fasicism anyone?

[lazysmurff]

i recently wrote an article for my college newpaper (i cant remember if i posted it here or not, probably not) that called for republicans to demand that they're party return to its conservative roots, or leave the party to the quasi-facisists that are taking it over. In the original article i didnt expand much on what exactly made the emergin republican party fasicist, merely pointing out generalities, and it is this i wish to exppand on

i will use a list of charateristics of facists regimes (like hitler, mousolini, pinochet, salazar, franco, etc) provided by Laurence W. Britt in a recent article that bears the title of this thread. I will then expand on these characterisitics showing how the current regime displays all of them to one extent or another. I am sure, infact, that America is heading in this direction one way or the other, and im sure it was long before i became politically aware. *disclaimer time* although i am using recent instances, mostly of the current administration, it is because i am only 20 and only recently politically aware, so its all i have in recent memory. so onard we go.

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. Powerful and continuing expressions of nationalism. From the prominent displays of flags and bunting to the ubiquitous lapel pins, the fervor to show patriotic nationalism, both on the part of the regime itself and of citizens caught up in its frenzy, was always obvious. Catchy slogans, pride in the military, and demands for unity were common themes in expressing this nationalism. It was usually coupled with a suspicion of things foreign that often bordered on xenophobia.

i think its rather obvious that our presidency past and present has always exploited national images prominently, but it is the current "frenzy" of the citizens that is being whipped up by the adminstration currently that makes me worry. It has reached the point of xenophobia with the majority of the country, so much to the fact that we forget how much we depend on other countries for the survival of our way of life. besides, noone was that patriotic on september 10th.

Disdain for the importance of human rights. The regimes themselves viewed human rights as of little value and a hindrance to realizing the objectives of the ruling elite. Through clever use of propaganda, the population was brought to accept these human rights abuses by marginalizing, even demonizing, those being targeted. When abuse was egregious, the tactic was to use secrecy, denial, and disinformation.

our government is continually violating basic human rights, although rarely within our own borders. torture at guantanamo bay, abu graib prison, and the continued shipping of "terrorists suspects" to other countries with looser standards of torture for interrogation. Not only that, but high ranking officials (like W) wont even make direct orders to our military personel against torture, even after all the scandals in Iraq prisons. and the demonizing of these people is rather obvious, especially Muslims.

Identification of enemies/scapegoats as a unifying cause. The most significant common thread among these regimes was the use of scapegoating as a means to divert the people’s attention from other problems, to shift blame for failures, and to channel frustration in controlled directions. The methods of choice—relentless propaganda and disinformation—were usually effective. Often the regimes would incite “spontaneous” acts against the target scapegoats, usually communists, socialists, liberals, Jews, ethnic and racial minorities, traditional national enemies, members of other religions, secularists, homosexuals, and “terrorists.” Active opponents of these regimes were inevitably labeled as terrorists and dealt with accordingly.

not only are we now "unified" as a country against the threat of terrorists, but the conservative pundits (and im sure encouraged by the administration and republican party) have villianized the liberals (using such things as disinformation and relentless propoganda) of our nation. being called a liberal has become an insult. they are displayed as ignorant, stupid, weak, etc. not to mention the continued scapegoating of minorites that really isnt because of the administration, but built into our society.

The supremacy of the military/avid militarism. Ruling elites always identified closely with the military and the industrial infrastructure that supported it. A disproportionate share of national resources was allocated to the military, even when domestic needs were acute. The military was seen as an expression of nationalism, and was used whenever possible to assert national goals, intimidate other nations, and increase the power and prestige of the ruling elite.

Not only do our leaders never miss a chance to indentify with the military, i believe it is rather obvious that the military is being used as a tool to further the goals of this administration, rather than to protect the lifestyle of Americans. according to the CIA world factbook, america spent 3.3% of its GDP on military, which is not only a full 1.5% above most other nations, but when considered against the rest of the worlds military expendatures, we are grossly disproportionant. and what better way to express nationalism than through images of our military?

