eclipse vs. vette please explain

Originally posted by w8n4myevo

Just look at it this way, yes they have a modded 4cyl and you have a stock 8 which I believe is a 350 correct? Look at it this way, vettes have double the room for producing power,8 cyl vs. 4 cyl, 5.8 litres vs. 2.0 and 6 speed versus 5. And all you have on them is a half a second? In my book they are close. And btw, wait for the Evo VII and you will see a 2.0 smoke you. Nothing personal but america doesnt know how to make a car fast. You want to keep up with the everchanging and drastically improving import scene? Do yourself a favor and contact John Lingenfelter. I think he might be able to help you keep up. your missing what i'm saying, the'yve spent about 4 grand more than me including the car and are still about a half second short, so how about i take that same 4 grand mod my car and then lets see how close it is, considering we've both spent the same amount of money. Now i know there is alot of people that have spent less and could whup my ass but i don't live by any of these people i live by a kid who spent a total of about 19k talks mad shit about being fast and hes only running 14.5, i think thats pretty pathetic considering that if i went and bought and eclipse modded it and spent a total of 19k it sure as hell would be faster than 14.5

Originally posted by n1kki6
your missing what i'm saying, the'yve spent about 4 grand more than me including the car and are still about a half second short, so how about i take that same 4 grand mod my car and then lets see how close it is, considering we've both spent the same amount of money. Now i know there is alot of people that have spent less and could whup my ass but i don't live by any of these people i live by a kid who spent a total of about 19k talks mad shit about being fast and hes only running 14.5, i think thats pretty pathetic considering that if i went and bought and eclipse modded it and spent a total of 19k it sure as hell would be faster than 14.5

Well, ricers seem to think that they engineered the car.

If you have a big V8 there are often certain disadvantages; less gas mileage, more weight, worse handling dynamics etc. But a Vette has a V8 and still handles better than most imports. So the end product is better despite its larger engine. So in that respect, what does it matter that you get more hp/liter? Somebody please answer this, I beg of you.

I can see people bitching about Mustangs and Trans Ams because they have a V8 and weigh a ton and handle like a broken shopping cart. But a Vette is super light and handles great, has a shitload of power and was cheaper than the imports that n1kki6 raced. Power/weight matters, price/performance matters, but hp/liter means NOTHING, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.

Originally posted by n1kki6
YogsVR4 i seen you have a delorean, those are fun cars, my uncle has one but unfortunatly its an auto and don't have the turbos. By the way nice selection of cars, i love the 3kgt spyders, i wanted to buy one but you can't find them anywhere.

Thanks! The Delorean is kinda fun to drive around because they are extremely rare (at least around here). I the only other ones that I know about are a couple hundred miles away. If you ever want to find a spyder - go to www.3si.org and check the for sale section. We get on in there from time to time.

Originally posted by Gravitom

Power/weight matters, price/performance matters, but hp/liter means NOTHING, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.

Exactly. i love imports, but its funny when their car is faster its all about my import is way better, but when their car is slower its always like yeah well my hp/liter is better, or you should have won you have a bigger engine. Almost every import i've raced has instigated the race and then when they lose they always have an excuse. Shit its 2002, its not about engine size anymore, the fast imports have proven that. But when an import loses to a v8 thats always the excuse. But if they win its always like a beat a v8. who really gives a fuck i don't race so i can make more excuses or talk shit, i race to see who is faster regardless of the car. I don't go try to race ferraris and then when i lose say well yo should of won your engines bigger. Thats just bitch shit.

Your vettes engine is larger then most, if not all Ferrari engines.

Thats HP/Liter for you.

If you race a Skyline and loose do you say "You only won cause you have a turbo"? Sounds ridiculous right?


Originally posted by 1320B4U
Your vettes engine is larger then most, if not all Ferrari engines.

Thank you Captain Obvious. Do you have any more nuggets of irrelevant information that you would like to share?

Price/performance > hp/liter

"I don't go try to race ferraris and then when i lose say well yo should of won your engines bigger."


Aparrantly he didn't know.


HP/Liter shows how tuned an engine is.

