why viper?

i'm probly gonna piss some people off by saying this...but why would you buy a viper? when you see one drive by all you think is that its an old rich guy that doesn't know poop about cars. you can easily buy a car and make it faster than a viper for half the cost. i've seen supras, rx7's, civics, hell even neons beat vipers. i know this isn't taking into account some of the stuff you can do to vipers but most of that work costs a hell of a lot and gets to be illegal. also, i personally think vipers look tacky, their engines are ridiculously oversized and i know they are uncomfortable to drive.

My biggest problem with the viper is its serious lack of ability to do anything but drive in a straight line. I've read dozens of articles saying it would be a nice car if it wasnt such a bitch to handle. I wish i could back this up with first hand experience, but eh, life goes on.

Sure you can make a less expensive car faster than a Viper. . . . that is if you do nothing to the Viper that is.

Ever heard of the GTS-R? Which couldn’t be made street legal, anywhere? They don't have that bad of handling. Besides you can always take measures to correct that. The Viper is one of the best supercars around, besides soon AMG will be modding Viper's. :)

Why would a German tuner(AMG) want to mod an american vehicle(Dodge)?:confused:

Well you remember that Mercedes and Chrysler merged, right?

Well AMG mods Mercedes, they are going to do some work on the PT cruiser, and they are only speculation as of yet that they will mod the Viper. But if they are working on PT, why not the Viper. Hell I have to ask why mod a PT?

That's right!! I forgot about that little detail. Sorry for the speculation. I've seen pics of a pt cruiser that they were contemplating on making. It was going to be called the PT Crusher. Don't know if they are one in the same, but, I believe Hennessey was going to make it.:D

Thats what I heard as well. I think the work that AMG is supposed to be doing is on a different PT? I am not sure though.

I heard hennessey twin turbo'd viper that does 0-60 in 2.8 or somthing insane like that and then turned it into a production car. This true or some idiot talking out of his ass?

Originally posted by Cavallino
I heard hennessey twin turbo'd viper that does 0-60 in 2.8 or somthing insane like that and then turned it into a production car. This true or some idiot talking out of his ass?

Nope, you can do that to your GTS if you want to. Spendy mod though. I think it is called the Viper Venom 805 or something of the sorts.

yer
hennessey make a twin turbo kit thingy for the viper
0-100km/h (0-60mp/h) in 2.4 seconds
they ran on stock radial tyres 10.4 seconds or something and somehing lik 9.99 on some street legal slick cheater things i cant remember

http://www.motortrend.com/june01/ttviper/ttviper_f.html

theres the article there

http://www.hennesseymotorsports.com/cgi/store/commerce.cgi?page=v18.html&cart_id=7654584_26324

and thats the hennessey page :)

i want a viper :)

WHY VIPER!! WHY VIPER!!!
because they rock its the kinda car a guy will buy when he wants to get some, and he usually does

You guys are definitely showing your age. Obviously none of you have ever driven a Viper. Because if you did you would know why people own them. They generate more torque than any production car on the market, they can do 1.03 g's on the sidpad and they go 192 mph out of the box. The reason why most people don't own Vipers is because they demand your full attention and are very unforgiving to people who drive and think using their small brains (below your waste).

I drive mine each and every day. I also drive it on race tracks on a regular basis. People that drag race Vipers, do so because they have very little committment to learning how to drive them on road course. The biggest differentiator with all of the cars mentioned is the amount of torque that is generated by Vipers. Torque equates to being very unforgiving when operating at the extreme ends of the performance curves. The majority of the cars mentioned in this thread don't generate comparable torque numbers, and have to be spooled up to 4,500 rpm before hitting their torque curve. The Viper has just under 500 lb-ft of torque from idle to 5,300 rpm.

This is truly a drivers car, and not for the faint hearted. Just because a Viper has a gas, brake and clutch pedal do not assume that you can just hop in and drive one. This is one car that can really bite you in the a$$ if you aren't paying attention.

Brad

Only car enthusiast will appreciate what Viper can do.

Originally posted by F20C
Only car enthusiast will appreciate what Viper can do.

F20:

You are right, but we have our share of snotty a$$hole owners too. Every group of car nuts has them. But you are right that only an enthusiast can appreciate them.

Let me know if any of you ever vist Southern Cal. Maybe we can arrange a ride around the block.

Take care,

Brad

Viper is like S2000 that it begs to be driven by a guy that actually know the car. Not just some kid who knows how to drive stick period.

