Loud Engine

[PoorLuder]

Helllo all, I have been reading the forums for some time now but finally decided to actually join. So, I have a question about my lude (94 si). The engine seems to be very loud (I can hear my car idling from inside my house). I have been told that the valve timing may be off or that my engine is worn. I was wondering if the valve timing theory has any weight to it. Someone else had told me that my oil might be to blame but I doubt that. I use Mobil 1 synthetic oil with a 10w-30 viscosity. I have been considering muffling the noise by installing a Dynamat hoodliner but I would rather fix the problem at its source.

[ludeguy]

Originally Posted by PoorLuder

Helllo all, I have been reading the forums for some time now but finally decided to actually join. So, I have a question about my lude (94 si). The engine seems to be very loud (I can hear my car idling from inside my house). I have been told that the valve timing may be off or that my engine is worn. I was wondering if the valve timing theory has any weight to it. Someone else had told me that my oil might be to blame but I doubt that. I use Mobil 1 synthetic oil with a 10w-30 viscosity. I have been considering muffling the noise by installing a Dynamat hoodliner but I would rather fix the problem at its source.

without hearing the noise directly it's going to be very hard to diagnose via internet - but i'll try and give you some help.

First see if you can characterize the noise - is it a clanking type - a banging type? does the vehicle shudder or run extremely rough ? does it sound like perhaps a single component has given? or finally - is it like exhaust noise that is loud - like a failed muffler?

there are a few things on a car that can make noise so clarity will be key, it could just be one of your auxilary components going, or something more internal - of course you should hope for something auxilary because that would be easier to fix (;

try your best to ISOLATE where teh noise is coming from - i know, your next question is going to be "how the [heck] do i do that" - well the best way is to use almost like a dr's stethoscope - i'm not saying buy a dr's stethoscope - because i'm sure those are highly overpriced - but just fabricate something like that - i imagine even a pair of headphones that encapsulate your whole ear i'm not sure that the 1/4inch jack will transfter the noise well enough - so you might need a metal rod or something to hold upside your head (and no - sadly i'm not whitty enough to just be trying to make you look like a retard to your neighbours) - with this metal rod - and headphone arrangement - and - with your car running - listen to your engine place the metal rod on the top of the valve cover hold the other end to the side of your plastic headphones and listen to the tone - your 4 cylinders run laterally (from left to right) so simulate moving from one cylinder to the next (aproximation use the sparkplug leads as a guide if you have too) and listen to the sound it makes as the valves open and close the intake valves are towards the rear of the engine and the exhaust valves are at the front - listen to your distributor - i've heard of dizzy's making some noise when they are on their way out. BE VERY CAREFUL of the belts (and loose drawstrings if you wear a hoodie!!) - but listen down in the timing belt area down there you will be listening to the waterpump, and the oil pump - do this all over your engine and see if you can find a cylinder or area that is louder than the others.

I had an autotensioner go on my h22a and it was surprising how far the rattle could go - all the way UP the timing belt side - thru the cam gear and down thru the camshaft and out the dizzy - I almost incorrectly diagnosed it as being a prob with the dizzy!

to simply buy some hood liner would definetley be a "blanket" solution (no pun intended) your engine is TALKING to you, and you have to listen - or it's gonna say ---- YOU when you need it most.

it could be something as simple as your header gasket or something - who knows - listen and report back (;

best of luck.

[unknownluder69]

I dont know how well u know ur car but I know this: if u go somewhere and have the problem 'fixed' and it still occurs they will replace it, they have to its in there customer 'contract'. I know many ppl here say that doing everything urself is best b/c u get to know ur car and customize it but I know that if I f*** somethin up its my ass, if a company does it its their ass.

[PoorLuder]

I shall try to locate the specific location of the noise but it will probably be a lost cause since my knowledge of the car's components is limited. Listening without any kind of instrument is fairly difficult since the noise level is high, you just can't pinpoint anything. I went out and listened again and the noise seems to mostly come from the belt region although my engine itself seems fairly noisy. I recently had my belts replaced for the 90,000 tune up. Could that have something to do with it?

[PoorLuder]

Also...my car drives fine. In fact, I love the way it drives except for my automatic transmission which lurches into every gear. I will probably put that problem into a new thread soon. Thanks for your help, ludeguy. I would take your advice, unknownluder, but as my name (PoorLuder) implies I don't have that much money so I try to do things myself. My dad knows about cars so I have been able to do some things myself. He would help more except that he has chronic fatigue so I try to bother him as little as possible since he has no energy.

[ludeguy]

Originally Posted by unknownluder69

I dont know how well u know ur car but I know this: if u go somewhere and have the problem 'fixed' and it still occurs they will replace it, they have to its in there customer 'contract'. I know many ppl here say that doing everything urself is best b/c u get to know ur car and customize it but I know that if I f*** somethin up its my ass, if a company does it its their ass.

