Figuring out the point of life as one

[digolbick]

[quote=lazysmurff]i have a hard time getting around your objectivist standpoint. you state that there is definatly one purpose to life, yet you state that how we live our lives is totally subjective.

I said that there is one univeral answer/reason why we are all here and that we all have different perceptions on life but it will ultimately lead to one outcome.

[lazysmurff]

ok, so you definatly believe in a higher power...

like i said previously in the post you quoted, i was just mumbling out loud, without any actualy drive to fully analize what you said. sorry if i misunderstood

[youngvr4]

smurf, regardless everyone has there outlook on whats right.

and some are sooo far off from others.

when thats the case and everyone has there own outlook as to whats right and wrong. then as a natural man, again don't complain about the president going to war. the kkk think they are completly right and so do many others. does that mean it is?

again as grown men, we are all children

[lazysmurff]

Originally Posted by youngvr4

smurf, regardless everyone has there outlook on whats right.

yup.

Originally Posted by youngvr4

and some are sooo far off from others.

yup

Originally Posted by youngvr4

then as a natural man, again don't complain about the president going to war.

oh, but i can, and i will. just like i said, just because he is free to think its right, doesnt mean i have to accept it. i am free to make moral judgments about his actions, and condem them if i think they are wrong, especially if i can form a legit argument as to why i think so. thats the beauty of subjectivism. he's free to think what he's doing is right, and therefore it is right....to him. and im free to think its wrong, and it is wrong...to me.

Originally Posted by youngvr4

the kkk think they are completly right and so do many others. does that mean it is?

see above

[AndonD454]

ok now im just suggesting this stuff... ive been thinking about some of it lately and then i saw this post so i figured it throw it up in the air.. so dont freak out about it or anything. also, its long, but please read.

What if there is absolutely no point to life whatsoever? What if we think of this from a completely different point of view and realize that humans are animals, and like other animals, there is no greater good or no purpose of life except to make it enjoyable for yourself until you die. What if the bible was "somewhat" based on a true story, but was mostly made up to stop humans from completely going into a state of chaos?

Because i do not believe in an afterlife (kind of scientific point of view), i do not see any purpose in life whatsoever. I believe that we are born and then we die, nothing more than that. But i think that humans as a whole, especailly when less intellegent humans get together, they cant accept not living for a purpose. People cant fathom living life without a purpose, so a very long time ago, we set up a system of beliefs (bible/religion) which kept people from going crazy. We made up this system so that we essestially were giving humans (for years to come) something to believe in; Something to give their 'precious' lives a purpose and something which basically enstilled some common laws in our minds.

I think that someone sat down and said well i think that there are going to be people who dont live their lives by rules. Some badasses are going to do whatever they want and as long as they get away with it then theyre fine. So, this is where heaven and hell came from. he said well we'll make an afterlife and all of your actions will be judged. if you were basically good, you will spend eternity in the most perfect place imaginable (the thing most people would want more than everything:a perfect eternal life) and well also say that a life full of bad actions will result in your spending eternity in the worst place fathomable.(hell) so basically the bible is a backup for laws as well because think of how many people could get away with murded but would not because they fear hell.

(i might get some trouble for this too) what if it doesnt matter if hitler killed those people? what if this was a form of population control and actually may have benefittted us. the world is very overpopulated, and it will only get worse. People need to die at more or less the same rate they are born. Waht he did was morally wrong, of course, and no i dont agree with his actions at all, but does it matter? if there is truly no after life, there is no reason to worry about killing off a whole race of people. This is the way hitler made his life exactly what he wanted it to be. He died early and was hated by millions, but he didnt seem to care. I think the reason we all clung to the bible for answers (true or not) was to avoid a whole society of hitlers. if people realize that there is no point of life and there is no afterlife, what reason do they have to stop them from doing whatever the hell the want?

I see no point in life. I see no realistic possibility of an afterlife. However, i believe that there is no reason to have everyone else believe the same. I think that if people all believed this, the world would be completely chaotic. And for this reason i think the bible was written just to keep things under control.

[youngvr4]

Originally Posted by lazysmurff

yup.

yup


oh, but i can, and i will. just like i said, just because he is free to think its right, doesnt mean i have to accept it. i am free to make moral judgments about his actions, and condem them if i think they are wrong, especially if i can form a legit argument as to why i think so. thats the beauty of subjectivism. he's free to think what he's doing is right, and therefore it is right....to him. and im free to think its wrong, and it is wrong...to me.


see above

without comandments on whats right and whats wrong, how does one prove to the other its right or wrong.

it would seem to me that its common sense to know that we all have trouble translating to one another whats wrong and whats right.

and the ten commandments seem on point to me.

you can disagree all you want with the president or whoever, but to prove to them what there doing is wrong. you would need the higher power. because the president cant care less what you think, your just a man like he is. so who's to say your the one who's right?

do you even understand what i'm trying to say?

[lazysmurff]

Originally Posted by youngvr4

without comandments on whats right and whats wrong, how does one prove to the other its right or wrong.

you dont. the only person that matters is yourself. its fairly simple. hitler did a bad thing in my eyes. there is no sense in trying to prove to him that what he did was wrong, he wont agree. ever. but i can try to convince other people. i can use my powers of reason, apeal to emotion and sympathy and anything else i want. fact of the matter is, he could use those same tools (and in fact did) to a devestating effect. if what he did was so obviously morally wrong, why did so many buy into it?

Originally Posted by youngvr4

it would seem to me that its common sense to know that we all have trouble translating to one another whats wrong and whats right.

nailed it.

Originally Posted by youngvr4

and the ten commandments seem on point to me.

they do a failry good job. dont kill, steal, etc. but there are things on there i dont agree with. and i can explain why i dont very easily and succinctly. and i think i am entitled to not agree with and not follow some of the ten commandments.

