life would've thought a fuel injector would be the fix for this problem, especially with NO CODE from the computer. I am 95% certain this is the fix for my problem in my big "Attempts stall, Idle Pulses 600-800 rpms, horrible MPG" thread and I'll know for sure tomorrow when the new injectors get put in as the bad one (or more) finally showed its ugly head by spewing gas out of the engine exhaust header where it joins with the cat downpipe.

[Jon04CTSV]

Originally Posted by searcherrr

I think this is a very interesting indirect find that when there are issues with the rad fans cutting on or off that our Windstars are likely to have an injector (and/or fuel delivery) problem.

In my case it was happening when my fans would turn OFF. The CCRM adjusts fuel flow rate (I'm sure of it) when the fans kick on or off. It must be in this minute fuel delivery change at idle that the bad injector is no longer able to handle subtle fuel delivery changes for either being stuck open or closed or just stuck not moving in either direction leaving "whatever" amount of orifice open at the spray end to cause problems.

I never in my life would've thought a fuel injector would be the fix for this problem, especially with NO CODE from the computer. I am 95% certain this is the fix for my problem in my big "Attempts stall, Idle Pulses 600-800 rpms, horrible MPG" thread and I'll know for sure tomorrow when the new injectors get put in as the bad one (or more) finally showed its ugly head by spewing gas out of the engine exhaust header where it joins with the cat downpipe.

It really wasn't a fan issue. It was more of a voltage/electrical problem. I was actually able to cause the engine to sputter and misfire by using my window switches. If I held down a window switch, it would draw power, and that would actually cause my engine to shake. I'm not sure why replacing the injector solved this, but it did.

[mamato]

Just to wrap this up, I finally checked the EGR ports. They were all plugged except #2 where the misfire was. I guess #2 was getting way too much exhaust gas and it choked out the burn. I cleaned them all and now back in business.