I would never recommend anyone tries something that they are not comfortable with, or even in some cases - if they don't have the right tools for it. And i agree when you work on something yourself - you do it a bit with your "wallet" in your mouth. That being said, there is no feeling in the world like fixing something yourself, the pride you can take in maintaining and caring for your own vehicle is *almost* second to none (I can actually think of a few things that "feel" better haha) - but the thing is when you do a job yourself - you CARE about how it is done, and when you're finished it's a real feeling of accomplishment. The more you sorta tweak, or get under/above your engine the more you learn and appreciate what is pulling you around on the road - and being aware of the state of your engine is beneficial - to the person that never even cracks the hood.

As you may or may not know, I recently had a h22 vtec swapped into my lude - I would have LOVED to do the work myself - because of the challenge and the chance to learn more about the car - unfortunatley my vehicle never made it back to the island I live on, and to have the car transported across the ferry with a loose h22 would have cost me an arm and a leg. Not to mention I did not have some of the tools that I imagine were required like an impact wrench - engine hoist etc. So on someone elses advice and recommendation - i trusted my vehicle to a Shop - I can't even tell you how many things that shop screwed up (but i'll attempt) - I had asked for a new timing belt - did they install it ? no. I told them and basically gave them a print out of aces high's engine swap guide to use, but did they put in the ecu i provided to them? NO. did they wire up the vtec solenoid and pressure switch the way the guide said? NO. when i confront them about the lack of the p13 ecu, they deny it and say the car runs great - so you peel back the carpet and prove to them it's the p14 and the retrace their steps - so the p13 goes in and the car is very unhappy - why? because they used the fuel injectors off of the h23 - which don't provide the car enough fuel.

I don't know if you're still reading or not, but if you are - remember - this was a shop that was even "recommended" to me for swaps. Do you know why everything was done so haphazzardly? - i do. because they simply don't give a [crap] at the end of the day - how your car drives/performs - if they have money in their bank that is all that matters - and I had a guarantee too - but i can almost guarantee you - that if i had actually jumped in my car - with the god knows how old jdm timing belt, and driven a block away from them and the belt gave and all my valves busted and pistons screwed - I would have to take them to COURT to extract the money they would owe me - I really don't think they are going to say "ok sorry our mistake" when 2000g is at stake -plus more mtc time.

so yea, I was thinking "the worst of this [stuff] is over" so today I'm giving my car an oil change/filter because it's been about 1000km's (CAN) since the new engine went in... and guess what? wouldn't you think that if you put a new engine on you'd give it a new oil filter? (like i had asked them too as well) so i'm under the car with my new fram filter - and this totally Japanese filter is staring me back in the face - not to mention it's only "finger tight" an accident basically waiting to happen.

I'm an apprentice helicopter mechanic (and low time pilot) and all I can say is that in my industry - operating like that is illegal. Criminal negligence to the infiniti degree. If i was to put the wrong fuel nozzle on an allison or turbomeca engine, because I was trying to cut corners or simply didn't know any better, or alas - i was having a bad day, I would be found grossly accountable and face jail time. granted it's a different industry where more lives are at stake - but I'm glad/proud (and the pilots are too) that our industry is as HONEST and reputable as it is.

I'm not saying all shops are disloyal - there are truly some great ones out there, but don't hold every mechanic that's gonna touch your car so holy above yourself - remember for the most part - you're the one that cares about your car - and to most mechanics it's just a living.

i've clearly rambled on enough and i doubt anyone's read this far so i'll stop.

[ludeguy]

Originally Posted by PoorLuder

I shall try to locate the specific location of the noise but it will probably be a lost cause since my knowledge of the car's components is limited. Listening without any kind of instrument is fairly difficult since the noise level is high, you just can't pinpoint anything. I went out and listened again and the noise seems to mostly come from the belt region although my engine itself seems fairly noisy. I recently had my belts replaced for the 90,000 tune up. Could that have something to do with it?

if you have the si you have a manual tensioner - so depending on how that was adjusted when they put your new timing belts on it could be making some of the noise. Only other thing down there i could think of would be perhaps the waterpump or oil pump making noise unless of course it's simply one of your auxilary components on that side of the engine...like your AC/powersteering or something however i don't imagine any of those components (excludin manual tensioner) would make noise for "very long" before simply failing out right.