Rampant sexism. Beyond the simple fact that the political elite and the national culture were male-dominated, these regimes inevitably viewed women as second-class citizens. They were adamantly anti-abortion and also homophobic. These attitudes were usually codified in Draconian laws that enjoyed strong support by the orthodox religion of the country, thus lending the regime cover for its abuses.

while America has definatly made strides in this department, its rather obvious that politics is still a male dominated sphere. and here we are, moving against abortion, even calling for a world ban on it. and lets talk about homophobia. every state that could passed an anti gay marriage act, and the government is still pushing for a constitutional ban on it, not to mention denying gay couples the right to adopt or foster kids, even when its been proven to have any detrimental effects on the kids. though sexism is more a societal problem than a government problem (and its everywhere still)

A controlled mass media. Under some of the regimes, the mass media were under strict direct control and could be relied upon never to stray from the party line. Other regimes exercised more subtle power to ensure media orthodoxy. Methods included the control of licensing and access to resources, economic pressure, appeals to patriotism, and implied threats. The leaders of the mass media were often politically compatible with the power elite. The result was usually success in keeping the general public unaware of the regimes’ excesses.

while im not yet cynical enough to believe that our media is CONTROLED by the government, i do believe that the media is overly anxious to toe the party line, and does simply disseminate information straight from party spin doctors rather than do any actual investigation. while not controlled, our mass news networks have become the mouthpiece of the government rather a source of unbiased news. thank god for the internet.

Obsession with national security. Inevitably, a national security apparatus was under direct control of the ruling elite. It was usually an instrument of oppression, operating in secret and beyond any constraints. Its actions were justified under the rubric of protecting “national security,” and questioning its activities was portrayed as unpatriotic or even treasonous.

i dont even think i have to go into this do i? i certainly hope not.

Religion and ruling elite tied together. Unlike communist regimes, the fascist and protofascist regimes were never proclaimed as godless by their opponents. In fact, most of the regimes attached themselves to the predominant religion of the country and chose to portray themselves as militant defenders of that religion. The fact that the ruling elite’s behavior was incompatible with the precepts of the religion was generally swept under the rug. Propaganda kept up the illusion that the ruling elites were defenders of the faith and opponents of the “godless.” A perception was manufactured that opposing the power elite was tantamount to an attack on religion

while our government does claim to be the protecors of any religion, they do claim to be protecting "morality" and by morality they mean a "conservative christian morality". It is also no secret that George puts a great deal of emphasis on his faith, especially when pandering to the bible belt and the grassroots christian coilitions. some analysts belive that the success of his campaign was based primarily in a very large, last minute, grassroots push by the religious sect of our country. exit polls, as unreliable as they are, reveal a large amount of people voting for Bush for moral reasons above all else. Although it remains to be seen, Bush is expected to pander quite heavily to the evangelists that got him elected.

Power of corporations protected. Although the personal life of ordinary citizens was under strict control, the ability of large corporations to operate in relative freedom was not compromised. The ruling elite saw the corporate structure as a way to not only ensure military production (in developed states), but also as an additional means of social control. Members of the economic elite were often pampered by the political elite to ensure a continued mutuality of interests, especially in the repression of “have-not” citizens.

I think we are all painfully aware of the amount of power and freedom corporations have in our country. It is not only a tennant of capitalism anymore, but rather spedcial interests holoding sway over our elected officials. They provide campaign funding, and the politicians in turn look out for the corporations interest. there are reasons why the government doesnt push for stricter emissions or MPG requirements (example, the suburban H2, which was labeled a farm truck, due to serious lobbying by GM so that they didnt have to control MPG on it, despite the fact that i have yet to see one do anything but carry a soccer mom to their PTA meeting). think also about media corporations socializing people to behave certain ways, etc etc etc.

Power of labor suppressed or eliminated. Since organized labor was seen as the one power center that could challenge the political hegemony of the ruling elite and its corporate allies, it was inevitably crushed or made powerless. The poor formed an underclass, viewed with suspicion or outright contempt. Under some regimes, being poor was considered akin to a vice.

i dont know much about the labor movement, other than jimmy hoffa is buried in an undisclosed location. but given that unions seem to be going the way of the DoDo, and that the government does what it can to help business fight them, id say we're on our way.