ARe you living in the LA area?

Originally posted by F20C
Viper is like S2000 that it begs to be driven by a guy that actually know the car. Not just some kid who knows how to drive stick period.

ARe you living in the LA area?

Yep, just south of LAX near the beach.

Brad

i don't know guys...i admit i have never actually driven a viper and i'd love to try one out sometime. but a good friend of mine has driven them many many times and says that they aren't that great compared to a lot of cars that cost considerably less. if you guys actually drive your vipers like they were made for then thats cool but never have i seen someone in a viper that was doing things that i couldn't do in my $6000 piece o' shit (or was under 60 years old). it still seems to me that people mainly are paying all that money purely for the name. then again maybe i have no right to be saying this stuff until i've driven one

Forty:

I would like to see if you can smoke your tires from 1st gear and not hook up until you hit 3rd and do the quarter mile in less than 12 seconds (with stock 3.07 gears and 335 series street tires). I would also like to see if you can put your car into a drifting sweeper turn at 120+ mph in oversteer, and throttle steering your car through the turn. Can your car turn out 500 lb-ft of torque and start from a standing stop in 3rd or 4th gear without lurching? Can your car go 192 mph out of the box? How about stopping 60 to 0 in 110 feet? How about pulling 1.03 g's on a skidpad?

No offense meant, but how many cars do you know that can do all of this in it's stock form? Yeah, you can throw tons of money into any car to make it go like a Viper, but does that make it a Viper? Can your car do it all (in terms of acceleration, braking and handling)? Not many drivers are capable of this, but you can bet your life that the car definitely is up to all of this and more.

Don't judge a car based on the few old men that you see driving them or the magazines that you read. There are plenty of Viper owners that would gladly mix it up with you at a road racing course or drag strip. I doubt that there are many that want to mix it up with you on the street, but you might get lucky and find a few. The Viper is definitely more than just a name. Like most drivers out there who can afford to drive these kinds of cars, but rarely know how to drive them. Why is that different than any other car? Let's face it, most drivers don't know how to drive. Just because a Viper has a gas pedal, a brake, a shifter and a clutch does not mean that anyone can just jump in and drive one. Assume that and you might just get yourself killed.

Don't be so quick to judge.

Brad

Vipers are awesome, I think they are one of the best looking cars out there. Pics do no justice, A Viper in real life defines what sexy is. I just love the curves on the viper, that's what a civic can't do.

Viper 10 do you know of a guy that goes by the name of ViperPaul? I heard he is the best Viper driver in America right now.

Sorry, don't know him. It could be a guy by the name of Paul Mumford, who lives in Southern Cal. I have heard that he is a very good driver, who has done very well in the Michelin Viper Challenge races. I would say that outside of Tommy Archer, that Erik Messley is one of the best Viper drivers out there. Archer and Messley are professional drivers. I do not think that Paul Mumford is a pro.

Brad

He says he race professionally. He also said he held the fastest time at Road America for a Viper driver.

F20:

Do you know where ViperPaul lives? I don't even know Mumford, except through the internet. He's a pretty serious racer in the Michelin series. Maybe it's the same guy?

How do you know him?

Have a good day.

Brad

I don't know him personally. Only get to know him slightly from another web site. He was visiting a Honda site since he also have a S2000. He got into a heated debate with a NSX owner. Basically the two are arguing NSX and Viper which one is faster. NSX owner said he can drive his stock NSX faster than any stock Viper. The Viper guy says he can drive his stock Viper faster than any stock NSX. The thread went on for 20 pages going back and forth.

It sounds like Paul Mumford. I think that he owns an S2000 and an E55.

Not a big deal. I don't consider myself a racer. I just get to the track a few times a year to get my rocks off. Even then, I don't run as hard as those guys. They've got money to burn, and I don't.

Later,

Brad

Probaly that's him.

I'd just thought I'd let you guys know I'm a women I have driven a viper before and I'm not just some kid who knows how to drive a stick.;)

Originally posted by viperluvr2002
I'd just thought I'd let you guys know I'm a women I have driven a viper before and I'm not just some kid who knows how to drive a stick.;)

Did I miss something here? I didn't see anyone contest you on these points. Would you believe that less than 5% of Viper owners are women? I am glad that you like them, do you have any plans to but a Viper in the future?

Where did you get to drive a Snake and what did you think? Were you able to open the car up?