If it seems like the whole engine is just making noise - I would look more into your header gasket region or something - like if it's just an exhaust farty type of loud. the one way i could think to check that would be to remove the heat shield - then with a flimsy piece of paper (and being careful not to burn yourself) and with the car running trace the outter edges of the header top and bottom (if you can) see if the paper sorta blows out due to a leak... better yet maybe just spray some soapy water on it - if it is bubbling anywhere that could be your culprit - if it's really hot your going to have to spray a lot of soapy water (not so much as to cold shock your parts but...) (; you'll see the difference between when it simply burns up and when it bubbles.

finally if it's coming from the valve cover - it could also be clearances I've heard you can get that adjusted for like 60 bux - or their is a guide at honda-tech.com on how to adjust it yourself.

how long ago did this start - are you having any temp probs? any other lights on the dash coming on?

best of luck.

[PoorLuder]

I did read your whole ramble and it is exactly the sort of thing that has happened to me in the past but not on such a large scale. I also would prefer to learn about the car myself and to become knowledgable in this area. That was why I installed my own radiator (old one leaked) some time back. Thankfully, I haven't had any problems with that. I do not have any engine lights currently lit so I cannot say if I have a temp problem or not. The loud engine has been going on for maybe a couple months now. I think but am not sure, that the increased noise may have started after I took a bit of a road trip for a four hour drive at speeds of 70-80 mph the whole way. At least, that is the first time the noise level came to my attention. I had always been told by other people that the noise was no big deal so I let it slide. The noise level does not seem to be increasing either but that is a subjective sort of thing... Ah, and ludeguy mentioned another area that I probably should ask about. Do you need the heat shield on? I took it off because it had developed some cracks but that was way after this noise started so the two are not related (hopefully). Thanks for all your help so far.

[PoorLuder]

Another thing...I asked my dad where he believes the noise is coming from and he believes it is definitely from the engine rather than the belts or from the header. It looks like I may just have to visit the Honda dealership down the street and pay their excessive prices (they wanted $500 for a radiator) to adjust the clearance.

[ludeguy]

Originally Posted by PoorLuder

I did read your whole ramble and it is exactly the sort of thing that has happened to me in the past but not on such a large scale. I also would prefer to learn about the car myself and to become knowledgable in this area. That was why I installed my own radiator (old one leaked) some time back. Thankfully, I haven't had any problems with that. I do not have any engine lights currently lit so I cannot say if I have a temp problem or not. The loud engine has been going on for maybe a couple months now. I think but am not sure, that the increased noise may have started after I took a bit of a road trip for a four hour drive at speeds of 70-80 mph the whole way. At least, that is the first time the noise level came to my attention. I had always been told by other people that the noise was no big deal so I let it slide. The noise level does not seem to be increasing either but that is a subjective sort of thing... Ah, and ludeguy mentioned another area that I probably should ask about. Do you need the heat shield on? I took it off because it had developed some cracks but that was way after this noise started so the two are not related (hopefully). Thanks for all your help so far.

the heat shield is not mandatory and a lot of people that put on custom headers remove it so people can see their bling haha... I leave mine on cuz my stock header pipes are rusty ass. (:

[ludeguy]

Originally Posted by PoorLuder

Another thing...I asked my dad where he believes the noise is coming from and he believes it is definitely from the engine rather than the belts or from the header. It looks like I may just have to visit the Honda dealership down the street and pay their excessive prices (they wanted $500 for a radiator) to adjust the clearance.

if you want to do it cheap - do what i suggested to the other kid who money-shifted his prelude - take it to a community college in your area that does auto maintenance - go talk to the dean of the school - and ask him if he can fit your car in... I don't think they mind looking at modern fuel injected vehicles because that's mostly what their students will be working on when they get out in the real world. I'm not saying the school is going to pay for whateva damage you may or may not have on your engine - but there is a chance they can properly assess what might be wrong with the multitude of test equip they have.

OR.. do what I used to do when i was unsure of a problem- without "giving" your car to someone just show up at their shop - and lure them outside to "take a listen" - alot of mechanics hate doing that - but you can usually lure a few of them (:
just park your car running - and say "do you mind taking a listen to this for a moment" and see what they say - if they say no - drive down to the next shop ((: haha.

best of luck (;

[mikester_91]

Valve Lash. My car is makin a really loud noise from the valve cover. If your valves are too close or too far away from the pistons, the header, and engine area will make a sort of loud ticking sound.

[PoorLuder]

Yeah, it does seem like the noise includes that ticking part in it. I printed out the information for the valve clearance from HondaHookup and will probably try to adjust them when my dad is available. Thanks for helping to confirm the problem, Mikester.

[ludeguy]

Originally Posted by PoorLuder

Yeah, it does seem like the noise includes that ticking part in it. I printed out the information for the valve clearance from HondaHookup and will probably try to adjust them when my dad is available. Thanks for helping to confirm the problem, Mikester.

this post might help ya out too - complete with pictures.

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=618786