'95 Metro - Dim Headlights

[mrmambo]

Great site - I just discovered this resource and would appreciate some help.

Headlight problems - 1995 Geo Metro:
It's my wife's car and the lights are very dim, day and night. We've tried replacing the bulbs and the fuses, but no luck. We took it to the dealer, who said some wiring had deteriorated and they wanted $400-500 to replace it, but wouldn't give us details.

Do you have any hints? The lights aren't out completely, but are pretty dim; the one is dimmer than the other and it's not really safe to drive at night. The DRL seems to be the same as night setting: both are dim.

It seems that there's lots of Geo headlight problems, but it sounds like it's usually that they go out on one setting or the other. Ours are working both in DRL and night settings, but are verrrry dim.

If it's the underdash junction box, how do I test and fix/replace this? I'm a pretty handy guy, but haven't done much electrical work; I don't even have a continuity tester. Details and suggested sources for info and parts would be much appreciated - thanks! :-)

-Mark-

[Salemetro]

Yeah....wiring has deteriorated?? Sure.....$400.00 please (lol). What they are more than likely trying to fix is the ground for the lighting harness.....or replace the bulb sockets. My guess is that it is probably a main ground that has gone bad....thus both lights are dim. Try looking for signs of corrosion on any of the wires.....specifically any that ground to the body. My guess is that is where that problem is. I'll try to post a link to a wiring diagram for you shortly (no pun intended).

[mrmambo]

LOL - yeah, that's what I originally had thought it might be; they talked about a similar problem on "Car Talk" one week.

I did look around, but couldn't find where the grounds were. There was a couple of wires grounded on the passenger side front right next to the headlight; I unscrewed it and detached it from the body, but the lights didn't vary at all.

Hints are where to look would be appreciated - or: can I just run a new ground directly from the headlight connectors? Which wire would it be? There's 3 there.

I looked for new connectors online and at local Autozone and Advanced Auto Parts, but couldn't find them. The Geo one has a slanted side, but all the ones I found at the store had 3 straight sides (made a "U").

Thanks again -

-m-

[Salemetro]

Uuuuugh! I can't get a good scan of the wiring diagram for the headlight system (HP Quality..lol) Anyone else out there??

OKay....after looking over the diagram, it looks like your headlight relay ground is under the driver's side kick-panel.....give a look there for starters.

[Salemetro]

Are both the high and low beams affected?? If so, it is more than likely a bad headlight relay or relay ground. Hope this helps.

[mrmambo]

The low beams - D-side is verrrrrry dim, P-side is dim
The high beams - D-side is bright, P-side is out

Any suggestions on where to look for the relay or relay ground?

Sorry for all the questions - I'm just not familiar with wiring issues.

Thx!

[Salemetro]

I can email you a jpeg of the wiring diagram....IM me with where to send it.....kinda large Jpeg (145kb), though....only way my scanner would make it look fairly decent.

[mrmambo]

James:

Thanks for the scan - it helped somewhat, but I'm still confused. If you could help anymore, I'd appreciate it.

Here's what happened:
On each headlight socket there's 3 wires:
- Red/white
- Red
- White/red

As I grounded each one to the sidewall ground terminals, here's what happened.
(NOTE: these connections each affected the lights whether or not the headlight switch was turned on; the switch had no effect.)

Pass. Red/white: Pass. light on Full; Driver - out
Pass. Red: Pass light - out; Driver - Full
Pass White/red: BOTH LIGHTS WORK! But ... they stay on whether or not the headlight switch or key is turned; they're on all the time.

Driver Red/white: malfunctioning "normally" - Pass light on, but dim; Drivers - very dim
Driver Red: Pass light - out; Driver - Full
Driver White/red: SHORT; fuse burned out

Any ideas?

Thanks -

-Mark-

[Salemetro]

Okay....admittedly, more than a bit confusing.....but here's what I'd try:

First....take a continuity tester (not test light, but ohm meter), and check continuity in the harness itself.....checking for what the dealership called "deteriorated wiring". What you are trying to verify here, is that there are no brakes in any of the wires where they connect into any of the relays or the Daytime Running Lamps Control Module. As long as there is continuity between every point that the light sockets wire into, then the wiring is good. At that point, I'd wonder about the Headlight Relay or the Daytime Running Lamps Control Module. I'd make sure that the grounds for the Relays and Daytime Running Lamps Control Module are good...and if so, maybe try replacing the Headlight Relay itself. Keep in mind, that there appears to be grounds in 1)the left kick panel, and 2)Left Front Fender near battery. It looks to me like the Dimmer Switch, Headlight Relay, and Daytime Running Lamps Control Module ALL SHARE THE SAME GROUND (under the left kick panel)...so it would be wise to check this closely.


