Escalation in the Weaponization of Space?

[fredjacksonsan]

Originally Posted by blazee

Looking over the complete history of China's wars, they were rarely the aggressor. Hell, they made it 4000 years without a single war of conquest.

Wasn't that the time period where they had the constant internal wars? Sun Tzu, and all that?

/off topic

[xeroinfinity]

I think they better just leave the rest of the satellites alone

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by blazee

Looking over the complete history of China's wars, they were rarely the aggressor. Hell, they made it 4000 years without a single war of conquest.

I don't know about that. But the most brutal occupation of China was by Japan. Also, they were not exactly pacifists or sitting on the sidelines in the Korean War. Interesting how they lost 900,000 in that war. See link below of chronological events of wars and incidents involving China commencing with the First Opium War 1839-42.

Click here

[blazee]

Originally Posted by fredjacksonsan

Wasn't that the time period where they had the constant internal wars? Sun Tzu, and all that?

/off topic

It's actually the time span from the xia dynasty to present.

Originally Posted by bnaylor

I don't know about that. But the most brutal occupation of China was by Japan. Also, they were not exactly pacifists or sitting on the sidelines in the Korean War. Interesting how they lost 900,000 in that war. See link below of chronological events of wars and incidents involving China commencing with the First Opium War 1839-42.

Click here

I wasn't implying that they were pacifists or sitting on the sidelines of any wars, just that they weren't normally the agressors, meaning that they didn't go out of their way to get involved in foreign conflicts (domestic conflicts is another story). You used the Korean War as an example, in that war, China didn't intervene until the UN forces had invaded North Korea and were nearing their borders. Would the US have acted any differently if armed forces were approaching our boarders? Doubtful considering the concern that is drawn from a country on the other side of the world shooting down one of their own satellites.

Taken from the link that you provided:

" As the Allied forces now advanced northward back to the 38th parallel, the Chinese warned that the presence of UN forces in North Korea would be unacceptable to the security of the Chinese People's Republic and would force the Chinese to intervene in the war. UN forces, however, ignored the warnings and advanced into North Korea with the expressed intention of unifying the country. By mid-November the Allied forces were nearing the Yalu River, which marked the border between North Korea and Manchuria, the northeast part of China. The Chinese considered the approach of UN forces to the Yalu to be an unacceptable threat to Manchuria. On November 24 MacArthur announced his "Home by Christmas" offensive, in which his forces would boldly advance right up to the Yalu. The next day approximately 180,000 Chinese "volunteers" entered the war, and by December 15, after bitter winter fighting and a harrowing retreat, the Allied troops had been driven southward back to the 38th parallel. On Dec. 31, 1950, the Communists began their second invasion of South Korea with about 500,000 troops, but their attack soon faltered in the face of incessant Allied aerial bombing campaigns, and the front lines eventually stabilized along the 38th parallel."

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by blazee

I wasn't implying that they were pacifists or sitting on the sidelines of any wars, just that they weren't normally the agressors, meaning that they didn't go out of their way to get involved in foreign conflicts (domestic conflicts is another story). You used the Korean War as an example, in that war, China didn't intervene until the UN forces had invaded North Korea and were nearing their borders. Would the US have acted any differently if armed forces were approaching our boarders? Doubtful considering the concern that is drawn from a country on the other side of the world shooting down one of their own satellites.

Taken from the link that you provided:

" As the Allied forces now advanced northward back to the 38th parallel, the Chinese warned that the presence of UN forces in North Korea would be unacceptable to the security of the Chinese People's Republic and would force the Chinese to intervene in the war. UN forces, however, ignored the warnings and advanced into North Korea with the expressed intention of unifying the country. By mid-November the Allied forces were nearing the Yalu River, which marked the border between North Korea and Manchuria, the northeast part of China. The Chinese considered the approach of UN forces to the Yalu to be an unacceptable threat to Manchuria. On November 24 MacArthur announced his "Home by Christmas" offensive, in which his forces would boldly advance right up to the Yalu. The next day approximately 180,000 Chinese "volunteers" entered the war, and by December 15, after bitter winter fighting and a harrowing retreat, the Allied troops had been driven southward back to the 38th parallel. On Dec. 31, 1950, the Communists began their second invasion of South Korea with about 500,000 troops, but their attack soon faltered in the face of incessant Allied aerial bombing campaigns, and the front lines eventually stabilized along the 38th parallel."