Brad

The only ones I can rent here are Silver.

As soon as I finish law school and start at my firm I hope to buy one not sure what kind though

Originally posted by Viper 10
Forty:

I would like to see if you can smoke your tires from 1st gear and not hook up until you hit 3rd and do the quarter mile in less than 12 seconds (with stock 3.07 gears and 335 series street tires). I would also like to see if you can put your car into a drifting sweeper turn at 120+ mph in oversteer, and throttle steering your car through the turn. Can your car turn out 500 lb-ft of torque and start from a standing stop in 3rd or 4th gear without lurching? Can your car go 192 mph out of the box? How about stopping 60 to 0 in 110 feet? How about pulling 1.03 g's on a skidpad?

No offense meant, but how many cars do you know that can do all of this in it's stock form? Yeah, you can throw tons of money into any car to make it go like a Viper, but does that make it a Viper? Can your car do it all (in terms of acceleration, braking and handling)?

no, i know of very few cars that can do all this in their stock form but i don't get why this is something to be proud of. i really don't mean to sound like an asshole but i could probably make a car that can do all this for half the price. personally, my favorite thing about cars is making modifications and i don't mean little things like clear taillights and stickers. in the end i guess its just a matter of taste and what you're looking for in a car. i still love you viper 10

hey also theres a dealership back home that currently has a gts and an rt10. you guys have any advice on how i can convince them to let me testdrive one of them?

Originally posted by fortyoz2eric


no, i know of very few cars that can do all this in their stock form but i don't get why this is something to be proud of. i really don't mean to sound like an asshole but i could probably make a car that can do all this for half the price. personally, my favorite thing about cars is making modifications and i don't mean little things like clear taillights and stickers. in the end i guess its just a matter of taste and what you're looking for in a car. i still love you viper 10

Forty:

Nothing personal, but you forgot to tell us that you can build a car that performs as well as a Viper in these categories that is going to be unreliable to be driven daily and won't pass smog in CA, right? I would like to personally hear how you will make this car that you purpose that you can build. Are you building it for the new car price of $75k or the used price of some Vipers of $40k?

If you start with a POS and fix it up, it still ends up being a fast POS.

Still love you too Forty...

Brad

Originally posted by Viper 10


Forty:

Nothing personal, but you forgot to tell us that you can build a car that performs as well as a Viper in these categories that is going to be unreliable to be driven daily and won't pass smog in CA, right? I would like to personally hear how you will make this car that you purpose that you can build. Are you building it for the new car price of $75k or the used price of some Vipers of $40k?

If you start with a POS and fix it up, it still ends up being a fast POS.

Still love you too Forty...

Brad

If I'm butting in, ignore me. But if you were to buy a used 3rd gen RX-7 for $15k and add $25k of mods in it, totaling $40k, there is no question of which car would win. It would destroy the Viper in speed, match it in reliability, plus beat it in handling. To top it off, you would have an RX-7 in the garage at the end of the day, hardly a POS. Thats how you would build a non-POS car for half the price of a new Viper that would destroy it in any category. But don't get me wrong, the Viper is an awesome car, and owning one must be incredible.

Well, i don't think the RX-7 would be more reliable, i hear a lot about rotary engines being unreliable, and adding lots of mods to it may make it worse, but maybe not.

I hate all this "well i could do this...and it would be faster" well it wouldn't be a muscle car with a V10 in it would it, much less a viper. The same arguement goes with much less expensive cars. People say they can build a civic to be faster than say a camaro SS or Z28. Well, maybe you could, but its not a muslce car (some people LOVE them with their entire heart, and don't care if it doesn't perform as well as another car), and its still a civic.

Sorry Guys if this offends some of you...

You can polish and pump up a turd all you want... but in the end you still have a turd.

I like RX-7's (in fact my brother owns a TT), but it is not a Viper. If you pump a RX-7 up that much, you can bet that it will not be reliable. Spend enough money and you can make a Kleenex box go faster than a Viper... so what's your point? Are you saying if given the choice that you would take the RX?

Am I missing something here?

well yea i would take the rx-7. i know this is all opinions but i think the fun of having a car is making it an ongoing project to get it to perform to your own specifications - obviously if you buy a viper that isn't your kind of fun. anyways stop saying "if you modify crap its still crap", this is only true if you have a pinto. if you can make a civic do everything a camaro can do and more, then why do people that drive camaros still call civics crap?

To each his own, right? Have fun with your RX or your Civic's...