Let me know if this helps.

-James

[techmodzdude]

Originally Posted by mrmambo

Great site - I just discovered this resource and would appreciate some help.

Headlight problems - 1995 Geo Metro:
It's my wife's car and the lights are very dim, day and night. We've tried replacing the bulbs and the fuses, but no luck. We took it to the dealer, who said some wiring had deteriorated and they wanted $400-500 to replace it, but wouldn't give us details.

Do you have any hints? The lights aren't out completely, but are pretty dim; the one is dimmer than the other and it's not really safe to drive at night. The DRL seems to be the same as night setting: both are dim.

It seems that there's lots of Geo headlight problems, but it sounds like it's usually that they go out on one setting or the other. Ours are working both in DRL and night settings, but are verrrry dim.

If it's the underdash junction box, how do I test and fix/replace this? I'm a pretty handy guy, but haven't done much electrical work; I don't even have a continuity tester. Details and suggested sources for info and parts would be much appreciated - thanks! :-)

-Mark-

I have a GEO Metro 1995 1.3L Manual Transmission Car, and I had my problem was pretty much the same. One dimmer than the other when its normal, but when I turn on my brights, one side is bright, but the other one is off. I checked all the fuses under the hood, and it turns out ok. But hours later, I find another set of fuses just above my clutch. I found out that I had a blown fuse. So I replaced it, and now it works fine. NOTE: Find a young person to get up in there, put the seat all the way back, and lay on your back on the edge of the car. (I'm 17, and its hard for me, lol) What a bad place for fuses. I hope this helps you

[mrmambo]

Originally Posted by techmodzdude

I have a GEO Metro 1995 1.3L Manual Transmission Car, and I had my problem was pretty much the same. One dimmer than the other when its normal, but when I turn on my brights, one side is bright, but the other one is off. I checked all the fuses under the hood, and it turns out ok. But hours later, I find another set of fuses just above my clutch. I found out that I had a blown fuse. So I replaced it, and now it works fine. NOTE: Find a young person to get up in there, put the seat all the way back, and lay on your back on the edge of the car. (I'm 17, and its hard for me, lol) What a bad place for fuses. I hope this helps you

LOL! Well, I'm almost 37, but I'm still just nimble enought to fit under there! ;-)

I haven't looked at it in month or so, but was told to look for a loose ground wire from the fuse block. This seems to be a known problem.

I have looked at the fuses in the fuse block (above the clutch) and they all check out fine, so I don't think that's it. Glad yours was easy to fix.

[Mike_Van]

My '96 had one dim headlight when I got it. The lights only worked (one dimly) in the middle position of the switch AND if the parking brake is OFF.

Turns out that I, too, was completely missing one fuse. Popped one in and both lights became brighter, but they now still only work in the middle light-switch position AND with the parking brake off. Brights will work if the lever is manually held to the back (but will not remain on brights with the lever forward)

I can only assume I have a bad headlight switch (~ $400), but I can live with this as is...

[dan deutekom]

Mike_Van

Your problem is very comman with metros. Only the daytime running lights are working. Check out this thread for the solution.
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbul...d.php?t=161274

[mrmambo]

Thanks, Dan - actually it is a little different. The link you gave was for the push-button style lights in a 1989 Geo; this is a 1995 with a turn style switch off the stalk.

The problem is also a little different - that thread was about only getting the Daytime Running Lights, while our car has one dim DLR and one bright DLR.

The problems are obviously both electrical in origin and tied to either faulty switches, wires, or fuses, but the question is: which is the cause and how to fix it?

Thanks -

-m-

[dan deutekom]

Originally Posted by mrmambo

Thanks, Dan - actually it is a little different. The link you gave was for the push-button style lights in a 1989 Geo; this is a 1995 with a turn style switch off the stalk.

The problem is also a little different - that thread was about only getting the Daytime Running Lights, while our car has one dim DLR and one bright DLR.

The problems are obviously both electrical in origin and tied to either faulty switches, wires, or fuses, but the question is: which is the cause and how to fix it?

Thanks -

-m-

If you follow that link all the way through you will find that it addresses almost all the years of Geos including 95 and later and it was addressing Mike_Vans dilemma. I think the problem with your geo is bad grounds somewhere but I don"t know where

Take care
Dan