Coolant Capacity

I have been flushing my 96 GL 3.8L Windstar radiator and at most all that comes out is about a gallon and a half. Thats all I ever put in also. The owners manual says its a 12 quart system. Where are the other six quarts or so??

The water is running clear so I believe I have all the antifreeze out but I am wondering if there is a plug in the system that is keeping water in the block or radiator?

Thanks

R Webb

Much of the remaining coolant is in the engine, and the heater....and hoses.
The capacity of 12 quarts is correct (for Windstar without rear heater).
I run the engine.......long enough to warm up...and open the thermostat......
Then let the engine cool.....drain, refill with DISTILLED water.
I do that several times.....then drain.....and add 6 quarts of concentrated (not the 50/50 "premix") coolant. I usually end up putting much of the coolant into the overflow bottle. It will take some time to "burp" the air out of the system.

CHECK to make sure that the overflow bottle is in the loop by....WHEN ENGINE IS COOL removing the radiator cap.....and filling as needed if there is air there.
You WILL need to do this over the next few days after doing the coolant change.

Also, make sure that the rubber seal on the radiator cap is clean....and the seating area for the cap seal in the neck of the radiator is clean.

When the engine is hot......you should be able to squeeze the top radiator hose and feel that it is FIRM. This will tell you that the cap is holding pressure. If in doublt, replace the cap, with the correct pressure rated cap.

I would also recommend that you look into the CORRECT type of coolant for your year.
My '96 calls for the "Traditional Green" which is HARD to locate at this time.
Seems most of the coolants on the shelf are of the "DEXCOOL" type.....which is a OAT (Organic Acid Technology) type.
This type of coolant has NO silicates.....and is not recommended for the Windstar.

The coolants that say "All makes all models" or "Universal" or "Global" are not Silicate containing coolants (at this time). Things may change in the future....which is why you will need to research the subject.
Zerex has information on their website.....and Peak has information on their website as well.

You can get "Traditional Green" silicate containing coolant from your FORD dealer, and also Zerex and Peak have this.....but you will need to read the label....as they make the "universal" non-silicate coolants as well.
The "Yellow jug" of Prestone no longer has silicates.

They had to go and make antifreeze complicated..... and I do not want to babble on longer that I have already.

I will only say that FORD intended for our Windstars to have a coolant that contains silicates.

Wiswind,

why does the absense of silicates cause a problem? I knew enough not to use Dex-Cool in my 99 (I don't even like using it in my wife's Chev) and I easily located non-Dex-Cool but I never knew there were 2 other "regular" types.

Thanks Wiswind - as always your replies are informative. The reason for the question regarding the coolant capacity is that I have detected a small failure of the head gasket as was going to use the "K&W Permanent Metallic Block Seal" product from CRC. However, the directions call for complete draining of the cooling system and letting it dry after running the sealer through the system for about 30 minutes. If I can't drain the system completelty I can't/wont use the product. Also, the directions on the can state, "... Not following the directions EXACTLY could result in severe engine damage. ..."

The leak has been confirmed by a certified mechanic I have confidence in. The symptoms are oil in the overflow tank, overflow tank continually looses coolant, and the mechanic found a cylinder full of coolant when the van would not crank over.

Is there another product anyone knows about the will help here. I really do not have the $ to have the gasket or engine replaced.

Thanks Again and always

R Webb

Head gaskets are not a high fail item on POST 1995 windstars.
Lower intake manifold gaskets ARE, as is the "front cover" aka "Timing cover" gasket.
Replacement of the head gaskets REQUIRES replacement of the lower intake manifold gaskets.
I have pictures of my lower intake manifold gasket repair attempt.
I ended up having problems, so I took it to a mechanic to have it done right.
Cost was just over $450, including tax....with new gaskets from FORD.
You DO want to be SURE to have the job done with gaskets from FORD as there have been improvements made, that are NOT yet available in the aftermarket gaskets.

Silicates in coolant.... Silicates provide corrosion protection. The protection is IMEDIATE, versus up to several thousand miles for OAT (Organic Acid Technology) coolant to build up a protective layer.
Older, high silicate coolants were prone to have the silicates settle out, and clog passages, or make sand like particles in the coolant.
This is why they have said to change the original coolant after 3 years, and every 2 years thereafter.
Newer "traditional green" silicate coolants that I have seen, seem to have a much lower level of silicates than in the older coolants.
Motorcraft Green, and Peak Original Blue jug, and Zerex Original are "traditional green" coolants

Dexcool is a OAT technology, which has NO silicates, so it does not do well for cooling systems with air bubbles, or particles that can erode the protective layer.
Motorcraft Premium Orange is a OAT coolant.

The compromise is a HOAT (Hybrid Organic Acid Technology) that contains some additive to provide some imediate protection, and the long life protection capabilities of the silicate free coolant. The silicate is at a low level, that does not settle out.
G-05 (Zerex G-05 and Motorcraft Premium Gold) use a low level of silicate to provide the instant protection.

