Now this should be exciting - McLaren versus Enzo on 5th Gear...

Next week on 5th Gear:

Mac vs Enzo
Tiff Needell tests the McLaren F1 and Ferrari Enzo. They're the two supercars he's enjoyed most over the past decade, and now for the first time he's brought them together to try and choose a favourite. In a unique test, he takes these ultra-rare supercars, worth in excess of £2million, to the public roads. You'll get an exclusive insight into what it's like to actually use these cars in real life and we even see them at a petrol station - how does £100 to fill the tank sound?

http://fifthgear.five.tv/jsp/5gmain.jsp?lnk=410

I wonder which F1 he'll be using? I do hope they get them out onto the track as well. :)

>8^)
ER

dude can't wait...

has this comparison been done before? can't imagine tiff giving an unbiased opinion... not that I would disagree...

A friend seems to think he saw at the end of the last fifth gear it showed preview of the next one and it showed a HDF car that was Orange. He says F1 LM but I dont know how sure he can be? (his F1 knowledge is limited) We will have to wait and see, but I sure hope its an LM because I will be watching!!! :eek:

That is going to be awesome. I cant wait till the McLaren wins, lol.

are there any papaya orange road cars with a HDK that are not LM's?

are there any papaya orange road cars with a HDK that are not LM's?

Not to my knowledge, the only original Papaya Orange road car remains in it's unmolested form.

What there are, and what this could be, are no fewer than 5 short tailed F1 GTRs that have been resprayed in Papaya Orange giving them the look of an F1 LM. All of them seem to have been converted for road use as well. As soon as photos come out it should be very clear which car it is.

#16R seems a good possibility. It would be incredible if McLaren actually loaned them the LM.

>8^)
ER

.......... It would be incredible if McLaren actually loaned them the LM.

>8^)
ER

exactly my thoughts, but the car is on display at the motorshow, whatever could be next!!! :grinno:

enzo vs lm? :rofl:


i would expect it to just be a normal roadcar against an enzo though?

exactly my thoughts, but the car is on display at the motorshow, whatever could be next!!! :grinno:

enzo vs lm? :rofl:

Well no sense letting it sit around and collect dust forever. I just can't imagine Ron Dennis putting the LM up against an Enzo like that. I'm sure he's tired of being beaten by red cars all the time. :lol: I think it's hard to be certain of the outcome on such a comparison - it really comes down to the focus of the test. I obviously have a favorite, but I respect the abilities and the advancements then Enzo has benefitted from having come along a decade later. I wouldn't be surprised or terribly disappointed if the outcome is not as we would want.

i would expect it to just be a normal roadcar against an enzo though?

I actually think that a road converted GTR or LM makes much more sense against the Enzo. Afterall the Enzo is barely a road car itself. The suspension settings of an LM/GTR are much more suited for a numbers comparison against the Enzo too.

>8^)
ER

Martin Brundle,s been there..done that!! On his DVD.

........I wouldn't be surprised or terribly disappointed if the outcome is not as we would want...............>8^)
ER

yep sorry, i mean because i would pick the LM over the Enzo anyday, no matter what the outcome is. Its an all time fave car, nothing comes close! (ok, maybe almost an F50 GT!)

In no way will i predict the results of them 2 cars up against each other, its clear that the enzo uses a lot of more modern technology, but i wont comment as im not too clued up on enzo's, to tell the truth i do think they look quite ugly though :uhoh: :rofl:

Would put good money on the cars being both nick masons, he's got a enzo and a converted gtr, he also let top gear mess about with his enzo.

Three reports have come in that the car shown in the teaser at the end of the last program was orange though, which would rule out Mason's red GTR.

>8^)
ER

so all the signs are pointing towards an LM going up against the Enzo? I guess if McLaren were ever going to let the LM out, this would be the occasion...

I say 99% it's 16R with those descriptions. I think Ron is done letting his F1s being used by magazines and tv shows since promotion isn't needed anymore.

well thats just wishful-thinking from me... what does the #16R look like right now? papaya with the HDK?

what does the #16R look like right now? papaya with the HDK?

Here are some small photos:
Maranello Motorsport (http://www.maranellomotorsport.com/displayCarSold.asp?c=5)

Here are some that are more recent showing it in the UK wearing reg plate 'M700 BHP'

Some F1 pictures on Lambo-power (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=562439)

>8^)
ER

Hi there,

I have been exchanging e-mails recently with the owner of 16R and I know he also owns an Enzo. I also know that has recently attended an event with Tiff Needell so I would say that 16R will definately be the car they are using.