Disdain and suppression of intellectuals and the arts. Intellectuals and the inherent freedom of ideas and expression associated with them were anathema to these regimes. Intellectual and academic freedom were considered subversive to national security and the patriotic ideal. Universities were tightly controlled; politically unreliable faculty harassed or eliminated. Unorthodox ideas or expressions of dissent were strongly attacked, silenced, or crushed. To these regimes, art and literature should serve the national interest or they had no right to exist.

While i dont think our government is doing anything directly to shut down intellectuals and the arts, the pundants and their ilk do quite a bit to stiffle intellectual conversation. as well, try arguing with anyone thats strictly for either side, and you'll find rater quickly that they possess ideas that are hypocritical, unfounded, and that the argument basically comes down to pointless, unintellectual drivel. while the administration has troubles with its "intellegence" it is our population and the party "fan boys" that cause intellegence and art to be undesirable. not to mention the labeling of intellectual liberals as crazys, and calling anyone who intelligently opposed the war on Iraq "unpatriotic"

Obsession with crime and punishment. Most of these regimes maintained Draconian systems of criminal justice with huge prison populations. The police were often glorified and had almost unchecked power, leading to rampant abuse. “Normal” and political crime were often merged into trumped-up criminal charges and sometimes used against political opponents of the regime. Fear, and hatred, of criminals or “traitors” was often promoted among the population as an excuse for more police power.

i think huge prison population is an understatement in our country. but the scarier thing is that those in dissent of our government are spied on as potential terrorists, and threats to national security, others are arressted and incarcerated for ridiculous periods of time for minor offenses, like jay walking or driving violations. We willing sign away our rights to the FBI, CIA, and Homeland Security for fear their being "traitors" and "terrorists" among us. certainly we dont live in a Nazi-esque police state, but we're pretty far from where we should be.

Rampant cronyism and corruption. Those in business circles and close to the power elite often used their position to enrich themselves. This corruption worked both ways; the power elite would receive financial gifts and property from the economic elite, who in turn would gain the benefit of government favoritism. Members of the power elite were in a position to obtain vast wealth from other sources as well: for example, by stealing national resources. With the national security apparatus under control and the media muzzled, this corruption was largely unconstrained and not well understood by the general population.

Ken Lay, Dick Cheney, Saudis in Texas, etc etc etc. The powerful elite, especially those that provide fundage, always recieve "favors" and the like. Its almost become standard accepted practice in america for the friends and contributors of politicians to reap reward and benefit. While our government does maintain a decent level of transparency due in large part to vigilant activist groups and the like, but our government does contain ridiculous amounts of cronyism.

Fraudulent elections. Elections in the form of plebiscites or public opinion polls were usually bogus. When actual elections with candidates were held, they would usually be perverted by the power elite to get the desired result. Common methods included maintaining control of the election machinery, intimidating and disenfranchising opposition voters, destroying or disallowing legal votes, and, as a last resort, turning to a judiciary beholden to the power elite.

say what you will about our elections and how they arent fraudulant at all, but there are ALWAYS reports of disenfranchisement of minority voters. for instance the famous Florida case of 2000, in arkansas where rural blacks were told to be sure and vote on Nov 3rd by party volunteers who claimed to be election officials, corporations friendly to one party or the other creating and controling voting machines etc. not to mention the whole election process in general has us voting on two guys with the same agenda who serve the same corporate masters. pretty fraudulant to me.
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while i realize that we are a far cry from Nazi Germany, the simularities are ridiculously astonishing. we, as citizens, need to be aware of whats going on a do what we can to stop it. like it or not, this involves accepting some things, like the fact that gay's are people, and therefore should have all the rights the rest of us have. Abortion is a medical procedure, and no governing body should have say over whether or not a woman has any medical procedure, That big business needs to get the hell out of our government and actually requires some regulations before we end up being ruled by coca-cola and disney. yes, controling business may be counter to the beliefs of personal freedom etc but corporations arent people (wanna argue this with me, feel free to drop a PM) and as such, we should look out for OUR rights before we look out for theirs. these are just a few things to keep us from slipping.

and im done.