You can paint whatever rosey picture of China you want but reasonable minds and opinions will differ.

There is alot more to the history of China and Korea that goes way back centuries and more complex than China simply defending its borders which sounded more like a pretext to invade and in turn, they became the aggressor. In the Korean War the U.S. and its allies were acting on behalf of the U.N. Was there really a need to launch a second invasion during the Korean War? They wanted to have their cake and eat it too but it did not work out too good for them. The casualties they suffered speaks for itself even though their historians claim it was a victory. But they lost out big on the Taiwan issue back then and as a result we have the Taiwan issue today which is IMO what the missile test was really about. They decided to flex their muscle and it back fired on them. Creating the space debris alone was reckless. The U.S. and U.K. are not the only countries to complain about China's latest provocative action. So has Japan, Canada, Australia and other nations.

Day to Day, January 19, 2007 - China destroyed one of its satellites last week with a ground-based ballistic missile. This difficult and dangerous feat is the first test of an anti-satellite weapon in more than 20 years. Jeffrey Lewis, director of the Managing the Atom Project at Harvard, talks with Alex Chadwick about the international fallout of China's actions.

NPR Audio Clip Here

What history shows is China destroyed any chance of the reunification of the two Koreas, created a monster in North Korea and lost any chance of any reunification with Taiwan short of another war. And China continues a pattern of human right violations and the last time I checked they were still a Communist country.

221-214 B.C. – Under the command of the Emperor’s generals Ming T’ien and Chao T’o, the Ch’in dynasty conquers regions south of the Yangtze river and Northern Korea.

The War of Words Between South Korea and China Over An Ancient Kingdom: Why Both Sides Are Misguided. Click here.

For Korean War veteran Zhang Zeshi, North Korea's claim was a bitter betrayal by an "evil" regime. "We have given them so much food, fuel and support, but they don't listen to us," he said.

Zhang, 77, was among more than a million Chinese soldiers sent by Mao Zedong to fight with North Korea in the 1950-53 Korean War. He spent two years in a South Korean POW camp. He was imprisoned again when he returned home, disgraced along with other former POWs for failing to die in battle against American "aggressors."

"We spilled our blood in vain," Zhang said. "It kept alive (North Korea's) feudal dictatorship."

USA Today Article

IMO the belief and comments of Chinese Korean War Veteran Zhang Zeshi speaks for itself. Yup, them darn Chinese are just a bunch of good ole boys. No need to worry about them.

[VR43000GT]

^^ Well done and I am in total agreement with you.

[Muscletang]

opcorn:

[drunken monkey]

I'm not saying China is a good country, just that it seems laughable to me that the UK and US and others are so quick to condemn this action when they themselves are guilty of many other equally bad things.

[fredjacksonsan]

I don't believe blowing up one of your own satellites is something to be condemned for.

Of course people (read that: paranoid governments) are worried what the Chinese might do, rather than what they are doing. Same thing as N Korea and nukes.

[BNaylor]

There may be more to this than what has been publicized. It turns out that China may be playing a game of cat and mouse with the U.S. When they start screwing with our satellites there is cause for concern.

"It may have been no coincidence that, within weeks, China ruffled American feathers by using a ground-based laser to illuminate a US satellite -- and highlight its own reach into space," it said.

Article Click Here

If we lose any satellites or a space shuttle mission based on China's actions or inactions then there will be more than condemnation.

[taranaki]

Originally Posted by bnaylor

There may be more to this than what has been publicized. It turns out that China may be playing a game of cat and mouse with the U.S. When they start screwing with our satellites there is cause for concern.



If we lose any satellites or a space shuttle mission based on China's actions or inactions then there will be more than condemnation.

weird. America has lost 2 space shuttle missions and numerous satellites due to its own failings, and people just shrug .Yet when the Chinese look like they might be developing reliable technology of their own, people start assuming that it's going to be used against them. As for whining about XM/Sirius, GET REAL.

[xeroinfinity]

I think we all should have them, then no one would use them ... maybe

We may need them when the aliens come back to collect thier next of kin and the spacecrafts we confiscated/impounded