I also have some photos of 16R that he sent me and will post a link to these as soon as I have uploaded them.

Regards

Tim

Hi Guys,
Check out Autocar 25 Nov 2003,

They did a back to back test on the F1 and Enzo.
It was a Red road trim F1.
Verdict was this:-
F1 best road car and Enzo best track car.
Incidentaly the test was done by Martin Brundle so probably the same test as the DVD/Video.
Would have scanned it but my scanner is knackered.

carbuilder2002

That article was unfortunately quite worthless. They never tested the cars head-to-head, it was simply a numbers comparison using their previous test data. The red road version was actually the non-running Clinic Model having been Photoshopped red and the Enzo photos were simply Ferrari's press shots regurgitated. It was actually quite disappointing as Autocar normally is a quality magazine and they could have done much better.

>8^)
ER

Point taken.

carbuilder2002

Hi guys,

Recent photos of 16R as promised can be found using the link below.

www.dunlopix.com/page21.html (http://www.dunlopix.com/page21.html)

Sorry for the watermarks but I told the owner I would protect the pictures.

In the second picture you will see the guys Enzo as well. Should be nice to see them both on Fifth Gear next week.

Regards

Tim

The car featured in next weeks Fifth Gear will be 16R. I have this last weeks episode on my comp, and the preview clearly shows a papaya GTR with the plates 'M700 BHP'. Looks interesting...

It will be good to see 16R in action, Many thanks for the pics:thumbsup:

question is does 16r really have 700 BHP :)

Unlikely on the HP figure - maybe just wishful thinking. :grinno:

Malka - Thanks for the added confirmation. I really hope 5th Gear takes the time to explain that #16R is a GTR otherwise we'll be forever correcting people. :screwy:

Thanks for the new shots Tim - it was great of you to share them. Send thanks through to the owner as well. :)

>8^)
ER

Screen caps from the preview:

http://img424.imageshack.us/img424/2066/fifthgears09e12wspdtv1si4.th.jpg (http://img424.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fifthgears09e12wspdtv1si4.jpg) http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/1570/fifthgears09e12wspdtv2es1.th.jpg (http://img291.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fifthgears09e12wspdtv2es1.jpg)
http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/8549/fifthgears09e12wspdtv3aj5.th.jpg (http://img57.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fifthgears09e12wspdtv3aj5.jpg) http://img424.imageshack.us/img424/9624/fifthgears09e12wspdtv4ig1.th.jpg (http://img424.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fifthgears09e12wspdtv4ig1.jpg)

question is does 16r really have 700 BHP :)

Hi there,

According to an e-mail I received from the owner the car has "approx 680hp, weighs approx 950kg dry and is very very fast"

Regards

Tim

So were into LM terrotry then, thought as much, gtr has to be a bit higher tuned than a normal F1 to compensate for the air restrictors i guess.

I'm sure if that's the case the air restrictors have simply been removed. They are typically mounted right in the air intake vent in the roof that feeds the airbox. Then McLaren would likely need to retune the ECU and possibly replace the cams as well to get that horsepower figure.

The quesiton is whether those modifications occurred before or after it was in Australia, because it was never mentioned in the ads when it still wore the FINA paint scheme, nor was it mentioned in the Maranello Motorsport listing. Seems like something you might want to publicize... :dunno:

>8^)
ER

I may be wrong here (again) but the removal of the air restrictors and remapping would all be part of the conversion to road going trim that is carried out when a GTR is converted something not quite an LM? but pretty damn close. Besides are the GTR's not lighter than the LM's?

carbuilder2002

I can't wait for this episode :) Too bad the Fina livery is gone, but hopefully one day it will wear it again.

The quesiton is whether those modifications occurred before or after it was in Australia, because it was never mentioned in the ads when it still wore the FINA paint scheme, nor was it mentioned in the Maranello Motorsport listing. Seems like something you might want to publicize... :dunno:

>8^)
ER
I would say that it was done before OR after (also a possibility?) Australia. I would personally think that MM does not have the capacity to have done so, but I can try to find out more info if you wish.

For us not in the UK would someone put it on here? I will host it on my server.

For us not in the UK would someone put it on here? I will host it on my server.

