$1000 In - Still No Fix - Help!

[V3r1f13d]

Hello Everyone,

I have been dealing with this problem for a month now and NO ONE has fixed it. Please listen to the problem and what I have done so far. I REALLY need some adivse here.

96 Accord - 4 Door 4 Cyl Non V Tech

It has intermittent starting problems. You know when you turn the key half way and your stereo comes on, you can roll the windows down, heaadlights, etc. Then when you turn it all the way thats when the car tries to start. Well, there is no difference between turning my key half way or the whole way. Basically when I turn it the whole way the engine DOES NOT attempt to start, but ALL other electrical works. This happens intermittently and I either have to keep trying to turn it and after a while (hopefully) it starts. Or I have to get it jumped. Yes, jump start will work.

Here is what I have done.
1) Took it to a local technician, he said its an electrical problem. Problem persisits.
2) Took it to an electrical technician for motor vehicles, he said it was my alarm. Problem persisits.
3) Took it to the alarm shop, removed the old one and its wiring, put in a brand new one and new wiring. Problem persisits.
4) Bought and installed a brand new Optima battery. Problem persisits.
5) Took it to a local technician. Replaced the starter. Problem persisits.
6) Took it back to the local technician and removed the power that connects to my stereo system. Problem persisits.

Now they are telling me it could be the Ignition. I mean, if you just read the riddle, time and money I have been through you could feel what I am going through.

I am going nuts here and have been stranded several times needing jumps. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

[Artem F]

Did anybody check the ignition switch?
It is an electro-mechanical thing so it's supposed to
wear off some day. One can easily tell if it's
the case if the hot-wiring helps to start the vehicle.

I had this problem on my other car, the Chevy, but the logic is the same. I guess, the theft-deterrent relay stopped working for some reason but look how I proceeded:
1) starter hot-wiring - starts, works.
2) starter relay hot-wiring - starts, works.
3) ignition key - +12V appears on the corresponding
contact when I turn the key.
4) there's nothing else to do besides disassembling half of the car searching for that mysterious theft-deterrent relay or the broken wire or... connecting the ignition switch wire to the starter relay by a bypass wire.

My understanding is that you won't do it by yourself.
Anyway, this logic might help you when dealing with the technicians. A) Check this B) Check that C) If ..then ...else.
It's not a rocket science.

[Artem F]

BTW, what do you call "jump start" in this case?
Jump starting for me is attaching the other car's battery to your battery when there's not enough power to rotate the engine. But you say there's no reaction to the ignition key.
Do I understand you correctly that when the other battery is
used, the switch works? Isn't it just a coincidence?
Otherwise it's in contradiction with the 4-th statement of yours.

[V3r1f13d]

Thank you for replying.

The mechanic says he thinks its the ignition switch. I personally dont know how to test or hotwire anything. I don't know how to do anything other than the fluids and tires. Outside of that I'm fairly lost.

Yes, it does work when I jump start it (hook one running car battery to mine). I have had to do it twice. If I wait long enough and keep turning the keep it will turn, but twice I had no luck at all and had to get it jumped.

I bought a digital voltage meter and a portable battery (to jump on my own). I am going to test the voltage the next time this happens to me. So I'm trying, but as you can see I'm not that good.

So basically, based on what I have done so far, if I replace the ignition switch and it doesnt fix it then I am paying someone to go over every single wire?

[jeffcoslacker]

The fact that the accessories continue to work with the key rolled over to the start position would seem to indicate the problem is in the ignition switch or starter relay, because once the relay is engaged, all acceossory power is shunted to the starter and those items go dead momentarily until the starter is no longer cranking....in order to supply the starter with maximum amperage available...

But if a jump gets it going, this countermands that theory. Which is why it's proving so hard to find...

My first course of action would be to verify the condition of each primary wire going to the starter and starter relay, verify all battery to engine/chassis grounds, then if nothing turns up and the vehicle has an aftermarket alarm with starter interrupt or remote start, I'd begin to suspect a problem there...

Also just for laughs, if it's an automatic, try moving the shifter around while holding the key in the start position...sometimes a failing neutral/park safety switch can cause fun like this...same with the clutch interlock on manual models...try stabbing the clutch pedal deeper into the floor or pumping the clutch while holding the key over...

Honda ignition switch failures are common, but usually involve failure to start, but will crank, or dying while running. Never seen one that wouldn't allow the starter to crank....not saying it couldn't happen, just that it would be unusual...

[V3r1f13d]

OK, I think I got it. Excuse my lack of proper terminology. There is a cable which connects to the starter which has a rubber cap around it which makes it so you cant really see the connection. Hell, I didnt even know it was a connection until I peeled the rubber cap back. Well that thing was BARELY hanging on. If I disconnected it completely it wouldnt start, at all, even with a jump. If I left it barely connected it wouldnt get enough juice per key turn, so I would have to try multiple times to finally get it to turn. Or if I jumped it I guess it would send enough juice through its barely touching connection to jump. Well, I connected it completely and its been turning on with NO hesitation. Turned it off and on 10 times. Drove it to 4 locations last night and today, NO problems. Starts like a brand new car!!!

Thank you guys so much for your help.
It's unfortunate that I had to take it to the same place who charged me AGAIN to troubleshoot THEIR mistake (installing the starter) at which they didnt even have an answer (they said it was my stereo). I hooked my stereo up as soon as I saw the loose starter cable and my stereo isnt the problem.

What a relief!

[Artem F]

congratulations!

I guess, jump starting helped because you opened the
hood, moved something when attaching the jump wires
and the contact at the starter appeared.

I'd strongly recommend buying Haynes Honda repair manual for $15 at Advanceautoparts or elsewhere prior to listening to "highly qualified technicians" next time.
They charge $$$ and still don't help - your example is not the first one.

[ponchonutty]

I don't think it is completely fixed though if the accessories are staying on while cranking it over. I've had to replace a fair share of ignition switched on Hondas so it is very possible to be an issue as well.