Originally posted by 1320B4U

HP/Liter shows how tuned an engine is.

and how reliable. but lets not get into that one again huh Gravitom?!?;) j/k:D

I agree that when they lose and make excuses sucks. But if you lost to me, wouldn't you ask how much money was in my engine?? I mean you did start this whole post dealing with how much money they had put in their car.

Originally posted by Gravitom
If you race a Skyline and loose do you say "You only won cause you have a turbo"? Sounds ridiculous right?

Originally posted by 1320B4U
Your vettes engine is larger then most, if not all Ferrari engines.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Thank you Captain Obvious. Do you have any more nuggets of irrelevant information that you would like to share?

Price/performance > hp/liter


it is far form irrelevant, h said that if he lost to a ferrari he would ssay it is because it had a larger engine like if he ws one of thoise little boys with their eclipses he talks about, then this guy said that his engine is bigger thsan most if not all, because the guy was wrong and he was showing him this...

RELEVANT

thanks for the correction

i was basically just trying to say all the excuses are BS. Those who don't make excuses this is not pointed at you, this post is basically about how many unrespectable import drivers there are. Not all but a lot. treas talking shit about a small cock is a prime example.

And I think most domestic drivers are ignorant, but I don't go on the corvette board and post that. I have a friend with a vette, who didn't think my car could hit a 13.9 and thinks that me telling him that i have seen videos of eclipses running 9s and 10s is internet fraud. We can make power, and we do make power. I can respect a domestic owner who makes there car faster, but I can't respect any closed minded loser who looks solely at displacement for answers.

Nicely said.

no you don't go on a vette board but you have to admit it did revive the board a little it was getting kinda slow. "Without Conflict we'de all be pretty bored wouldn't we" Nikki Sixx.

That's the way the world spins.

Hey, I just checked out your site. Nice. Was that an old timing belt that needed replacement (what caused that)? How is the Excedy clutch?
-Isaiah

I would buy an ACT 2600 if I did it again. I assume the timing belt was just old. Where the teeth are missing is where the crank pulley was. It was pretty torn up. Thanks for the compliment. Some time I plan on making it a lot cooler. I have to make my car a lot cooler first.

Just look at it this way, yes they have a modded 4cyl and you have a stock 8 which I believe is a 350 correct? Look at it this way, vettes have double the room for producing power,8 cyl vs. 4 cyl, 5.8 litres vs. 2.0 and 6 speed versus 5. And all you have on them is a half a second? In my book they are close. And btw, wait for the Evo VII and you will see a 2.0 smoke you. Nothing personal but america doesnt know how to make a car fast. You want to keep up with the everchanging and drastically improving import scene? Do yourself a favor and contact John Lingenfelter. I think he might be able to help you keep up.


My car cost $8,500 with 55k miles. I have $4,000 in mods right now...

Total: $12,500.

Power adder for power adder, the evo VII doesn't stand a chance. It is already wound out. Put a turbo on a V8, and bye bye evo... :loser:

Evo's are overrated more than any car I can remember. I think the STI is a much better car than the Evo, and yet the Evo gets talked about as if it is god. I think not. The 350Z, a naturally aspirated 6 banger can run with an evo. Doesn't sound to special to me...

BTW, the Evo VII will cost over $30k when it hits showroom floors and therfore, it can lick my nuts... :iceslolan

BTW, no offense to any import driving guys, as I respect the fact that we aren't all going to drive the same car. I also know that imports can be made to go fast, but I just don't like hearing someone bashing on american automakers, cause some hyped up overrated car like the evo is going to be sold here some day when they finally get the emissions tests to pass...

This is to cool u guys down... read it and for sure u will have a smile in ur face :)




What is heaven for a guy...
Having an american salary...european car....japanese technology.... chinese food... an African tool ;)....and an indian wife :D


What is Hell for a guy...
Having an african food :( ....a chinese tool :D..... Indian salary and American wife lol....

Evo's may be overated according to u... (me not sure) but what do u think abt 3000gt VR4... ;) Give Respect and Get respected...

vettes are for guy's too poor to buy a porche, and too stupid to mod anything else... and my DSM rocks!!!