[YogsVR4]

Originally Posted by lazysmurff

while i realize that we are a far cry from Nazi Germany, the simularities are ridiculously astonishing. we, as citizens, need to be aware of whats going on a do what we can to stop it. like it or not, this involves accepting some things, like the fact that gay's are people, and therefore should have all the rights the rest of us have.

What rights don't they have? I'm sure the word marriage comes up, but beyond that?

As for getting married, not everyone has the right to get married. There are restrictions. You can't marry your sister. You can't get married while your married. You can't marry at 15 (but at 16 you can, but not be held responsible as an adult if you commit a crime. Thats another story)

Mormons are people too, but they can't marry more then one person.

Abortion is a medical procedure, and no governing body should have say over whether or not a woman has any medical procedure,

Abortion is murder. Keep it legal if you must, but don't sugar coat it as just a 'medical procedure' Thats no different then calling the haulicost 'scientific research'.

That big business needs to get the hell out of our government and actually requires some regulations before we end up being ruled by coca-cola and disney.

I'd agree. But so should the ACLU, NRA, AFL-CIO, Teamsters, UAW, Teachers Unions and the varying lawyer associations.

yes, controling business may be counter to the beliefs of personal freedom etc but corporations arent people (wanna argue this with me, feel free to drop a PM) and as such, we should look out for OUR rights before we look out for theirs. these are just a few things to keep us from slipping.

Yup - same for those other organizations.


Until there is an official government agency that censors all media before its published, any claims of nazism or fascism is crying wolf. You want fascism, talk to the folks in China, North Korea and Cuba then come on back.

[lazysmurff]

i with you Yogs, and i hope you give me more credit than actually thinking i believe we are living under facism now. my point is merely this:

facism doesnt appear over night. it seeps in. maybe administrations dont even notice, or desire, facism but the creep happens anyway. one regulation here, another stolen right there. it adds up.

and yes, there isnt a government organization that censors the press, or attempts to change history ala 1984, but we sure try to change history anyway.

Saddam's a good guy! oh wait, no he's not! Osama is our good friend, we'll train him! oh shit! kill Osama! we're going to war for terrorism! no, that wont work....We're going to war for WMD!..no no no We're going to war for democracy...No wait, we're going to war for...wait, why are we there?

yea, its not regulated by any specific government organization, but it happens all the same. and its alalrming how quickly the people of our country forget our countries past, and how willing they are to do it in the name of banding together against another enemy.

and as for gay rights, abortion, and all that stuff id rather not get into it here, as it would cause this thread to turn into yet another flaming piss fight about the same boring crap...so check your pm box for my responses.

[Twitch1]

Good article over all. None of the seething-hate-below the-surface stuff. You did good!

[lazysmurff]

thank you...i think

edit: there is definatly alot of seething hate under the surface, but its more at the system in general rather than any specific person or administration. im more upset with our society as a whole, and they way our population tends to let things go without question (due in large part to the efforts of multimedia conglomerants who need the support of the government to keep hold on the monoploy they have over the information we recieve). there's also alot of passive acceptance of the status-quo, and also alot of ignorance and blatant bigotry in our population. thats where my hate really lies.

i just try not to let that hate sneak into my argments, as it tends to discredit them.

[Twitch1]

lazysmurff- I am a writer/editor and can tell it was actually composed instead of thoughts strung together and some research was done. I'm not saying I agree with everything but it is a decent composition. I hope your teacher grades it as a body of work and not in a prejudiced way due to content.

[Muscletang]

Lazysmurff are you now going to do a paper on the left/democratic party? They have big problems of their own that need to be addressed as well.

That and the fact that their foot is always in their mouth so...

[carrrnuttt]

Originally Posted by Muscletang

Lazysmurff are you now going to do a paper on the left/democratic party? They have big problems of their own that need to be addressed as well.

That and the fact that their foot is always in their mouth so...

I think the article applies to all, although it does espouse the current administration's activities more, moreso to the fact that they are the only recent examples as of late. I totally agree to the fact that Kerry was merely a mirror-image of Bush, though I preferred him, (warning: what follows is opinion, and is not being given as fact) as I saw him as weaker over-all, and would have been more susceptible to actually listening to constituents, and maybe legislators from both sides, rather than doing the opposite when pressured, and pushing his personal ego-driven politics, and his party's line. What people saw as weaknesses in Kerry, I saw as a strength, especially for somebody that is supposed to be the head of the government "for the people, by the people".