Why would a camaro owner call a civic that is faster than it crap? Because he likes muslce cars more than imports/ricers (since they aren't the same thing). I don't like the econo cars that are souped up, but i do like the nice imports like the RX7, S2000, WRX, supra, ect. ect...Why couldn't you make a viper a project that is ongoing? With a viper you can't upgrade it, you can't improve handling, power, or something else? Ya maybe its more expensive, but its not the same as the imports. Some people would rather have lesser handling muscle car putting out 500-600hp with 550 ft-lbs of torque coming out of a big V8, than a faster better handling worked up RX-7 or supra. Its tastes, personally if you offered me a nice muscle car, then a faster, better handling import, i would take the muscle car just because it is a muscle car, they are my thing. You guys will never resolve why you should get a viper over a ____ b/c tastes differ, and so do opinions. How about you guys learn to respect the fact that some people love these cars for what they are, and they should in turn respect that you love your type of car and prefer it.

I agree with Cy and Viper10's last response.
To each their own.

I have exceptional respect for this finely-tuned production muscle car, but I believe it to be beyond just your average muscle car. It is a true supercar.

There are, however, incredibly well-engineered imports that are "not Vipers". Take the rally-bred vehicles like the Evolution and the STI. Both can get just under 1.00 on the skidpad, over 70mph on the slalom, 0-60 in sometimes as little as 4.3 seconds (we may be talking about the MR or Spec-C here) for well under $40,000. Particularly on the Evolution, tuning can oftentimes make it more "streetable" -- and with close to 400 HP to the wheels.


Are these cars Vipers? No.
I can see why it irks a Viper owner to hear that some little wrong-wheel drive "POS" can be "tuned" to 600HP+ and go faster than a Viper. I mean, you are shellin' out a lotta cash for your machine.

I see Evo owners on their forums very angry at Dodge SRT-4 owners saying they can basically do the same thing.
Their response? "It's still a Neon"

But you see, it is not. It has an entirely different engine from your run-of-the-mill Neon, and is actually a rather decent car. But a FWD 250hp car is not the same as a AWD rally-inspired car.


My point is, every car has its niche, and to compare an RX-7 to a Viper is utterly ridiculous. If you want a Rear-wheel drag monster that puts out interesting and enviable skidpad results in addition to its very admirable handling abilities? Got 80-ish grand? Then a Viper is well indeed for you.

WHY VIPER!! WHY VIPER!!!
because they rock its the kinda car a guy will buy when he wants to get some, and he usually does

Not quite correct statement on the torque. The MB SL600 with the V12 TT produces 590lbs/ft torque at about 3000 rpm. I also have a 01 Viper GTS coupe, a 04 SRT-10 Viper and a MB S55 AMG sedan. After road testing the Sl600 V12 I have decided to trade the SRT-10 for the SL600 and keep the GTS Viper as my only Viper. I found the SRT-10 to be powerful and responsive but liked the brutish power and luxery of the SL600. Think of it as a Viper with breeding!!

I will tell you all why a viper. cause it looks so sweet! Only the look of a Viper can make you horny. and then when you hear the engine you just flip out yo go mad=) Dodge Viper is the most beautiful car that have bin made in 30 years. and the car that is more beautifull than the viper is the Dodge Challenger '70.

Everybody says that the viper is almost impossiple to drive on a cours and i can belive that.... but ho cears?=P

I ame not old egnuf to buy me one and i have not the money but when i have, a Viper will be parked at my drive way.

Well there you have the resosn for buying a viper!

you can easily buy a car and make it faster than a viper for half the cost. The problem with this argument is that the same thing can be said of any other car, no matter how much (or how little) it costs. The extreme of this argument is stating a person should buy a $10 - $15,000 bike that can kill just about any car (modified or not) on the street. If you bring this argument to me, stating your Supra is cheaper and faster than my Viper then I'll bring out my bike next time. Then you must do the same to counteract. Then I must spend money to soup mine up to go faster. Eventually there is no winner, since the loser will say 'mine's cheaper'. It's pointless. In the end, I would rather drive the Viper.