Some of the Asian car companies specifiy a HOAT coolant that uses Phosphate in place of Silicate to provide the instant protection.

FORD recommendations for Pre-1999 Windstar is to use the "Traditional Green" coolant with Silicates.

FORD recommendations for 1999 up to 7/15/2002 Windstar is either Green or Yellow (G-05) coolant.
If changing from green to yellow, yellow service interval is to be the SAME as for green, unless you are sure that you flushed ALL the green out.

FORD recommendations for 7/15/2002 and newer Windstar is Yellow (G-05) coolant.

For a different FORD vehicle (other than Windstar), check for what they recommend for that vehicle.

Hi Folks - I am still dithering about this problem and driving the 96GL WS without any repairs other that several flushings and running on straight wate at the moment. However, I came upon another message board where a theory was presented that oil in the coolant and coolant in the oil are two different problems and require different solutions. As my symptom is definitley oil in the coolant and my oil has never had any of the symptoms of coolant in the oil such as the foamy or milky appearance, I was wondering if anyone can tell me if this theory has any validity to it??

The 2 leaks that are common on the post 1995 windstar that can get coolant to the oil are the lower intake manifold gaskets, and the front cover gasket....also called "timing cover" gasket.
I would expect that the front cover gasket would be more likely to get oil into the coolant, but that is just a guess.

The replacement gaskets from FORD are improved, and that is where you should get them to be certain to get gaskets that have the latest improvement.
They are cheap.
The labor involved in changing them is NOT cheap.

Head gaskets are not a high fail item on POST 1995 windstars.
Lower intake manifold gaskets ARE, as is the "front cover" aka "Timing cover" gasket.
Replacement of the head gaskets REQUIRES replacement of the lower intake manifold gaskets.
I have pictures of my lower intake manifold gasket repair attempt.
I ended up having problems, so I took it to a mechanic to have it done right.
Cost was just over $450, including tax....with new gaskets from FORD.
You DO want to be SURE to have the job done with gaskets from FORD as there have been improvements made, that are NOT yet available in the aftermarket gaskets.

Silicates in coolant.... Silicates provide corrosion protection. The protection is IMEDIATE, versus up to several thousand miles for OAT (Organic Acid Technology) coolant to build up a protective layer.
Older, high silicate coolants were prone to have the silicates settle out, and clog passages, or make sand like particles in the coolant.
This is why they have said to change the original coolant after 3 years, and every 2 years thereafter.
Newer "traditional green" silicate coolants that I have seen, seem to have a much lower level of silicates than in the older coolants.
Motorcraft Green, and Peak Original Blue jug, and Zerex Original are "traditional green" coolants

Dexcool is a OAT technology, which has NO silicates, so it does not do well for cooling systems with air bubbles, or particles that can erode the protective layer.
Motorcraft Premium Orange is a OAT coolant.

The compromise is a HOAT (Hybrid Organic Acid Technology) that contains some additive to provide some imediate protection, and the long life protection capabilities of the silicate free coolant. The silicate is at a low level, that does not settle out.
G-05 (Zerex G-05 and Motorcraft Premium Gold) use a low level of silicate to provide the instant protection.

Some of the Asian car companies specifiy a HOAT coolant that uses Phosphate in place of Silicate to provide the instant protection.

FORD recommendations for Pre-1999 Windstar is to use the "Traditional Green" coolant with Silicates.

FORD recommendations for 1999 up to 7/15/2002 Windstar is either Green or Yellow (G-05) coolant.
If changing from green to yellow, yellow service interval is to be the SAME as for green, unless you are sure that you flushed ALL the green out.

FORD recommendations for 7/15/2002 and newer Windstar is Yellow (G-05) coolant.

For a different FORD vehicle (other than Windstar), check for what they recommend for that vehicle.

Thanks for the very detailed explanation Wiswind. Silly me thinking that coolant would be simple. I have no idea what I put in. I know it wasn't Dexcool. I hope I have the bottle still.

It can be difficult to tell what is in the bottle.
The Prestone Yellow jug does not say Dexcool any place on the label.
It does say that it is compatible with all types of coolant.
It also (at this time) says that it is for all makes and models of vehicles.
In the end, it is OAT, which is the same TYPE of coolant as Dexcool.

I had the Yellow jug Prestone in for 1 year, and it was fine.
However, it is not what FORD recommends.
I have the G-05 in there now, which is also not what FORD recommends, but it is closer to the recommendation, with the silicate.

I had the Yellow jug Prestone in for 1 year, and it was fine.
However, it is not what FORD recommends.

Last time I checked the Prestone Yellow jug that says its for all makes and models is approved for the Ford coolant specification, at least the spec. that applies to 99+ Windstars.

:rofl: Correct me if im wrong but I thought the Dex cool was red and there was a third stuff that was orange... Or is it the same? It appears my ws has orange colored fluid in cooling system or orange to yellow...

Different manufacturers use different colors in their coolants......which further complicates the process of determination of coolant type.

The MOST important thing is to have fresh, clean coolant in there.