Are we car modellers a dying breed ??

[primera man]

Took a trip out of town today and visited 5 different model shops and was quite supprized by the lack of car models they seem to stock now days.
It had been awhile since i went on a trip to have a look at these shops and the feedback i got from the owners and speaking to others was that people are not making them as much as they used to.

IMO (after getting into a argument with a couple of owners ) that if they stocked there car kits up and had proper aftermarket stuff like wheels/bodies/decals, that they might sell more car kits.
One shop didn't even have any of the latest Tamiya kits !!
No ENZO's, 350Z's, Skyline's ....not a rally car in sight ...in fact he didnt even know the Tamiya ENZO was out yet
Most shops seem to cater for all the tank and army builders by suppling them with shit-loads of stuff along with 3-4 times as many kits.

The other interesting point that i was given was that people are just buying heaps more 1/18 scale die-cast cars already made up.

Last but not least...i even pointed out this site(AF) to one shop owner and we went online for me to show him what i was talking about.....all i can say is that i nearly tripped over his bottom lip walking out the day

NOW.....WTF Is going on here....are we a dying breed of builders

What do you guys find when you go to a model store.....us car builders are getting offered less and less

[malsheem]

I agree with you about the model shops. They definitely do not cater to the scale car model enthusiast. The two largest stores here are an big time R/C car shop with lots of 1/18 die-cast, and 1/32 slot cars. A distant fourth is the 1/24 scale cars. They do offer some items, but restock very infrequently. The other shop is 90% military models. The good news is the have a lot of paints and supplies, but they've had the same car kits on the shelf for the past 3 months. Car modelers definitely get no love from hobby stores. And I can't remember the last time there was a model car show here. Though there was a military one about 5 months ago.

I don't think we are a dying breed, but it might help to show more people car modeling. Just the other day, I was hanging out with my brother and his friends while they were tuning his car. I am building a Tamiya R34 Skyline for him for Christmas, and brought it over to show the progress. Everyone was like "Wow", "How did you do that?", and "Do they make any of my car?". I told them about stuff and aftermarket items (turbos, wheels, body kits, etc), and they were definitely interested.

[DSM-Mark]

Of 4 LHSs that I frequently visit, 3 of them have pretty good stocks of Tamiya and Fujimi kits, and also quite a few Revell/AMT kits. The problem I find is that their prices are so outragous for the Japanese stuff, I rarely buy Tamiya kits from the LHS. The new Ferraris are especially bad. The Enzo I've seen in 2 stores... one listed $82 CAD, and the other was $75 CAD. MSRP 2800 yen = $34 CAD. From HS, I could have one of those in my hands for under $40. So I guess I'm contributing to the problem if I buy from overseas. On the other hand, if the prices were more reasonable, I'd buy from LHS, as would a lot of other people I'm sure, and you'd see a little more interest in the cars at the LHS. As it is, it's rare to see an aftermarket wheel set here, and I've never seen a resin car kit or accessory at any of the LHSs I've visited.

[Hiroboy]

My LHS is the same Diecast, Millatary and R/C and 2 old Fujimi Car kits (Merc and a Suzuki Jimny) and a few airfix rally cars.
They don't even buy in car kits.
But am I to blame?. I 99% of my stuff Online from Japan because it's cheaper. I can't justify paying 24 pounds for a kit I can get from Japan delivered @ 14 Pounds max.

[Honoturtle]

One of the model shops, which I used to go to all the time stocks more Fujimi/imported kits when I last checked, but had ridiculous price tags on them! I still remember the Ferarri Enzo & 360 running $40-45 USD a piece! Maybe they have a much larger stock because of the prices so no one purchases kits. Although I'm very reluctant on buying kits now, I still like to see good deals locally, rather than purchasing off the net. I even asked one of the employees about the prices on a few kits, and he told me, "I have no control over the pricing, it's what the distributor gives us."

As my LHS is, they also stock a lot of military/planes supplies and kits, much which I doubt leaves the shelves (I really wouldn't know). RC's there seem to be their main market. I'm not sure how their sales are, but think they're going down, much consumers seek the same for cheaper. I hope to pay them a visit sometime this month, and see if anything have shaped up.

[willimo]

Hey P-man, did you happen to stop at my hobby shop? Fortunately my LHS owner builds car models, but he really moves from cars to planes to armour and back, so it's not like he's really down with cars for his own sake. His model car section is pretty big, but it's full of three our four of the same Revell or AMT kit. There is a little corner with Tamiya cars, but I really think he gets those for me since I'm such a regular customer. What kills me is his really small aftermarket. He stocks nothing, not even engine wiring! But at the same time, like you said, the 1:18 and 1:24 diecast section has exploded in size!