Alright, I usually don’t get caught up in this type of thread simply because they never end. People will always have a better car for less money. If you go to an auction you can get a car for under a grand. If you get second hand parts you can cut money that way….on and on and on…blah blah.
The one thing people don’t seem to realize is that drag racing is not all that big in Japan or around the world. Imported cars are made on a totally different ideal than a mustang or camaro. Handling is key, not ¼ mile times. So off the back we are talking apples to oranges.
The Subaru STI is a Modified WRX that cost more than the Lancer. To make it interesting they compared the two regardless of the big hp gap. But this still only made the STI .1 faster in the ¼ mile. And on the road the STI cannot hang. The STI was a direct answer to the EVO 8 coming to America. Because Subaru knows they are behind. They are rivals because Subaru can’t win a WRC while a Lancer is in competition. Something like 10 wins in a row for the EVO cars?
The 350Z is a good car and falls in the same price range as the Lancer but if you want to compare factory ¼ miles the Lancer eats that up too.

The EVO has options that can creep up the price to 35k. Not to mention the dealers making there killing off the eager who must have this car. Minus the Gauge cluster under the radio, hyper ground system, rear wing, sun roof, air dam options, and strut tower bar you come in right at 30 grand. Personally I think the way to go is to import an Evo 8. Same price but you don’t lose components like the active yaw system and such. Plus you can add the option of the titanium compressor wheel over the stock aluminum. And the best part, it actually makes it’s unofficial horsepower of closer to 300hp. 276 is for insurance claims and the under-enforced law in Japan about no street legal car being able to make more than that

Power bolt on to power bolt on does not equal ¼ mile times. One example is the Pruven 91 TSI AWD. It makes 527hp at the wheels. During the Ultimate Street Car Shootout. Cars were selected to compete in many events from road racing to the ¼ mile. Some odd contest like “best gas mileage” or “best emissions” also factored in. The Dodge Viper hit the Dyno at 541. Supra Hit the Dyno at 619. Well dyno numbers were useless when the Eclipse dominated the field with a 11.16 run

the examples you listed are more to do with quality of manufacture, and as i said before it is not a definite rule. Honda are very reliable no matter what car u talk about, whereas Chrysler are shit basically.

think about it, you have a 5.0 engine pushing 250 hp, so thats 50bhp/litre. now an engine can cope with that pretty easily yeh, no stress on the internals or anything. but if you take a 2.5 litre and tune it to 500hp, then it has 200bhp/litre, which means that each litre of capacity has to cope with the stress of 150hp more than the 5.0 engine.

Look at F1 cars, they string out every last hp (i think this years Williams makes around 875bhp) they can from a tiny little 3.0 engine. now you are telling me that they are gonna last you over 100,000 miles like many cars will/should. this IS an extreme example, and i cant stress enough that this rule doesnt always apply, but it is true in alot of cases.


All i have to say is. 24 hours at le mans

somebody plz stop this thread... i think my new thread is much more intresting... informative...and i guess it is also usefull :D

When it comes to a daily driving a car (ie: practicality and fuel economy) and track potential, you just can't beat what imports (whether 4 or six cyl.) have to offer over american V8s. Sure V8s can go faster but in this day and age the advantage goes to the import that can run 11s on the track and then turn down the boost and get 30 mpg. You get a v8 to run 11s or heck they could be running 15s they're still going to guzzle the gas.
Also, I think that because american manufacturors have such a huge displacement buffer, their don't have to put the effort into making efficient engines. Where as import car makers put a lot of effort into getting lots of power out of a smaller engine. IMO this makes american car makers lazy...
I mean look what happened when ford tried to build a compact car.... focus, five recalls in first year....
anyway thats my 2 cents....

PS compare the price performance ratio of a 94 vette to a 94 eclipse awd, i think you find that for 14 g you ll get ure ass whooped

I feel you on that nikki man thier are alot of asses that have seen the fast and furious sega to much lol. but like these guys said if they paid fucking 13-15 for a 2g then damn they got ripped if they paid that for a 3rd then thats cool but thiers no turbo lol. I'm stationed at dyess afb in abilene tx and its a very small hick town with domestics out the ass but they repect us like we respect them even though we can stomp a whole in everyone of them not running a 150shot lol. but the point is I feel ya dont let those guys give you an impression cause its the wrong one.later
mitch

Also, I think that because american manufacturors have such a huge displacement buffer, their don't have to put the effort into making efficient engines. Where as import car makers put a lot of effort into getting lots of power out of a smaller engine. IMO this makes american car makers lazy...



