Car dying out :(

cowboyili · #1 04-17-2006, 11:23 PM

I have a 98 GTP and haven't had too many problems with it. I was told a long time ago that my fuel injectors looked like they could be changed, along with a lot of other issues (according to a mechanic). I've just about replaced or maintained every aspect of my car except for the injectors. Today my car was running fine when I got home. I ran in the house for 2 minutes at most and came back and it wouldn't stay running when started. It's turning over fine and the RPMs go up to about 1000 for less than a second and then quickly fall until the car sputters.

One thing I noticed on this forum was the 0441 error code problem. I've been having that problem as well and have tried all the recommendations to fix it (aside from what was discussed here - seems a little confusing). Does anyone know anything about this from dealing with it in the past, that they might know what I need to do to fix this? I love the car and can't afford to waste my money at a mechanic.

Thanks!

BNaylor · #2 04-18-2006, 07:15 AM

P0441 is an evaporative emissions fault. Probably the purge solenoid itself. Unless it is somehow affecting engine vacuum I doubt it is causing your problem. However, it should be resolved since it is a known problem. Some DTC error codes cause the PCM to act up and cause driveability issues.

Have you tested the fuel pressure at the fuel injector rail to see if it is in spec?

cowboyili · #3 04-18-2006, 09:15 AM

well i guess i'll start by taking care of the purge solenoid. i'm not an expert mechanic but i do mostly everything myself (besides anything like welding). how how hard of a job is this, how much does it cost about, and how long would it normally take? thanks so much!

BNaylor · #4 04-18-2006, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cowboyili

well i guess i'll start by taking care of the purge solenoid. i'm not an expert mechanic but i do mostly everything myself (besides anything like welding). how how hard of a job is this, how much does it cost about, and how long would it normally take? thanks so much!

Thats a good idea. The purge solenoid is easy and DIY. About 30 minutes or less for removal and installation. A few vacuum lines that need to be disconnected and one electrical connector. The purge solenoid is typically dealer only or through an AC Delco authorized parts dealer. GM List around $22.59. Part number is AC Delco 214-642, GM # 1997289 for a '98 GTP VIN "1". Just make sure you get one for a '98 GTP.

cowboyili · #5 04-18-2006, 11:56 AM

Okay, I am going to check into it. The Haynes manual will probably guide me most of the way. Is 0441 engine error code always the purge solenoid? If not, what else could it be? I was told it could be from a bad gas cap, yet I passed emissions. Since then I have changed the cap, with no correction, and I have put RTV black silicon around the fuel pump (to prevent any leakage or air). Just curious what 0441 includes. Anyways, thanks so much for your help - I appreciate it a lot.

BNaylor · #6 04-18-2006, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cowboyili

Okay, I am going to check into it. The Haynes manual will probably guide me most of the way. Is 0441 engine error code always the purge solenoid? If not, what else could it be? I was told it could be from a bad gas cap, yet I passed emissions. Since then I have changed the cap, with no correction, and I have put RTV black silicon around the fuel pump (to prevent any leakage or air). Just curious what 0441 includes. Anyways, thanks so much for your help - I appreciate it a lot.

The gas cap or a fuel tank pressure leak normally generates P0440 or P0442. P0441 is specifically a test by the PCM directed at the purge solenoid. See reply to another P0441 problem below:

For your model and year GP it is a Evaporative Emissions Control System Incorrect Purge Flow. The PCM will detect a purge solenoid stuck closed by monitoring the Evap. Purge Vacuum switch state when the Evap Purge solenoid duty cycle is > 85%. The switch state is currently low (closed) therefore the P0441 triggers.

Check the vaccum line running from the charcoal cannister and vent solenoid to the purge solenoid located at the engine. The purge solenoid is located in front of the front fuel injector rail and fed vacuum from the throttle body. Also, check the electrical connection at the purge solenoid. You may have a flaky purge solenoid.

J2done1133 · #7 04-18-2006, 02:55 PM

hey cowboyili, i had the same exact problem dealing with my GTP also. Bob is awesome and helped me alot dealing with this. The solenoid is really easy to replace no tools even required i just replaced mine today. As far as the car starting and dying like that it sounds like a fuel resistor relay. I had that problem to and that was what made me join this forum in the first place. I paid my mechanic to fix that proble and he charged me 325.00. I dont know if that was a good price or not for the work that he did but i know basics and i didnt want to fool around with the gas tank and things that i dont know about. Good luck and keep us posted to what happens. BTW Im joey.

cowboyili · #8 04-18-2006, 03:37 PM

i called GM. the parts guy told me that for a GTP there is both a resistor and a relay, but the resistor is what causes this. i guess it is in a bad spot so they had to relocate it to due to water and other things messing it up. maybe that'll fix the strange smell i get sometimes. anyways, it seems like you've given me a great list of options to go through and all of them are under $50 (by the way, the part for the resistor is only $46 through GM but I'm not sure how much labor is involved). thank you guys so much for your help, i appreciate it greatly. nice to meet all of you.

alex

J2done1133 · #9 04-18-2006, 03:42 PM

no problem good luck with your GTP and keep us posted!!!

BNaylor · #10 04-18-2006, 04:14 PM

Most of us did the fuel pump resistor upgrade DIY. Here is the procedure to give you an idea. The resistor upgrade was available at ZZP for around $30.

http://rmcgp.clubgp.com/fpresistor.html

cowboyili · #11 04-18-2006, 04:42 PM

thanks again! i plan on doing it in a couple hours when im off work, ill let you know how it goes.

J2done1133 · #12 04-18-2006, 06:45 PM

wow i cant believe this mechanic charged me that amount of money to do that!!! what a jer*off. i guess you live in you learn. well thanks for the info bob, btw i left you a reply in the
P0441 thread that i started last week.

BNaylor · #13 04-18-2006, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J2done1133

wow i cant believe this mechanic charged me that amount of money to do that!!! what a jer*off. i guess you live in you learn. well thanks for the info bob, btw i left you a reply in the
P0441 thread that i started last week.

Yeah Joey....I didn't want to say anything about the cost assuming maybe its the norm in New York City and the burroughs. Everything there is expensive.

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