Coolant hot, some steam, no fans

[sbagdon]

Ambient temps reached +50F today, and now the van is running hot. Was runnings 1/4 all winter, while waiting at the bank drive-through today it hit 1/2, with light steam coming from the right side of the hood. Coolant reservoir was down about a pint from yesterday (happened to refill it), and neither fan is running when it hit 1/2.

Any initial things to check for, or any frequent failures on the right side for the coolant system? Radiator core, hoses, coolant lines, radiator cap, etc?

Any easy debugging on the radiator fans? Is there a way to unplug something, and have the fans go always-on?

Thanks!

[danielsatur]

Turn the HEAT on high max, to help bring the temperature down.

It could be as simple as a relay, or fuse going to the electric fan.

[sbagdon]

Originally Posted by danielsatur

Turn the HEAT on high max, to help bring the temperature down.

It could be as simple as a relay, or fuse going to the electric fan.

Yea, the "heat temp and fan all the way up" defintely helped, while sitting at the drive-thru. I'm hoping that the steam is something as simple as a pressure escape caused by over-heat via the radiator cap (etc), and fixable by bringing the temp down.

No doubt it's probably a fan temp-sensor and/or relay, yet any quick-fixes to drive the fan(s) "on"? Can I just unplug a sensor, and/or ground a harness lead? Thanks!

[danielsatur]

Turn the Air cond on cool max, see if both electric fans are working,
If not run HEAT on Max.

I would bench test, or run a battery wire to test your electric fans.

I just replaced two bad electric fans on a 2000 Ford tarus, that were bought from LKQX for $20.

[sbagdon]

Originally Posted by danielsatur

Turn the Air cond on cool max, see if both electric fans are working,
If not run HEAT on Max.

I would bench test, or run a battery wire to test your electric fans.

I just replaced two bad electric fans on a 2000 Ford tarus, that were bought from LKQX for $20.

a/c doesn't work (knew that when it arrived), presume a refridgerant leak.I'll 12v hot-test the fans today. If they both run from battery+, any simple way to get them to run full-time? unplug a sensor, or ground a lead? Just trying to make it a few days, with the holidays, before really digging into this. Thanks!

[danielsatur]

Being in Michigan in the cold, running on High Heat is probably ok, just keep an eye on the temp guage.


The most probable cause is a bad electric fan, fuse, or relay.
You can trick the sensor, but if the fan don't work we wasted time.

Need to test your electric fan 1st!

[lesterl]

Where is the coolant going? Blown HG? Leaking IM gasket? Leaking Water Pump? Radiator?

[sbagdon]

Originally Posted by lesterl

Where is the coolant going? Blown HG? Leaking IM gasket? Leaking Water Pump? Radiator?

There's visible steam coming from the right/front corner of the engine bay (not sure if cap, hose, etc), so I'm guessing that's where the liquid went. Water pump and radiator are possible, yet guessing unlikely (given the scenarios).

Engine was rebuilt by an Olds dealership under extended warranty around '05, for a blown head-gasket (direct knowlege, was involved in the diag, towing, post-work, etc). Will try to find the work order, to verify that the head gasket and intake manifold gaskets were all replaced, yet as it was a dealership, and extended warranty was paying, figure all wearables were replaced.

Given MI salt, it wouldn't suprise me that the fans have been salted to death. Working on testing the fans, between research lookups. Yet still looking to find if there's an easy "unplug a sensor to drive the fans to always-on".

[sbagdon]

Originally Posted by danielsatur

Being in Michigan in the cold, running on High Heat is probably ok, just keep an eye on the temp guage.


The most probable cause is a bad electric fan, fuse, or relay.
You can trick the sensor, but if the fan don't work we wasted time.

Need to test your electric fan 1st!

Both fans work, when hot-wired to +12V volt.

Plug is between the two fans, attached to the fan shroud, colors are black, blue, white, grey. black/blue control the pax fan, white/grey control the driver fan. each left/right pair of wires drives the respective fan.