American car makers aren't lazy, they're smart. WHY NOT make BIG ASS engines so that they can be easier to mod and more efficient. That is SMART.

If you ask me, sports cars overseas are overpriced and provide a less bang for the buck than American cars. Take the NSX for example..........

Face it folks, a Viper modded out-the-ass will beat ANY overseas production car of similar price range that is also heavily modded.

'Subaru WRX STi'
$31,000
300 hp
0-60: 4.8 secs

'Ford SVT Cobra'
$34,000
390 hp
0-60: 4.4 secs

one thing good abt nikki is that he is patriotic :D American cars are good but they are not the best... as i said before the only thing in america that is the best is their salary :D

A viper cant even wipe my ass cleanly lol... overseas cars are costly bcaz ur american government puts a lot of tax on it... and seriously dude... my grandma drives that shit (viper) :D

Import----------------- Copied by American
Soccer-------------------American Football
Cricket-------------------Baseball
Turbocharger-------------Super Charger

alright, just to get it straight i'm not trying to piss anyone off. So hear it goes. I just bought a 94 vette, i know a few kids with gst or gsx eclipses, all of them paid anywhere from 12 - 17 for they're car, i paid 14 for my vette, mint condition, 60k, 6 spd. Now why is it they are all talking sh*t about how they can almost beat me after they're mods, which they can't, but apparantly they think a 14.4 to a 13.9 quarter is almost beating me. Honestly your comparing oranges to apples, if i spent the same amount on my car that they did on theirs they woudn't even come close. SO for those of you that like to compare your modded cars to stock sports cars stop it because there is no comparison.

I dont think they paid 12 - 17 for there car and can only run 14. Second, i think your just fuckin mad cuz they own your peice of shit vette and paid less than you. phuck ur vette!

What. stated ---
American car makers aren't lazy, they're smart. WHY NOT make BIG ASS engines so that they can be easier to mod and more efficient. That is SMART.

--what the hell are u talking about, you moron...

'Subaru WRX STi'
$31,000
300 hp
0-60: 4.8 secs

'Ford SVT Cobra'
$34,000
390 hp
0-60: 4.4 secs

--Your a fucking idiot if you think that the mustang is better than that STI in anyway. Everyone knows stang's are old school, and handle like turds.

--You domestic people need to understand that ur vette's and vipers suck ass. Who the phuck mods a viper? WHO?! How many modded vipers do you see at the track (you prolly never been to one). How many imports do you fuckin see (supra,rx-7,DSM's,honda's), running 9's and lower. There are guys in minivans beating camaro's and ur fuckin stangs. I have never seen in my entire 3 years of going to the tracks a camaro or stang run better than 12's, no one wants them. Let alone have i seen any modded vette's or vipers coming in.
--
--
--
Posted by spdymitsu - 12-06-2003 at 07:47 AM

Quote:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by n1kki6
everyone is missing my point here, my point is the fact that even if they did beat me they are still asses and don't know shit, everyone here that has posted something i'm fine with, i'm just had to vent about these stupid shits, so if you know anyone like this tel them to shut up. The point i'm making is that more often than not people are comparing there cars to a vette, don't know why but thats the way it is. Now even if they are faster, there comparing a modded car to a stock car. They seem to forget that i could have bought a 4k car and did 12 of mods and been whuppin some serious ass, but they are the ones still insisting i can almost beat a vette and there is no point. Who gives a shit, is what i'm trying to say.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hey, cut to the chase. You obviously feel threatened by the imports you've been racing, and you just can't handle the fact that a small import almost beat you're vette. If it bothers you to the point where you have to go on the internet and find a forum to rattle, by all means, sell your car and get some counseling. Bite your lip and face the fact that you won't win every race you run. Nobody does. You just can't face the fact that it is a 4cyl that is going to be the car to do it. ===============


-------Exactly.....

