Supra vs Panda, Carrera S vs Panda

[-The Stig-]

Originally Posted by SR240Z

i dont think he has ran on a track, but i remember him running with a gtech pro a 13.2 i believe with almost no traction in first and a shitty 60ft.

It was 13.4 @ 106 with a 2.2 60ft on some dusty back round that was crap for traction. But it was empty enough to test on. Plus I had 2000LS1Z28 sitting shotgun, I think he weighs close to 180lbs. Tall guy... not to mention that night was the first time I'd drivin the car in 2 months. So, I'd forgotten how to launch the damn car.

Originally Posted by RaidenKing

makes me proud to own something remotely close. I have 2700lbs or so in the 240sx but how much do those damn z's weigh? Why don't you go buy a bigger turbo if you're aiming for a vehicle suited for daily driving. Nothing like being able to keep out of full spool at 3000rpm like shortshifting at 2500rpm through traffic and going to use that 3000rpm+ power when you really need it.


Really though, my mod list isn't all too far off from yours, I'm thinking if I got a good tune and a chance to turn the boost up we'd be a good match, I've been learning lately ever since I got my cars about traction woes on medium boost, we'll have to let loose a couple sr20dets of full boost fury onto the streets if you don't wind up selling.

How would buying a bigger turbo help out daily driving? Short shifting at around 2500-2800rpm is fine. Problem is, it does not solve any of the other problems I have with the car. It wouldn't make it anymore comfortable. It wouldn't add A/C. It wouldn't add a heater. And I'd still have to shift it everywhere.

Problems = not solved.

Upgrading to a larger turbo would be about a $2400 job. Cause I'd need the turbo, injectors and some form of ECU tuning and Fuel management system. Then, once I do hit boost... it'll have even worse traction problems.

To solve that, that's another $3800 in full suspension, wheels and tires, and of course a good LSD unit.

So that's $6200 more, just to make it more 'streetable'? Logic escapes me thinking about that. Ontop of that... gas milege as decent as it is. Will go to shit soon as you touch injectors and tuning.

Let us not speak of interior upgrades. To make it comfortable, you'll have to spend another $800 for a quality seat and harness, Double that amount if you want the passenger to be comfortable as well. To make it more comfortable, cause now the car has full suspension. It'll most definately ride stiffer. Due to it being lighter in the front and not enough weight to preload the suspension such as with a I6 or V8 Motor.

Techinically speaking you've made the car lighter, but the balance of the vehicle is disrupted. It is my personal belief that the Z was designed to have a nose heavy load out. With SR20, it does not. Thus to get that balance in handling it once had, you have to carry stiffer springs in the rear to push the weight forward.

But, that makes the ride harsh. And after watching my friends SR240z with full suspension. Ride down a freeway, the front end bounces and isn't as planted as one would think. Spring rates are off maybe? I think it's lack of too much weight.

The one flaw in the SR20DET powered Z. Not enough weight over front axel... not enough traction... not enough down force... understeer.

Cause... and effect.

Can it be fixed? That I'm not sure of. Am I willing to spend an unknown amount of money to find out?

No.

It's a fun car... very fun to toy with. But, I ultimately think it is a flawed design. Although, I seriously hope I'm wrong. Cause it is so fun.




EDIT: I didn't even mention brakes to stop all the power. That's about $1500 alone.

[speedthrill]

yep that totally explained it. Tx.
I understand it now and i agree with you. When you have no other car it could get irritating some time.

[RaidenKing]

Originally Posted by RedNeck383

It was 13.4 @ 106 with a 2.2 60ft on some dusty back round that was crap for traction. But it was empty enough to test on. Plus I had 2000LS1Z28 sitting shotgun, I think he weighs close to 180lbs. Tall guy... not to mention that night was the first time I'd drivin the car in 2 months. So, I'd forgotten how to launch the damn car.