A lot of people say they are impressed with the youth in the hobby today. Thing is, the youth in the hobby today is tiny (this forum is not a cross section of the whole modelling community) and being replaced by video games and other, less creative hobbies. While people are impressed with the craftsmanship and detail that goes into a model, no one I know is remotely patient enough to build a model.

Unfortunately, creativity seems to be on the decline. I've noticed fewer and fewer people who actually make things, whether it's drawing, writing, modelling, woodworking, anything. Except for performance, that's the exception. The unpleasant reality is that people don't have the ability or desire to think for themselves, or do for themselves. There is no internal motivation to create some sort of product, everything they need is prepackaged, predetermined, and any "customization" that can be observed today is usually very formulaic and cliche (with a few, notable exceptions). For instance, the automotive (import, mostly) show scene doesn't impress me any more. There are a few variations on the same theme (with a few, notable exceptions) because even though people think they are scratching a creative itch, they are instead stroking an uncreative ego.

But it certainly isn't limited to creative decline, there is also a trend toward instant gratification. This trend has so permeated our society that the phrase "instant gratification" itself is cliche. Indeed, the explosion in the popularity of diecasts on the shelf in Wal-Mart, toy stores, and even in our modelling refuge the hobby shop is indicative of this. Oh, but lest I forget, there are tuning options for those diecasts, you can (of course!) swap the wheels or the body kits but that only requires you to pull off the wheel or unscrew a couple screws. And this also makes a case for the creative decline, how much more rigid could you make the tolerances of self expression?

I must admit, when building models I have copied some cars in real life (my green HiLux lives in my apartment complex, a future Skyline will closely follow an R32 recently completed here) but for the most part, they are a product of my imagination (though I am not claiming that I am a creative genius). And more importantly, I made them with my own hands. There is a fellow on the forum named Eugene who impressed me quite a bit when I first joined. Several times he made a comment to the effect of "I would be much prouder of my car knowing I had done it all myself" or "I wouldn't buy that because even though mine may not be as good, at least it's mine." Eugene will one day be a great model builder. He is driven to do his best, do whatever he can to build a superior model. He realizes that he can, through ingenuity, experimentation, and practice, make whatever it is he wants. Anyone has the power to do that, but they don't. There is a Ben Folds lyric which I hold dear: "How we just made fun/Of those who had the guts to try and fail?" And I think that's what's going on these days. People these says want to be cool, to be right, and they can't do that if they go out on a limb. They want something great, but don't want to have waste time making things that aren't. People don't realize that only thing greatness can be built upon is failure (with a few, notable exceptions; Eugene comes to mind).

With the permeation of disposability in our society, less and less emphasis is being placed on craftsmanship. With less emphasis comes less appreciation, and the further we go down that road the less we are going to see people doing creative, literally constructive things. Yes, P-man, I do think we are seeing a decline in our type of hobby in general. Not just in cars, but in all model building. Even RC is pushing more and more ready to run models instead of kits. We see it in all facets of life, though, not just hobbies. I think times will change for the better, but it will be a while down the road. I know when my dad was a about my age, maybe younger, it was rather popular that boys build cars (though not nearly as sophisticated as our models now) and when they got real cars it was rather popular to do work on it. Today, neither seems to be the case, instead my peers usually object to my "toys" in either 1:24 or 1:1 ("Why don't you just go somewhere and have your springs put in? What, is this the third time you've wasted an afternoon doing that?")

And after that absurdly long post, what it boils down to there is less value placed on the sort of skills modellers must possess, and as long as our skillls are not mainstream and perhaps "trivial" we must face a decline in the audience we reach with our cars.

Edit: Sorry if my post was overkill. I'm in final exams "write-all-you-know" mode.

[jgmodelcars]

yeah my lhs is arlight, it has some tamiya models, and occasionally will have decent prices, the revells and such go like hotcakes there, but there is far more military equipment and no tamiya spray paints.

another nearby lhs, has ridiculous price tags on models with kits starting at $28+ i even saw a porsche kit there for $55, its only 1/24 and its a tamiya whats up with that? they do have tamiya sprays, but its a bit farther away than my closer lhs

o well, and yes we are unfortunately a dying breed, but i'm trying to get more people so doen't worry

and willimo... I agree completely!