Why buy a Viper Cause I can . I'm only 23 and I have a Viper and a Z06. I'm not some old guy that doesn't know shit about cars. Ive worked for them to buy them im not like lots of people who are rich and spoiled . My parents are poor and Ive worked for what I have . I've worked more hours in a month then some people are awake in a month . Id like to see a ricer that can have 900+ hp with just a twin supercharger like you can do to a Viper . Vipers are by far better lookin cars then anything out their and they are rare .I dont want a car that everyone has . Drive down the street and you see 10 more cars the same kind . My 2000 Steel Grey Acr is one of only 39 Ive never seen in person another Viper like it . Let alone the fact that I rarely see other Viper owners .

I have lots of friends with all kinds of ricers and muscle cars . When I go with them nobody double looks thier cars even with all thier mods , paint body kits what ever. When I'm in my Viper I'm always getting thumbs up waves honks . People cant take thier eyes off them.

You can take a mini van and it can be faster then a Viper who cares . Ricers are bellybutton cars everyones got one . You always hear young punks who dont know shit about Vipers but what they have read in magazines . They have never seen a Viper let alone drove in one . I like the handling in my Viper better than my z06 . You just have to know how to drive one .

Vipers arn't just straight line cars even though their good on the drag strip. The Viper has won Lemans which some consider to be the ultimate race for proffesional racing. So that alone proves the Viper is one of the Worlds best cars on and off a track.

I dont know how many times Ive read as well in Magazines where the Viper Losses in a contest against cars . Only because of the price, even though it won the majority of the preformance tests.

Vipers are one of the best looking fastest production cars in the world . So why dont you jealous haters go to your www.fastminivan.com forums and talk to each other about how you tripled your horsepower from cold air intake . And stay away from forums where real men talk about real cars .

Viper is like S2000 that it begs to be driven by a guy that actually know the car. Not just some kid who knows how to drive stick period.

ARe you living in the LA area?

Yes, I live in Manhattan Beach and drive my GTS Coupe every single day. I also take it to the local road racing tracks whenever I can.

Do you live in LA too? If so, come on out to Woodley Park next weekend to the Mopar Spring Fling (17th and 18th). I'll be there all day Saturday and Sunday morning. Come on by and say hello. I'll probably be one of the few Vipers out there. Mine is the '96 GTS with the same plates as my tag name (with fresh paint and no emblems). You can try mine on for size...

Brad

is it true about the myth....that Vipers are shitty at handling.....I mean Viper is my ultimate dream car next to the toyota supra....for handling which would be better?

The Viper has won the famous 24 hour race at the Nurburgring track a couple of times, so it must handle reasonably well. I have often heard that it handles like crap, as well, but how is it winning these races if this is the case? It is more likely these are the complaints of bad drivers, since it is well known the Viper is not as easy to drive as other cars. This does not imply it is impossible to drive, however.

Sorry Guys if this offends some of you...


I like RX-7's (in fact my brother owns a TT), but it is not a Viper. If you pump a RX-7 up that much, you can bet that it will not be reliable. Spend enough money and you can make a Kleenex box go faster than a Viper... so what's your point? Are you saying if given the choice that you would take the RX?

Am I missing something here?


Hi. I'm new to the Dodge forum and I just wanted to say that I have to agree with Viper10 on the general subject of "what's better / faster".

I've had many cars over the years, and the reality is that your CAN make almost any car "go fast". Most people like cars such as Hondas, Mazdas, Chevys and Toyotas for use in modification simply because they're easily obtainable. Combined with the fact that they're what you'd call "forgiving cars" when it comes to handling, etc. - you could certainly say that these cars can generally perform better - for the more inexperienced driver.

Cars like the earlier Porsche 911s, mid-engined exotics like V12 Ferraris, Lamboghinis, as well as front-engined Shelby Cobras and our dear Vipers have incredible performance capability. But the truth is that these cars require much skill to be pushed to those limits. Whether it be from power-to-weight ratios, suspension set-up, tire selection and engine / transmission placement within the car's chassis - certain machines require much in the way of either firmness OR finess behind the wheel.

I love almost all automobiles, and I think that anyone who has a passion for a certain model / make of vehicle should pursue it because they love THAT car. Simply debating what car is better / safer / quicker / cheaper is circumstancial and really not that relevant. You should go for what you love.

is it true about the myth....that Vipers are shitty at handling.....I mean Viper is my ultimate dream car next to the toyota supra....for handling which would be better?

Whenever I hear about the viper's ride... it's always how the suspension's so stiff is like riding in a flatbed truck.... how do you think it get's around the corners so well? A soft suspensioned car is shitty around corners. And the SRT-10 is supposed to be unreal around corners. The R&T magazine rated it as the highest skidpad it's tested on a stock car save for one... the 2000(01?) SVT cobra... I know I was shocked to hear that too.... But I know... magazine junkies are fools... so how about you ask someone like viper10 who owns one and see how he feels about things.