As far as the part of the article, where it talks about demonizing all those opposed to whatever the ruling party is at the time, I say it has worked well with you. I work with both Republicans and Democrats everyday, not to mention possible third, and non-party subscribers, such as me, and I can swear, I can't tell them apart. They all look American to me. Somehow, you have equated "not Republican" to "unpatriotic", "un-American", or whatever insult you can think of. Tell me I am wrong about that last part.

[lazysmurff]

this wasnt an attack on any specific party. like i said in the original post, it is only because i have a very limited scope of political awareness (being that bush pissed me off enough to start caring) that all the examples are about his administration. given a few weeks of hunting and research and writing and such im sure i could come up with a time line of these examples coming into being across party lines.

but the fact of the matter is that this has nothing to do with parties. read a few of my posts from around the time of the election, and you'll see rather quickly how i feel about the "two parties" in our country. and you'll also see a fair amount of democrat bashing if thats whats you're looking for.

what it really boils down to, the more i think about it, is a select few rich white males (and a few token females) who hold the power, either through political office, huge media conglomerats, massive corporations, or just ridiculous amounts of money, making sure that they keep the power, by any means necessary. its no mistake that both major parties are so eerily similar, and that major corporations and PAC's contribute heavily to both parties at the same time.

this isnt against one party or the other, its against the powerful elite that have a strangle hold on democracy from both sides of the aisle. if you still wish to play at party "politics" through rose colored glasses, and ignore the fact that not a single politician in DC gives a damn about you or your well being, and instead believe that one party or another genuinly does hold your best interest at heart, be my guest. i, for one, have given up on "the system"

[nismo_power]

our government is continually violating basic human rights, although rarely within our own borders. torture at guantanamo bay, abu graib prison, and the continued shipping of "terrorists suspects" to other countries with looser standards of torture for interrogation. Not only that, but high ranking officials (like W) wont even make direct orders to our military personel against torture, even after all the scandals in Iraq prisons. and the demonizing of these people is rather obvious, especially Muslims.

how the fuck can you say that its wrong that we took a few "pictures" with the prisoners? maybe we beat them alittle bit. OH WELL. deal with it. they were "Unlawful Combatants" which gave us the right to do what ever the hell we want with them, a loophole to the geneva convention. although i dont know why we follow rules of war, considering our enemy is capturing CIVILIANS and BEHEADING THEM for no reason other than they are american. they know damn well that they arent military, so they just decide off with their head. in the words of napoleon dynamite "WHAT WOULD YOU DO IN A SITUATION LIKE THAT?" well? wtf would you do in a situation like that. IMO, kill them all. fuck em. catch every single one of those mother fuckers, cut their throats, leave them in the street to strangle to death. well rape their wives, strangle them, and well well even hang their children from telephone wires. not that i am suggesting we do this, im merly trying to point out that when our enemy doesnt give a shit about rules, why should we. "fight fire with fire". i guarentee that if we started torturing them or their family they would quit fighting pretty damn quick. they can get away with it because our president and our country are pussies. hell, im sure the armed forces over there would love to go on a blood bath, but when our president and government shit their pants about taking some pictures then we are truly in the shithold. "OMG ITS AGSINT THEIR RELIGION TO BE NAKED WITH OTHER MEN! OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG, NEVERMIND THE FACT THEY ARE BEHEADING AMERICAN CIVILIANS, WE ARE SOOOOO SORRY EVERYONE!!!"

