mobil 1 silver top or blue top

[0311_lifer]

i was wondering what the difference between the mobil 1 in the silver containter with the blue top(newer vehicle formula) and the mobil 1 in the all silver container is. i need to get some for my new crown vics 1st oil change. they both seem like mobil 1 full synthetic (says that on both bottles).

[curtis73]

Sometimes they just change the label or the container to "freshen" up the look and you get both types on shelves for a few months. It might be the same stuff. They also just came out with a new formulation for 500, 7500, and 15,000 mile change intervals.

[0311_lifer]

thanks man your always a really big help i really appreciate it.

[Igovert500]

Kinda related...but what are your opinions on those new long-distance oils from Mobil?
Personally I don't care if they tell me they last 15,000 and I still feel better changing mine every 3k.

[curtis73]

I am in the process of completely changing my opinions on that. My previous conception was that oils can last anywhere from 2000-10,000 miles, but in the absence of testing, all oils should be changed at 3000 to be safe. Oils can only hold so much additive in solution before they start changing the oil's properties. Much like water can only dissolve so much sugar and any more stays crystaline. While this holds true for older oils and older engines that experience more blowby, newer additives are more stable and newer engines run cleaner.

I was under the impression that this meant they now last anywhere from 2000-15,000; meaning they should still be changed at 3000 to be safe. I'm finding that to be untrue. I recently became an Amsoil dealer after a ton of my own research and I wouldn't have taken that product on unless I truly believed it. There are actually oil/filter combos from Amsoil that now mean oil never has to be changed. Its still a little hard for me to swallow, but I actually saw one of their test vehicles; a 2000 F350 with a powerstroke. 413,000 miles with no oil changes on a diesel impressed me.

I still don't know how they maintain pH and compensate for additives getting consumed, but that's research I haven't done yet.

Anyway, from the research I did, the 3000-mile change is still hanging on for marketing reasons, but most manufacturers are now recommending 7500-10,000 intervals. The manufacturers are the most critical since they have to repair it under warranty if it fails, and if they say 7500, I can guess with confidence that 3000 is a thing of the past.

Of course it can't hurt to do a $20 oil change every 3000 to be on the safe side, but it doesn't do much for conserving oil consumption in the world market.

Now that I'm a dealer I think I'll do the full Amsoil package to my 454 since its been freshly rebuilt. I'll just run it until it dies and see how it does. According to Amsoil, the technology is there for any of the companies to make long-lasting oil, they just don't because that means you will only buy half as much oil. So, I would say the long-distance oils from Mobil are what they say they are. I personally would wait for some independent tests to come out.

[sracing]

Originally Posted by curtis73

I recently became an Amsoil dealer after a ton of my own research and I wouldn't have taken that product on unless I truly believed it. ..... According to Amsoil, the technology is there for any of the companies to make long-lasting oil, they just don't because that means you will only buy half as much oil.

Curtis! After all your excellent posts and theories posted here, I can't believe you fell for the AMSOIL Madison ave hype.
I know this will go into a wild post bashing thread, so let me say this first. AMSOIL is ok, it is not bad stuff and tests pretty well against the other synthetics.

However.... we did a test here in conjunction with Lubrication Sciences. Our tests (SR Racing) were primarily dyno tests on 2000cc Ford engines and some a/c engines. We tested several brands of synthetics. AMSOIL showed no advantages over any other oil in cooling, friction reduction, loads, mileage, or anything else. However in lab tests, AMSOIL oil off the shelf showed excessive variance in the formulation. (I.E. One batch varied significantly from the other.) This lack of consistency is a great indication of quality control.
During these tests, we contacted a couple controllers of "Fleet Tests" that AMSOIL touted. Some of these "fleet tests" were nothing other than some AMSOIL dealer like yourself, testing on his and his families/neighbors cars and then wildly exclaiming 10% better mileage/hp, etc. Most interesting with the "Duluth Minnesota Police Car Fleet Test ". Amsoil had this one on their web site for years. We contacted the garage (a outsourcing place that maintained Police vehicles) that did this test. The test was done years ago, by a mechanic who was also a Amsoil dealer. Obviously his results were extremely positive. There was no control and significant bias.