Originally Posted by youngvr4

you can disagree all you want with the president or whoever, but to prove to them what there doing is wrong. you would need the higher power. because the president cant care less what you think, your just a man like he is. so who's to say your the one who's right?

logic and reason work too (and if you want to call those my higher powers, so be it) and as far as who says, noone but us. i say im right, he's wrong, he says he's right and im wrong. i need no higher justification than myself to think something is wrong. what if god had come down and said..."no no no, wait, the twins towers...i wanted them to come down. it needed to happen" would you be ok with that? i think not. something inside of you, outside of authority (god) says that it is still immoral

Originally Posted by youngvr4

do you even understand what i'm trying to say?

believe me son, im quite aware of what your trying to say. i just think you're dead wrong.

now with this new post...

Originally Posted by andonD454

Because i do not believe in an afterlife (kind of scientific point of view), i do not see any purpose in life whatsoever. I believe that we are born and then we die, nothing more than that.

im pretty much with you all the way. until this. and something later on. do you mean life really has no purpose? or that life has no purpose beyond ourselves? just because i'll cease to exist in 80 years (give or take) doesnt mean i cant give my life purpose.

Originally Posted by andonD454

if there is truly no after life, there is no reason to worry about killing off a whole race of people.

because there is a "life". this life. and to take that opportunity away from someone is (in my view) wrong. you're free to do as you choose, to make your own value judgments and find your own answers to moral dilemma's, but you must allow others to do so as well. Hitler forced every jew he killed to be a part of a world view they didnt accept. and thats wrong.

[AndonD454]

Originally Posted by lazysmurff

im pretty much with you all the way. until this. and something later on. do you mean life really has no purpose? or that life has no purpose beyond ourselves? just because i'll cease to exist in 80 years (give or take) doesnt mean i cant give my life purpose.

because there is a "life". this life. and to take that opportunity away from someone is (in my view) wrong. you're free to do as you choose, to make your own value judgments and find your own answers to moral dilemma's, but you must allow others to do so as well. Hitler forced every jew he killed to be a part of a world view they didnt accept. and thats wrong.

i mean that life has no purpose beyond ourselves.. i knwo what youre saying and i believe in it.. i believe that we should make our lives as enjoyable as meaningful as possible while we're here, because as long as we are alive, we shoudl make it easy for ourselves, and there is no reason to do otherwise. we have to live with our decisions until we die. why not make it the bast we can? as a matter of fact this is why i continue to to the best i can in school to ensure the best future possible, and why i try to hang on to every friend i can.. i basically plan everything i do around what will help me achieve the highest level of overall success/happiness for me until i am about 90.. (even though ill prolly die well before this)

and i also fully agree with you on your second point.. i know that it is morally wrong to deprive another being of life. however, some people do not have a great system of morals, and that is why i made the point abotu worrying that everyone does not accept my view on life.. some poeple just cannot except what is right and what is wrong.. and they dont understand that killing is not only detrimental to the one killed but almost equally to themselves. i think hitler acted on instinct and his own personal feelings, and should have taken a while to stand back and realize that it would have benefitted him enormously to have chosen a different plan of action. he would have lived longer and could have been loved by many had he led a different life. keep inmind that i am in no way condoning hitlers plan of action.

[lazysmurff]

yay....welcome to existentialism!!!

[digolbick]

you really killed this thread, didnt you lazysmurff

[submersed]

Interesting....

[drewh4386]

^dude. Its like your smoking weed as you surf AF. Either that or some huge bong.

Old thread.

[PeanutM&MsRgood4u]

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
A greater man that I once said that no good deed goes unpunished. Murder, rape, theft, lying, are all good things, as long as you don't get caught. I can prove it too.
People who are "good", who obey all the laws and all the rules, and who go to church regularly and donate half their earnings or time to charitable oginizations are not the people on Forbes top 10 list. These arent the people making billions of dollars a year. The people in control, the people who are decision makers, they are the ones who shortcut whenever they can. Enrons executives stole all the money their employees had been putting into 401k accounts and used it to float their own personal retirement funds. They literally took already earned money straight outta people's wallets and all they get is a slap on the wrist. Michael Jackson and Catholic priests both have illicit sex orgies, and molest hundreds of little boys, but guess what? Aside from some poor publicity no one got punished. Hell, OJ killed two people, had their blood on his clothes, and in his car, and right now instead of being in prison he is out on some golf course in southern California.
all these things show that there is no "Right or wrong," and that all it really comes down to is weather other people approve or not of your behavior. As long as they don't know what you did, they can't disapprove of it.

[karmabob]

Interesting thoughts and shows you are thinking which is better than 75% of the population perhaps. Let me start it this way....probably all or most of you out there agree that Satan is here doing his thing with society or that he exists. Now if you believe there is a Satan you would have to learn where did he come from? It is written in the Bible and he was a fallen angel because he decided to go his way and not follow gods way, he knew a better way which is similar to most of us growing up "we already know it all" by age 16 or so. Later in life we notice how much mom and dad have learned so much since we were 16 (see the humor there?). If you don't get it now you probably will later that we are gods children put here to do his work on earth and choose our future paths in the process (heaven or hell, purgatory is a delay into heaven). Ever wonder why things on earth are here and how it all plays together, don't see this stuff on other planets now do we? Ever wonder how the universe exists as being eternal or infinity, or if it were contained, then what contains that, and contains that??? So, I am believing we are here to serve God and his other children while here on earth and according to how we perform will decide our souls fate later on. Our society has fallen so far in 50 years that Satan is currently having his day, but in the end as it is written he is a loser and will perish come armagedon and judgement day.

Humortime- I didn't come here to be insulted! (no, where do you normally go then?) Groucho Marx-quote