To the vette owner's: The import guys talk just as much smack to there own, as they do to the big blocks. :sun:

and to the DSM owners >>> the vette owners will talk jus as much smack as some of us do

but the DSM is a beter car
my own personal opion

chevy like a rock
stuck in one place untill someone throws it away

(sorry to all chevy owners no offence meant to u, jus had to say it though ) :evillol:

lmao woooooo cat fights but yea, i dont really like stangs, i mean their pretty old now, all their good for is spinnin the tires, and burn outs, yea they can probally do 40 foot burnouts as some guys in my high school say but how can that help in the track?




ECLIPSE4LIFE haha :naughty:

Hey, cut to the chase. You obviously feel threatened by the imports you've been racing, and you just can't handle the fact that a small import almost beat you're vette. If it bothers you to the point where you have to go on the internet and find a forum to rattle, by all means, sell your car and get some counseling. Bite your lip and face the fact that you won't win every race you run. Nobody does. You just can't face the fact that it is a 4cyl that is going to be the car to do it. :iceslolan


well said

There is a joke we have: Besides being a Supra, what is the 1 main thing that a 400hp supra, a 500hp supra, and a 600hp supra have in common??

The answer after a few guesses.

its an IMPORT!!!! :grinno:
and its rear wheel drive ( not that it makes a difference )

vettes are for guy's too poor to buy a porche, and too stupid to mod anything else... and my DSM rocks!!!

agreed :grinno:

i think i speak for all dsm owner when i say this. I dont think it has to do with how much money or how much trash they talk, it is a feeling of accomplishment. To be able to turn a motor with have the size of a vette into a vette eating machine is one of the greatest feelings you could ever have. Even if it is a stock vette it still feels good because we all know vettes are fast, but this dsm is faster.

I agree. I still remember the vipers (low-mid12s), turbo porche (11.9), Zo6, etc that I have beat. The best part is when they come up in the lanes to see what you have done, and its ont much. Then they say the car is so light. Ah, its 3400 pounds. Etc. In the case of the last Viper I beat, it was one hour into the night, and he went home after I beat him :) Its a lot of fun to surprise people. I dont win every race against the big motor/high dollar cars, but that doesnt make me want to switch. Its the times that I win that make it worth it ;) Its a challenge, and a learning experience, and thats what I'm here for.

'Ford SVT Cobra'
$34,000
390 hp
0-60: 4.4 secs

BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!

Try 4.7 0 to 60....

And you want efficiency then try this on:

Supra 320 hp 0 to 60 in 4.9

Stang piece of shit SVT 390hp 0 to 60 in 4.7

Big diffierence in power, small difference in performance

Like I said, lazy

But ford has one thing going for them IMO....

At least they've circled the problem....

its an IMPORT!!!! :grinno:
and its rear wheel drive ( not that it makes a difference )


The correct answer was : a 12 second timeslip.

You want efficiency then try this on:
Supra 320 hp 0 to 60 in 4.9
Stang piece of shit SVT 390hp 0 to 60 in 4.7
Big diffierence in power, small difference in performance


Supra cost $40,000......SVT Cobra Cost $6,000 less......
THE SVT COBRA IS FASTER AND IT COST LESS.

Give me $6,000 extra to mod the Cobra and it would smoke the Supra REALLY BAD.


Also, smokeurass stated that no one mods Vipers...HELLO!!!! You ever heard of Hennessey?!? Lingenfelter?!?

Most people don't personally do the mods themselves because the Viper is a valuable car and most people won't risk it. I don't think that there are many people that would pay $80,000+ for a car and mod it themselves.


ALSO......

The $150,000 Ford GT will burn ANY STOCK PRODUCTION CAR FROM OVERSEAS except the Enzo.

That's what you car AMERICAN PERFORMANCE!!!

The correct answer was : a 12 second timeslip.

aww really
didn't know that
thanx

posted by Butter:
"Supra cost $40,000......SVT Cobra Cost $6,000 less......
THE SVT COBRA IS FASTER AND IT COST LESS.