[Layla's Keeper]

Well, I'm on a first name basis with the fine folks at my LHS (Parma Hobby over on Ridge Road, next to Ganley Mazda). Their primary business is model car guys, O scale model railroaders, and RC airplane fans. We car guys are their bread and butter, keeping the doors open, while the train and plane guys finance store improvements and special events.

They're trying to get better at stocking import kits (MRC never did a good job of getting Fujimi and Aoshima kits out here to Ohio, and there's just not enough of a variety of Hasegawa stuff to justify a ton of it) especially Tamiya. And they try to get their hands on out of production stuff, too. Revell and AMT stuff, plus Lindberg, Polar Lights, and Galaxie Limited is there in abundance. And they stock plenty of Detail Master, Hoppin Hydros, XS Tuning, and Model Car Garage detail parts.

A lot of the LHS around here are like that.

Southeast Hobby tends to deal in obscure kits (only place where I've seen the Gunze Sangyo Bugeye Sprite MkI kit in person), while HobbyCastle is wall-to-wall discounted classic Revell, Monogram, AMT, Lindberg, and import kits. How about a Protar 1:12scale Ferrari 126C2? They had one (went home with my Dad).

You've got The Slot Shop in Elyria, Ohio; The second oldest continually operated hobby shop in the US with the world's oldest operational 1:24th scale slot track. They're pretty much your standard line of kits, but have a policy of "If you need it, we will find it." Hobby's ETC in Lorain is a nice place that is very good about keeping the latest stuff on their shelves, and has a long-standing reputation for "cutting good customers a deal." Shifter's in Eastlake is a slot car track, and the top one in the region, but they're trying to start stocking model kits on a regular basis (mostly because one of their classes, which I race in, is a stock car class that uses model car bodies. I run exclusively AMT 1975 Matador bodies).

Finally, we've go two Hobbytown USA's in Northeast Ohio. They don't usually have older stuff, but man do they stock current kits. Plus they're very fairly priced and have plenty of supplies.

Model cars are in a bit of a lean time, as far as the manufacturers are concerned. Kit sales are down, die cast sales are up, and new kits aren't being tooled as frequently. We lost AMT (regardless of the fact that there are new kits with the AMT label on them) and Lindberg is gone as well. Polar Lights is healthy enough, and Revell-Monogram is playing conservatively by producing well thought out kits of popular subjects, but not getting overly ambitious and alienating their primary kit buyers.

The best thing we model car guys can do is keep buying kits and making trips to our local hobby shop to remind them that we're still interested. If not a kit, try buying paints, or glues, or magazines at your LHS. Every little bit helps.

[turbos86]

I agree with many of you that said it's because the retail prices are too high that people are reluctant to buy, and hence staying away from this hobby. It's just too expensive to spark some people's interest. To some, even if they love cars, and want to make replicas, they will usually end up buying die cast. Die cast are cheaper in a sense (if you add up all the paint and glue money for our plastic models), and they look nice all pre-painted and pre-made which appeals to more people. Some people might even think that why buy a small plastic one when I can buy a bigger metal one for a lower price.

My LHSs got an okay selection of car models, but also an even larger selection of Gundams. Hobby shops want to make money (who doesn't, lol), so they must cater to people's interest.

Scale model cars don't appeal to much people, making the market smaller and smaller. We can't blame them, because if you think about it, there's nothing special about model cars to the regular folks, especially those won't don't care about cars. Instead, people like what's hip and cool. For example, lots of people made models of the "Titanic" when the movie first out. Same for the Fast and Furious cars, because of a movie that it became popular, and a demand for them grew. What I'm trying to say, car modelling just doesn't spark most people's interest. We may well be a dying breed if things don't start changing. Changes like lower price of models and model supplies, increase stocks in hobby shops. But before model makers and shop can do these, there must be more people buying and interested in this hobby. How that will happen, no one knows. Too bad Tamiya wasn't the company that made the Fast and Furious models, or else things might be alittle different. *dreaming*

[nis.k.a.]

I guess I'm the lucky one. My local hobby shop is less than 2 miles from my house and they stock all the newest kits from Tamiya, Fujimi and a lot of good kits from Aoshima. Heck, they just ordered me 2 sets of Aoshima 18" Work Meister S1's and 1 set of Aoshima 19" Lowenhart at their price. My area has a lot of automotive builders as well as the Gundam, military and RC.

[jgmodelcars]

Originally Posted by nis.k.a.