How would buying a bigger turbo help out daily driving? Short shifting at around 2500-2800rpm is fine. Problem is, it does not solve any of the other problems I have with the car. It wouldn't make it anymore comfortable. It wouldn't add A/C. It wouldn't add a heater. And I'd still have to shift it everywhere.

Problems = not solved.

Upgrading to a larger turbo would be about a $2400 job. Cause I'd need the turbo, injectors and some form of ECU tuning and Fuel management system. Then, once I do hit boost... it'll have even worse traction problems.

To solve that, that's another $3800 in full suspension, wheels and tires, and of course a good LSD unit.

So that's $6200 more, just to make it more 'streetable'? Logic escapes me thinking about that. Ontop of that... gas milege as decent as it is. Will go to shit soon as you touch injectors and tuning.

Let us not speak of interior upgrades. To make it comfortable, you'll have to spend another $800 for a quality seat and harness, Double that amount if you want the passenger to be comfortable as well. To make it more comfortable, cause now the car has full suspension. It'll most definately ride stiffer. Due to it being lighter in the front and not enough weight to preload the suspension such as with a I6 or V8 Motor.

Techinically speaking you've made the car lighter, but the balance of the vehicle is disrupted. It is my personal belief that the Z was designed to have a nose heavy load out. With SR20, it does not. Thus to get that balance in handling it once had, you have to carry stiffer springs in the rear to push the weight forward.

But, that makes the ride harsh. And after watching my friends SR240z with full suspension. Ride down a freeway, the front end bounces and isn't as planted as one would think. Spring rates are off maybe? I think it's lack of too much weight.

The one flaw in the SR20DET powered Z. Not enough weight over front axel... not enough traction... not enough down force... understeer.

Cause... and effect.

Can it be fixed? That I'm not sure of. Am I willing to spend an unknown amount of money to find out?

No.

It's a fun car... very fun to toy with. But, I ultimately think it is a flawed design. Although, I seriously hope I'm wrong. Cause it is so fun.




EDIT: I didn't even mention brakes to stop all the power. That's about $1500 alone.

oh well my swap came with A/C and all that good stuff
Sits pretty comfy too. I was half sarcastic when I mentioned the idea of a bigger turbo because the larger injectors needed along with the tune you'd have to run would rape you as far as gas would be concerned. I still like the idea of full spool at 3000rpm though. Too bad you didn't get her swapped into a 240sx (half sarcastic of course once more as it is a really cool project/car from my perspective) because my ride is amazing with the stock suspension.

[-The Stig-]

Originally Posted by RaidenKing

oh well my swap came with A/C and all that good stuff
Sits pretty comfy too. I was half sarcastic when I mentioned the idea of a bigger turbo because the larger injectors needed along with the tune you'd have to run would rape you as far as gas would be concerned. I still like the idea of full spool at 3000rpm though. Too bad you didn't get her swapped into a 240sx (half sarcastic of course once more as it is a really cool project/car from my perspective) because my ride is amazing with the stock suspension.

Hehe, understood...

But, I've got that fancy exhaust manifold, so I get full spool around 3500-3800rpm. Which I'm happy with.

[drftk1d]

damn supras!

nice races, sorry i didnt catch this thread earlier

[SR240Z]

the car in stock form weighs around 2350 lbs. The sr20 is quite a bit lighter but not enough to bring the car down to 2000 lbs. Since the car still has stock brakes, stock gas tank, stock dash. Guessing its around 2200-2250 lbs right around there without driver.

[chevytrucks92]

You ricer. Claiming victory after only 2 gears. Psshtt!

[-The Stig-]

hahah

[chevytrucks92]

Originally Posted by RedNeck383

hahah

Lol. I figured you'd get the "two gears" joke, considering I have a GM Powerglide tranny, lol.

And go buy you a damn car trailer and use that super fast Econoline Van to pull it around and turn that Z car into a real racecar! Build you a small block, powerglide, and get ya a narrowed rear end and just turn that thing into a racecar. If you think its fun now when you're racing, then you'll really think its fun then!