Give me $6,000 extra to mod the Cobra and it would smoke the Supra REALLY BAD."

i paid 7100 for my GSX let me have the next $32,900 in mods and i will smoke both of them. ;)obviously if you put money into ANY vehicle it can be fast. its all in what people want to do. do you want the challenge of building a light weight 4 cylinder that is fast, or go for displacement and build up some domestic iron to go fast. in the end we are all trying to do the same thing. GO FAST. it doesnt matter how we get there. i wish people would get there heads out of their asses and realize we are all building cars because thats what we love. it shouldn't matter what we build. and if someone is talking shit race. that should be the end of any debate. my :2cents:

posted by Butter:
"Supra cost $40,000......SVT Cobra Cost $6,000 less......
THE SVT COBRA IS FASTER AND IT COST LESS.

Give me $6,000 extra to mod the Cobra and it would smoke the Supra REALLY BAD."

i paid 7100 for my GSX let me have the next $32,900 in mods and i will smoke both of them. ;)obviously if you put money into ANY vehicle it can be fast. its all in what people want to do. do you want the challenge of building a light weight 4 cylinder that is fast, or go for displacement and build up some domestic iron to go fast. in the end we are all trying to do the same thing. GO FAST. it doesnt matter how we get there. i wish people would get there heads out of their asses and realize we are all building cars because thats what we love. it shouldn't matter what we build. and if someone is talking shit race. that should be the end of any debate. my :2cents:

probably the best statement in this post!!! thank you! now with that said just drop it... this post was started back in june of 2002 and was dead along time ago, was it really necessary to bring it back?? you could argue this forever and never get anywhere! read 95_GSX's post and learn from it! enough said, i'm out!

Here you go, buy my car from me and it will eat your Vette, and your neighbors Eclipse, and just about anything else on the street, looks stock, low 10's on pump gas all for $5K...Gotta sell

http://adcache.collectorcartraderonline.com/10/2/4/63380324.htm

Way to spam a month and a half old thread.

lol even if i fart ur car will break man... :D
it is older than me :D

:wtf: :newbie:

umguy:nutkick:


http://adcache.collectorcartraderon.../4/63380324.htm:boink:

I have only read the 1st page and dont know if this was said or not yet but just incase it wasent. you also have to rember about your corvette you are paying more in insurance and gas so concider that also in the cost of your car vs a eclipse. Also i bet ya any money that the mods for the eclipse are more readly avaible and cheaper. Like headers and crap like that.

lol plz check the date when this thread was started... dont reply to threads that is more than 3 months old... i know u got a point but this thread is really old.. DONT REPLY TO THIS THREAD :D

my american this, my european that, my asian whatever...

bullshit ...

ive seen
a chevy Blazer run 9's in the quarter,
a Lexus rip apart a mustang,
and a Cobra and a TA race and no one watching could keep up,
everyones scared of old Chevy Novas and I have seen a Mitsu VR4 that could outrun most cars backwards...
every people, manufacturer, and age has fast cars

Engineers are smart as hell. They know lots of math, and lots of information. Combustion Engines! Honda, Ford, Chevy, Toyota, Mazda,
American, European, Japanse, Chinese, lives in Michigan, lives in Germany... they all know how to make cars and how to design them. Some people made this first, some people made that first. We all enjoy fast cars and car companies enjoy money. They may not make them for speed to make their money, but they could all make them faster than any of us.

Engineers from one car company and another don't go out in the street and fight, in fact many have worked for Honda then later Ford, or Chevy and then Toyota.

No ones in the dark age and no one is super enlightened. No one makes things bigger cause the other can't, or lighter cause the other can't. Its all preference... all are similar and different. All can be fast.


DOHC isnt something new, Turbos were originally made for planes to reach higher altitudes, blow thru a straw and it will force air into your drink.

Everyone can be happy and compete without being assholes. We all know methods and prefer different things but all know the same. If aliens land on earth with 400000 HP 30 liter engines or 400000 HP 1/2 Liter engines whats the difference. We will all maybe get together and quit being assholes and race them. Or maybe they will come to earth with 40000000000000000 Liter 1 HP engines and everyone will still be assholes.

Stop bringing back dead posts.