Not only do our leaders never miss a chance to indentify with the military, i believe it is rather obvious that the military is being used as a tool to further the goals of this administration, rather than to protect the lifestyle of Americans. according to the CIA world factbook, america spent 3.3% of its GDP on military, which is not only a full 1.5% above most other nations, but when considered against the rest of the worlds military expendatures, we are grossly disproportionant. and what better way to express nationalism than through images of our military?

read reply above. our military should be killing every one in sight. its us vs. them, lets take some action.

i think huge prison population is an understatement in our country. but the scarier thing is that those in dissent of our government are spied on as potential terrorists, and threats to national security, others are arressted and incarcerated for ridiculous periods of time for minor offenses, like jay walking or driving violations. We willing sign away our rights to the FBI, CIA, and Homeland Security for fear their being "traitors" and "terrorists" among us. certainly we dont live in a Nazi-esque police state, but we're pretty far from where we should be.

you commit a crime, you get punished. is that so wrong?

[R.S. Vlady]

Originally Posted by nismo_power

how the fuck can you say that its wrong that we took a few "pictures" with the prisoners? maybe we beat them alittle bit. OH WELL. deal with it. they were "Unlawful Combatants" which gave us the right to do what ever the hell we want with them, a loophole to the geneva convention. although i dont know why we follow rules of war, considering our enemy is capturing CIVILIANS and BEHEADING THEM for no reason other than they are american. they know damn well that they arent military, so they just decide off with their head. in the words of napoleon dynamite "WHAT WOULD YOU DO IN A SITUATION LIKE THAT?" well? wtf would you do in a situation like that. IMO, kill them all. fuck em. catch every single one of those mother fuckers, cut their throats, leave them in the street to strangle to death. well rape their wives, strangle them, and well well even hang their children from telephone wires. not that i am suggesting we do this, im merly trying to point out that when our enemy doesnt give a shit about rules, why should we. "fight fire with fire". i guarentee that if we started torturing them or their family they would quit fighting pretty damn quick. they can get away with it because our president and our country are pussies.

nismo, when i began reading your reply i thought you were kidding, but you're actually serious. The geneva convention and international criminal courts were put in place so that no government may legitimately do what america is doing right now. Insurgents in Iraq aren't a part of international community, they're not a legitimate nation, but U.S. is. Just as idividuals are bound by laws, after two World Wars people have learned that nations must be bound by laws too. A lot of people in the U.S. are readily reeking the benefits of global economy, consuming cheap shit made in poor countries, and yet don't see any responsibilities on their part.

you say that if U.S. where too go after terrorists' families, they'll stop fighting. That's not true. Would you if someone killed or tortured your family? No, you'd probably become a martir like them. Russian soldiers have no mercy for chechen rebels, in return chechens began blowing up russian subways and schools. For every action there's a reaction.

People in the middle east have absolute right to be pissed. Look what Sept.11 did to Americans. Most people had only an ideological tie with the world trade center, and sympathy for those who died and their families, but most people here didn't know those who died personally. Now imagine living in the middle east. Palestinians had their homes bulldosed and their land taken by Israelies. Kurds in Iraq where gassed with chemical weapons acquired from the U.S. People in Lebanon have no control over their country, which was occupied by Siria in exchange for giving part of its land to Israel. Big brother U.S. was watching over, of course. For the past 50 years people in the middle east have seen scores of U.S. planes over their heads, U.S. tanks in their streets, U.S. bombs fall on their cities. over 40% of world's military spending belongs to U.S. and our military is everywhere. People have got to be tired of this shit.

Iraqi people now have to live in utter humiliation. They've seen their brothers, sisters, friends, children and parents die by the thousands after U.S. intervention. They've been humiliated. They have no control over their natural resources!! Now while Iraqis continue to die everyday, or live without electricity or running water, we, the West, send over scores of energy companies with private security firms, truck drivers that make outrageous wages, journalists making careers, as if just to rub it in Iraqis faces. Iraqis have all rights to be pissed. Even Ukraine is in to make a profit from occupation of Iraq by setting up its own energy interests in the country. What you got now is angry, deprived, humiliated youth growing up in the middle east, they only live to avenge their country, their family, their religion. And they won't be afraid to die for it. Israeli occupation of Palestine should have shown to the rest of the world that the best way to make terrorists is to terrorize people.

What a lot of people in this country seem to believe is that some people are inherently Evil. So, we kill the evil people and then go on with building our Free World. All i can say about their intellectual capacity is that it hasn't advanced since the middle ages. What is scary however, is that it is precisely them, American rednecks, who are shaping todays world events.