Some of our test results were posted on a Compuserve Forum a couple years ago. We received a letter from an "Amsoil Exec" who complained about our results. (I might add that the letter was very amateurish and contained some subtle threats. We replied with a letter of our own and took him to task on the Duluth Fleet tests along with their wild testimonials from customers. (40 deg temp drops, 10% more mileage, etc.) They replied with an apology of sorts. They explained that they KNEW the testimonials were bogus, but they felt they showed the exuberance of their customers, so continued to use them. In regards to the Duluth Fleet test, they couldn't explain this at all. Their records only showed that a test was done.

"Independent Lab Tests" and customer testimonials are always indicative of Madison ave garbage, since the FTC can do nothing about them. As long as they are stated as such they are legal as Sunday AM TV Infomercials.

Finally, the ridiculous Amsoil 3 Ball tests. Not a bad test for a gear oil, but little indication of a general purpose internal combustion engine oil.

Since Amsoil is defended like an religion or an ugly baby, I am sure this will turn into a long thread, BUT, it isn't bad stuff, it just isn't any better (and possibly worse than most.). Mobile One is certainly better and Valvoline and the rest are cheaper and a better buy. None of them will hurt your engine, only your pocketbook.

Jim
SR Racing

[sracing]

Originally Posted by curtis73

According to Amsoil, the technology is there for any of the companies to make long-lasting oil, they just don't because that means you will only buy half as much oil..

Ahh, the conspiracy theory from Amsoil. Anyone who knows anything about oil, the patent process and economics should know that this ranks with Roswell, the 600mpg carburator and free energy in general.

If you run an engine consistantly (as one load), never take it through any heat cycles, with good a/f ratio and filter it well, it will easily be good stuff for a hundred thousand miles. An engine run at a proper temperature makes for a pretty good distiller of its own.

Actually the new FI close tolerance engines driven mostly on the highway, could far surpass the 3000 mile oil life estimates provided by the manufacture's. But since they don't have full control of the environment of that engine, the manufacture (oil and engine) have to be somewhat conservative to protect their warranties and reputation.

Oil life has far more to do with the engine use than the oil itself.

Jim
SR Racing

[curtis73]

Originally Posted by sracing

Curtis! After all your excellent posts and theories posted here, I can't believe you fell for the AMSOIL Madison ave hype.
I know this will go into a wild post bashing thread, so let me say this first. AMSOIL is ok, it is not bad stuff and tests pretty well against the other synthetics.

I never said I fell for the hype; I'm still doing the research. I've seen several tests where it never did any better than Mobil 1 or any other synthetic, and the facts can't be ignored. Truth be told, I became a dealer to get cheap oil. I actually didn't want to post that I was a dealer 'cuz I was a little embarrassed. I'm not loyal to it nor do I plan on selling it. Its like a pyramid scheme and it gives me the creeps

Bottom line is; its good oil and I now get it at about half price. Also a little embarrasing. No flames or bashing were inferred. I rarely get passionate about anything. I try to stay objective and I hope me Amsoil transgression doesn't soil your opinion of me

[sracing]

Originally Posted by curtis73

I never said I fell for the hype; ....

Ahh. I suspected that would be the case. At 1/2 price it's a very good buy.

BTW, I didn't expect any flames from you, but I was suggesting flames from others who do worship Amsoil. I just used this thread as my soapbox re: Amsoil marketing.

Jim
SR Racing

[curtis73]

Yeah, I knew I was in trouble when I got my dealer packet and it included a line of Health Supplements and Vitamins. Might as well just slap "Amway" on the package while you're at it. Frustrating to say the least.

Thanks for your input