I love almost all automobiles, and I think that anyone who has a passion for a certain model / make of vehicle should pursue it because they love THAT car. Simply debating what car is better / safer / quicker / cheaper is circumstancial and really not that relevant. You should go for what you love.

Very well stated Bertone... You may be new, but you are gladly welcomed with open arms.

damn asian pople, lets see a stock japanese car vs. a stock viper ever seen that? no then any souped up car has a big chance of beating a stock car cmon what are you thinking?
p.s. stop watching 2 fast 2 furious

damn asian people

? don't be a racist piece of shit. Any racism is not welcome here.

Im new to the dodge forum too, and im in the market for a gts, everything about the car I love. Truely an affordable supercar

damn asian pople, lets see a stock japanese car vs. a stock viper ever seen that? no then any souped up car has a big chance of beating a stock car cmon what are you thinking?
p.s. stop watching 2 fast 2 furious

What do you think of Asian people who own Vipers? Your intelligence and level of education is starting to show... or is it just a bad sense of humor?

i think vipers are great cars i have drove them. they will scare the crap out of you

I just bought my new '03 SRT-10 last week and let me tell you thatit is the best handling car I've ever driven. I traded in my '02 C5 vert and it didn't even come close. Yeah, it does ride rough, but it helps to keep the 345's in the rear firmly planted. My Viper is putting out 500hp and 525lbft of torque and you can definately feel in it the sotp. I'm shifting out of first at 60mph and it's not even at redline, just the peak of the hp curve. Bone stock it's 3.9sec 0-60mph and 11.77 in the quarter, not bad for a daily driver huh?. Btw, I'm only 34 years-old not 60 as most people would assume. Supercharger packages are less than $8k and you can TT it for around $12k --- on the stock bottom end, no engine mods required. Full header/exhaust packages go for $3k and net 50 to 60hp to the rear-wheels. This is by far the fastest car I've ever driven. The SRT-10's are pulling 197mph out of the box. So why'd I buy my Viper over an import or just keep my C5? Because they only make 1800 Viper's a year (worldwide). I got tired of seeing C5's at every intersection and I'm not into buying grocery-getters with souped up engines (if it can seat 4, I don't want it...).

This is about the most ignorant thread I have ever read. Members such as chris, Viper 10, oomph and a select others who probably know who they are can put together reasonable posts which are truthful. If you don't like a Viper, but prefer a Skyline or Supra, then fine. But don't post here and insult the Viper when you likely know nothing about the Viper hence the hate - there is little to hate about these cars. This view maybe slightly general and not the case of every cynic, but it's true for quite a lot of Viper haters I've spoken to. Point? If you like another car but hate the Viper then stick to that car and go on a community dedicated to that car. If you don't like something, then don't get involved in something about it (like a forum thread).

Vipers are such complete cars. Torquey V10, 8 litres - say that to someone and they will be shocked, gobs of power, rarity, tuning potential, superb handling, technological and racing credentials, good styling, a driver's car, good reliability. What more do you want?

A Civic may be able to be MODIFIED to go faster than a BONE STOCK Viper but you can't say things like the Civic has won Le Mans or has lots of torque, can you?

Oooomph...

SRT-10's don't top out at 197 mph. I don't know anyone who has taken one over 160. Remember that the convertibles are much more limited and unstable at speeds. RT/10's usually topped out at around 160 mph with a hard top toupee. The reason being is that most of the hard tops ripped right out of the mounts at those speeds (I have seen it happen). The aerodynamics of the rear of the RT's makes it VERY unstable at high speeds (it gets very light). There is just not enough downforce to make the car responsive at high speedds.

On the other hand the GTS's went significantly faster because of aerodynamics. As an owner of a GTS for the last 7 years, I wouldn't take the GTS's over 170 without some modifcations. For oone thing, the hood doesn't have adequate ventilation and a serious amount of pressure builds up under it (so bad that the hood starts waving around like a bedsheet). This hurts the aerodynamics so much that the front opening becomes a negative pressure area (which essentially walls this area off for less effective cooling).

Another area of concern is the pressure that builds up inside the GTS's at very high speeds. There is a vent that exits at the trailing egde of the rear quarter panels. At the factory many of the rubber sheet coverings get sealed against the body work. The result is that as you hit high speeds with your side windows opened the rear hatch blows out. It sounds like a magnum going off inside of the car.