I guess I'm the lucky one. My local hobby shop is less than 2 miles from my house and they stock all the newest kits from Tamiya, Fujimi and a lot of good kits from Aoshima. Heck, they just ordered me 2 sets of Aoshima 18" Work Meister S1's and 1 set of Aoshima 19" Lowenhart at their price. My area has a lot of automotive builders as well as the Gundam, military and RC.

wow i hate you! haha, no just kidding you are super lucky!

[RallyRaider]

Sadly I often get the same impression. If it wasn't for the Internet I would have contact with very few people into the hobby and precisely nobody who has the same take on it as I.

Diecasts are the big culprit, they satisfy the desire for instant gratification demanded by modern life. I've even had people try to tell me diecasts are better than kits because they are more detailed! Cars are far more affected by diecasts than aircraft or military vehicles. In Australia the diecast market is huge, with all kinds of limited runs of V8 Supercars and classic Fords and Holdens produced. The prices new are in the $200 range and some of the early issues have become rare and supposedly now worth several times the original price. I know people who buy three and four copies of each new diecast expecting to make a profit on them down the track. they don't really care about the cars just see it as a money making exercise.

Fortunately the Internet and model shows demonstrate that there are still a lot of people interested in the hobby, even if we are small in numbers compared to aviation and military modellers. I'm confident our hobby will not die out, it is undoubtedly challenged and out of popular favour at the moment, but since when has anything popular been any good? You just need to look at the TV or music charts to see that! All the good things are underground - just like us!

[chrismcgee]

i often feel like making my own hobby store here in the uk, with the likes of sas over here it would be good to have the rest of the stuff like wheels etc availiable in only a day or so. not having to order up tens of sets of wheels every time.
I wonder if i could do a direct deal with the likes of tamiya japan and aoshima japan to get direct shipments?
but im sure to survive most shops end up catering to the tank and plane market to be their bread and butter

[ata]

I can see your concern. I've been building car models since early 80's and then it was a much bigger thing. But I haven't been an active person in the local modeling scene here, I've just been building kits every now and then just for my own pleasure.

The thing here has been that the scene has been mostly into american cars and the car modeling "scene" has been very closely connected to american car clubs, so most of the models too have been american cars. I also built lots of american car models in the 80's. Nowdays I'm interested especially european cars, like Opels, but because hardly any of the model makers make kits of Opels, I started to collect die-cast cars too, 1/43 and 1/18. They have a much bigger selection of the european cars I'm interested, and there are also some resin kits in 1/43 of cars that never come out as plastic 1/24 kits.

There are also couple of internet groups for modeling, but they concentrate almost solely to RC models, mostly planes. Also the model magazines concentrate on RC models and military models. Personally I don't know today any other adult (I'm 36) who builds car models, so guess why I was glad to find this site. There are some car model shows here, usually connected to american/hot rod car shows, I've never taken part on those. Also one amercan car magazine here has a car modeling pages, where a very talented modeler shows his projects, including progress photos, those are very interesting, but of course he also concentrates only on american cars.

The LHS I use nowdays (Tieto-Nikkari in Helsinki) has some car models, as well as military and the other stuff, but doesn't carry Tamiya spray paints for example, but has the normal Tamiya paints. They could have more aftermarket stuff or some more special kits, they have at least Tamiya and Revell kits, but for example I've never seen those other japanese manufacturers here.

I have also plenty of diecast cars, the 1/43 diecasts are incredibly accurate and detailed, but the 1/18 cars never have been better than a properly built 1/24 model kit, I know, because I have same cars in different livery as 1/24 kits and 1/18 diecasts, and the kits are always more detailed, even built just out-of-the-box.

[primera man]

Phil...the die-cast V8 Supercars here are just the same. People are paying up to $500NZD for a classic like the Brock XU1 etc. It seems to be more of a investment for these people now.
I have to agree with what has been said about the cost of kits.
Its far cheaper for me to buy a kit from Japan and have it shipped straight to my door then to pop down to the LHS to buy it.
I also think that they will price them selfs of the market unless they start to drop there costs.
Another interesting thing to me is how much harder it is for someone new to modelling finds it.
There is a huge lack of clubs here in New Zealand (what ones there are dont really cater for cars) so unless they have the net etc it is very hard to pick pointers up.
Plus the kits themselfs seem harder to the average person.
Already i've heard that the new Tamiya JTCC GTR34 Skyline has put severial people off due to the the amount of masking etc needed to paint just the body.
With Tamiya also bringing out there new Pre-finished kits it takes alot of the builders skill away from the kit.