[-The Stig-]

Yeah... we'll see about that.

Don't hold your breathe on it though Matt!

[chevytrucks92]

Lol. Well its a thought. And since you're down close to 2000 lbs, then you'd wind up weighing around 2500 when you got through with everything you needed. Maybe even less. Anyways, weight is where you get your speed! I wished mine only weighed 2300 or so instead of 2700. I'd have a 9 second car no doubt.

I mean it'd run into some money, but you'd be spending alot on a new car as well, lol. I konw you can get a professional tube frame and 12-point roll cage where all you got to do is weld it together from JEGS for less tehn $600 I THINK. You've probably already got rack and pinion steering, but if not, you can get that with the frame (also can get a 4-link or ladder bar rear suspension). Now that gets expensive, but I'd say for around $5000-6000 you could have a rolling chassis that's professionally designed, and thats how you make a super good race car.

That's what I want to do for mine one of these days. I've got a tube frame, but its home made out of triple strenght steel and its big and VERY heavy. That'd also give me a rack and pinion steering, and front discs (got rear disc, but front drums).

[tha_new_guy]

Originally Posted by RedNeck383

...Let us not speak of interior upgrades. To make it comfortable, you'll have to spend another $800 for a quality seat and harness, Double that amount if you want the passenger to be comfortable as well. To make it more comfortable, cause now the car has full suspension. It'll most definately ride stiffer. Due to it being lighter in the front and not enough weight to preload the suspension such as with a I6 or V8 Motor.

Techinically speaking you've made the car lighter, but the balance of the vehicle is disrupted. It is my personal belief that the Z was designed to have a nose heavy load out. With SR20, it does not. Thus to get that balance in handling it once had, you have to carry stiffer springs in the rear to push the weight forward.

But, that makes the ride harsh. And after watching my friends SR240z with full suspension. Ride down a freeway, the front end bounces and isn't as planted as one would think. Spring rates are off maybe? I think it's lack of too much weight.

The one flaw in the SR20DET powered Z. Not enough weight over front axel... not enough traction... not enough down force... understeer.

Cause... and effect.

Can it be fixed? That I'm not sure of. Am I willing to spend an unknown amount of money to find out?

No.

It's a fun car... very fun to toy with. But, I ultimately think it is a flawed design. Although, I seriously hope I'm wrong. Cause it is so fun.




EDIT: I didn't even mention brakes to stop all the power. That's about $1500 alone.

Wait.....are you admitting that it just may have been a better idea to drop the 383 into the 240, rather than the SR20? Oh, man, I soo called this like a year ago.....

You and your quest for light weight..... psh. Wouldn't that 383 have weighed little more than the original I6 that was in it?

[-The Stig-]

Originally Posted by tha_new_guy

Wait.....are you admitting that it just may have been a better idea to drop the 383 into the 240, rather than the SR20? Oh, man, I soo called this like a year ago.....

You and your quest for light weight..... psh. Wouldn't that 383 have weighed little more than the original I6 that was in it?

Nope not saying that at all.

The 383 would of been a bad choice for that car, too much down low power. It would never of hooked, how many times do I have to explain that, that 383 would be making 400+ft-lbs @ 2000 - 4500rpm... That's not much off idle.

Never hook.

[drftk1d]

not to mention he had to keep an sr away from the 240sx boys

[chevytrucks92]

Originally Posted by RedNeck383

Nope not saying that at all.

The 383 would of been a bad choice for that car, too much down low power. It would never of hooked, how many times do I have to explain that, that 383 would be making 400+ft-lbs @ 2000 - 4500rpm... That's not much off idle.

Never hook.

You could have made it hook. It woudl have took a little more greenstuff, but you could have made it hook. Ladder bar or 4-link suspension and big tires and you could have got some traction. You may not have had much for going around curves, but who cares about going around curves!?!?!?!?

You could have got ya a turbo400 or so tranny with a stall converter and it woudl have brought the front tires off the ground if you'd had somebody to set the rear suspension up right.