Although I'm also not in the UK, I can most likely get a high quality copy of it once the episode airs. I can AIM transfer it to you if you're willing to host it so the rest can view it.

I would say that it was done before OR after (also a possibility?) Australia. I would personally think that MM does not have the capacity to have done so, but I can try to find out more info if you wish.

Yeah - I don't think MM would have been involved unless it was part of the transformation when the car was resprayed/refitted before coming to Australia. Feel free to ask though. :)

carbuilder2002 may be on to something with his suggestion that it could be part of the process for converting the car for road use, but there aren't many details floating around about what is truly involved in that. It's kind of a black art, and as we have seen, not all cars were converted by the McLaren factory so the process could vary widely from car to car.

>8^)
ER

For us not in the UK would someone put it on here? I will host it on my server.

There will be torrents up within a day of the episode so you can download it. PM me if you want more details.

16R still has its air restrictors,

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/1499/16r3ztf2.th.png (http://img87.imageshack.us/my.php?image=16r3ztf2.png)

Look in the roof scoop!!

For comparison

http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/3200/ms4nj6.th.png (http://img148.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ms4nj6.png)

check out the sign on the lm, a lm has a bit more power than 627 of a normal f1, and that 0-60 is a bit slow to :)

can not wait--wil lsomeone be able to post it here--i have not seen top gear in ages

the sign seems to be more in keeping with the standard F1

carbuilder2002

the sign seems to be more in keeping with the standard F1

carbuilder2002

blame the sunday times!!!

This deserves a bump!!

2 hours and 10 minutes and counting!...

The bets are on as to how quick someone can get a video link on this forum?.. (please not Google Video, its cr@p)..............

IIRC wasnt there a weblink somewhere that hosts 5th gear and Top Gear episodes pretty damn quick?.....

This deserves a bump!!

2 hours and 10 minutes and counting!...

The bets are on as to how quick someone can get a video link on this forum?.. (please not Google Video, its cr@p)..............

IIRC wasnt there a weblink somewhere that hosts 5th gear and Top Gear episodes pretty damn quick?.....

Final Gear usually has the full episode rip on torrent within the day. :)

Exactly. I can't watch it tonight since i'm going out to dinner but no doubt it'll be online by tomorrow evening :D

it was a short segment, but boy is that Chris Palmer a lucky man!! Chassis #016R in his drive next to RE03NZO (red Enzo) - good on him to profess he keeps them as an investment as well as toys, but letting Tiff (of all people...:) ) take them out for a drive, brave man

One of the best quotes from Tiff, on the F1, was 'i just have to try to remember how to get in a Mclaren F1'.......... - he must have SUCH a hard life!..

Wife had the soaps on so I will have to watch it tomorrow night :-(

carbuilder2002

Wife had the soaps on so I will have to watch it tomorrow night :-(

carbuilder2002

Who wears the trouser's in your house!!!

Final Gear lags! I already have the episode. Now it just needs to be hosted. ;)

The BOSS wears the trousers lol.

carbuilder2002

that episode of fifth gear is on newsgroups now :)

I wont spoil it for anyone but as always, fifth gear leaves you wanting much more. Good video. Really enjoyable but not nearly enough.

What chanel is 5th gear on? BBC World?

What chanel is 5th gear on? BBC World?


Channel 5 in the UK, not sure about the rest of the world.........

I wont spoil it for anyone but as always, fifth gear leaves you wanting much more. Good video. Really enjoyable but not nearly enough.

I agree... I was waiting for a continuation of that segment, but it never came... a bit anti-climatic as they built it up so much in last week's preview... nonetheless, it was still great...

+1 I didn't think that was a good ending. I guess by his last quote you can sort of tell which car he prefers. Even then I wasn't sure why they didn't have more clips later on.

My expectations were a little different, but I was still happy to see what 5th Gear put together. The GTR looked incredible on the road - I can't imagine being a pedestrian lucky enough to experience that passing by me - talk about a rush.

That Tiff Needel is a lucky man - this makes 4 F1s he's had the good fortune of getting behind the wheel of by my count. What a rough job he has. :lol:

>8^)
ER

I missed it and have tried to download it with no success, anyone know where I can get a download of it?

Cheers in advance.

carbuilder2002

Here's a link for viewing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkfvQvc9ipI

>8^)
ER

Many thanks Poleton25,

Just need my lottery win now.

carbuilder2002