Unless there's a way to default a switch/sensor/relay to always-on, planning on wiring the fog-lights to the fans, as the foglights have no lenses or bulbs (ugly, yet effective).

Anyone?

Thanks!

[danielsatur]

The steam from the overheated condition would cause a coolant shortage, because fans didn't work.

Check the coolant level in the morng, when it's cold.

[lesterl]

Steam is comming from somewhere, so somewhere there is a leak...... Get it fixed before it gets you stranded. Probably warped/ or cracked a head ......... Stock GM intake gaskets plain SUCK IMHO.

[merc81]

I've had multiple coolant leaks on these vans, in the heater hoses and fittings. See my other posts about this over in the olds forum. Every single hose in the system leaked at one point or another. Don't assume you have the gasket problem again until you have looked over the heater and coolant hoses. I even had the water level sensor start leaking at the wire harness!
There was a pin hole leak on the oil cooler (some engines don't have those) that sprayed a microscopic steam of coolant right out through the grill and was almost impossible to see--but you can smell anti-freeze from a mile away and that was a smell always present until I replaced all the hoses.

Look it over before assuming the worst.

[sbagdon]

Originally Posted by merc81

I've had multiple coolant leaks on these vans, in the heater hoses and fittings. See my other posts about this over in the olds forum. Every single hose in the system leaked at one point or another. Don't assume you have the gasket problem again until you have looked over the heater and coolant hoses. I even had the water level sensor start leaking at the wire harness!
There was a pin hole leak on the oil cooler (some engines don't have those) that sprayed a microscopic steam of coolant right out through the grill and was almost impossible to see--but you can smell anti-freeze from a mile away and that was a smell always present until I replaced all the hoses.

Look it over before assuming the worst.

Thanks for the reply, nudged me to do an update:

Reservoir appears to go from over-filled to "low coolant" warning in about 5-6 days. right now, I'm refilling every 3-4 days, or 2x/week.

Before it went from 1/4 to 1/2, the low-coolant warning went off, forgot to add coolant, it got too low, the heat started to not output properly (output in cycles of hot or cold), then the steaming started. suspect air got in the system, from the reservoir running low. filled the reservoir, and have kept it filled, and it hasn't happened since, and haven't had steam since. didn't have to bleed the system, seems to have bled itself.

My best guess is that the leak is on the outside-loop of the thermostat (radiator, hoses, etc), not the inside loop (heater cores, engine block/head, etc).

It's definitely coming from the right/front. I've been temp-parking it in the same spot in the driveway (to unload, before parking in the garage), it snowed about 1/8th-1/4" a few days ago, and that's where there was a circle of no snow. Also, I've put cardboard in the garage under that corner, and it's not pretty.

Given the complexity of just about every system in the van, I can subscribe to it being something as simple as a worn item. I don't believe it's something complex, I'll go with it being something as simple as worn items... just that there's 2x-3x more of those wearable items, in these complex systems.

As long as I can make it until the spring without a catastrophic failure, then I can start dealing with all of these preventative (and other) maintenance issues. It's getting scheduled maintenance, and lots of monitoring/attention, yet it's definitely a high-risk vehicle. The van lived a hard life, was relatively neglected (yet not abused), and I suspect my driveway is it's hospice. It's one major-mechanical from a part-out, yet I suspect that it's longevity will be functional to how I deal with these little duck-peck issues. This is really old-school vehicle ownership... keep an eye out on everything, watch the gauges, listen for noises, and don't ignore anything. In the hands of most other owners, the van wouldn't last a month.

[danielsatur]

What year + how many miles?
Are all the hoses original?
Caution-
Any shortage of coolant could cause a false indication to the fan sensor, temp guage, thermostat, and cause more over heating.
When you lose your max heat, cut her down.

1) Do a coolant pressure test done ASAP!
2) Replace any bad rubber hoses, or clamps.
3) Try blue devil, metallic blockseal, or http://www.steelseal.com ,so you don't have to chase coolant problems.

[lesterl]

Let us know how it turns out either way.....