For you Asian car bigots that love to talk trash, stop reading your stupid ricer mags and watching senseless movies like Fast and Furious. Magazines are nothing but high priced advertising and those movies exhibit some incredibly ignorant people who have their priorities in the wrong place. People who tell others to do illegal things like street racing are NOT your friends! They always have something to gain through your failures. Do yuou wonder why the crack pusher who street races is so cool to everyone? Because he looks at you as his m=next victim who will get hooked and need his drugs that he gave you for free (at first).

How much driving skill does it take to street race? So just because your magazines say that you can put out the same HP as a Viper, means that you can beat one in a race? So where does the HP and torque curves hit on your rice rockets... 4,000 rpm? How much torque do you get? What's torque? How many G's can that car pull in it's bone stock form? How fast a lap on a road course can you turn in that FWD monster?

My bone stock Viper pulls 450 RWHP and 490 RWTQ on a warranty rebuilt engine. Engine Mod's? How about a K&N air filter and smooth intake tubes. How many G's can a bone stock Viper pull? How about 1.05 G's. Where does the Viper's torque curve start? How about 900 rpm and kicks like a mule through 5,500 rpm. Is this anything to brag about? Hell no, because most of the Viper posers and dyno jockeys can't handle this unbelieveable performance. That's why over 40% of them have been totalled.

The one thing that you guys neglect to talk about is driver skill. Driver skill will beat just about ANY performance mod that you can fiind. Explain to me why guys in bone stock Vipers can turn the same lap times that guys driving Competition Coupe spec race cars can do? Explain to mewhy Viper whores/bigots can add tons of mods on their cars to turn over 1,200 HP and NOT be able to break 10 seconds on the strip? Explain to me why most guys can barely turn 13's on a bone stock Viper, but others turn 11.5's? Slow times? It's always the car's fault, right? Bull$hit! It's all about driver skill.

Why do all car bigots and dyno whores always blame their cars for slow times? Because the can't drive for $hit.

Most people spend an incredible amount time and money on their engines that they completely neglect modifying the chassis and suspension (or modify the idiot that is holding the steering wheel). How is anyone supposed to put the power to the pavement without killing themselves?

I walk it like I talk it. I drive fast only on tracks and haven't had an accident or a ticket in over 20 years. Learn to respect other people and their rides. I love all cars and used to be an old time ricer when I tracked Datsun 510's and 240Z's at Riverside Raceway and Willow Springs. Why? Because that's all that I could afford at the time... we ALL had to start at the bottom and work our way up to nicer cars (unless you are some spoiled sniveling brat who blackmails their parents into buying you an M3). I never street raced because my cars were too precious to me and I couldn't afford it if the cops impounded my car. My annual insurance used to be more than the price that I bought the car...

Get off your high horses and don't taklk smack until you've done some seat time in a Viper. If you want to put your money where your mouth is, then invest in developing driving skills on the track and quit dicking around with the bling-bling street racers. If you are in Southern Cal, I would be happy to show you my Snake and go for a spin around the block.

You'll see that it's not just about straight line acceleration. It's about pulling some very high speed G's with an excessive amount of torque (which challenges drivers and reduces your margin for error). It is much easier to drive the high tech cars at speeds like the Z06 and Porsche turbo's, but let's see you do it with tons of torque and no-tech to save your butts.

Final note, if you think that it's fun to rag on Vipers now, just wait for the announcement this fall on the SRT-10 Viper Coupe. It is coming to the plate with a sledge hammer (again) with the rumored engine that is currently being tested of a V-10 Hemi. The performance spec's are rumored to be between 600 and 650 HP! Stand back you Viper haters, because the Hulk of Detroit just raised the stakes in the performance game.

Can you say bye-bye Ford GT...

Later,

Brad

Well said Viper 10, I agree with you (from Viper enthusiast to Viper enthusiast and owner).


I read VA and VCA everyday, and I've heard lots about a new coupe but for me there is only one question. Will this new coupe be in the same bodystyle as the Competition Coupe/GTS-R concept shown in 2000?

why would they jump from 500hp to 600-650 i can believe 550 but not that much lol, man viper is doing too good for only being 10 years old... good job viper, i am a big fan of vipers, but will never ever love em as much as a lamborghini diablo sv, and 6.0...