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98 Ford Windstar PO171 code


Fordina
12-26-2005, 10:48 PM
We have a 98 Windstar with a "service engine soon" light that has come on as of a couple of days ago. We took it to Auto Zone and had the code read, and it pulled a PO171 code. I've seen numerous postings on the PO171 and PO174 codes together, but I'm desperate to know what's going on with just the PO171 by itself. The van has been starting rough in the mornings -- seems to be just when it's a little cold outside. It's been running fine, but upon starting it up in the mornings, if we just leave it running while putting the kids in their car seat, it sounds like it's trying to die unless we give it some gas via the accelerator. The Auto Zone people said the "system was too lean in Bank one." I have also seen step-by-step instructions with pictures as to how to resolve this issue with the PO174 code as well, but I'm really desperate to find out what to do about JUST the PO171 code on a 98 model. Please, please help!!! Single-car family!!! FYI: Please talk as if you're talking to a novice if/when any of you auto geniuses respond. We're new at this and are hoping for step-by-step instructions, but aside from knowing what the battery looks like and a few of the regular maintenance items under the hood, it's all new to us!....

phil a
12-27-2005, 09:27 AM
We have a 98 Windstar with a "service engine soon" light that has come on as of a couple of days ago. We took it to Auto Zone and had the code read, and it pulled a PO171 code. I've seen numerous postings on the PO171 and PO174 codes together, but I'm desperate to know what's going on with just the PO171 by itself. The van has been starting rough in the mornings -- seems to be just when it's a little cold outside. It's been running fine, but upon starting it up in the mornings, if we just leave it running while putting the kids in their car seat, it sounds like it's trying to die unless we give it some gas via the accelerator. The Auto Zone people said the "system was too lean in Bank one." I have also seen step-by-step instructions with pictures as to how to resolve this issue with the PO174 code as well, but I'm really desperate to find out what to do about JUST the PO171 code on a 98 model. Please, please help!!! Single-car family!!! FYI: Please talk as if you're talking to a novice if/when any of you auto geniuses respond. We're new at this and are hoping for step-by-step instructions, but aside from knowing what the battery looks like and a few of the regular maintenance items under the hood, it's all new to us!....


Print your letter( above), and the step-by -step on the 171-174
codes; take to your local GOOD mom pop fix it shop,, they could handle this in one day...

Fordina
12-27-2005, 10:31 AM
We may possibly do just that. My husband is very mechanically-minded though -- just hasn't spent much time under the hood of a car, in particular, as this is the first older car we have had that's had these problems. He said that if I was able to pull up step-by-step instructions via this website as to how to fix the problem, then he would give it a try. He's very eager to learn auto mechanics, and it would be extremely helpful to save the money, if possible....

Fordina
12-27-2005, 02:33 PM
There are step by step instructions with photos available and discussed on this
site and many posts that "point" to the location of the instructions.

I don't know if it is a beginner's job but search this forum for the
instructions.

If you are just getting the 171 and not the 174 I would say it is because
either:

-one 02 sensor is more sensitive than the other
-the leaks are slight and the problem is just begining
-the isolator bolts on one bank are leaking but still fairly sound on the other.
Or any combination of the above.[/I]

__________________________________________________ ___________

Thanks -- I have been to that site that you are talking about (excellently put together). My husband was about to begin the step-by-step instructions to just go ahead and repair everything mentioned on that site, but then we noticed that the site is only for 99 and later models. My questions are this:

1. What modifications to those instructions would we need to make on a 98 model? -- especially being a beginner in auto work?

2. Is there any harm done in just going ahead and doing all of those repairs listed on that link without truly isolating the cause of our PO171 code? It seems like, from the postings on this site, that we can expect the PO174 code to pop up here any day now so we might as well fix it while my husband has the engine dismantled....?

phil a
12-27-2005, 02:34 PM
We may possibly do just that. My husband is very mechanically-minded though -- just hasn't spent much time under the hood of a car, in particular, as this is the first older car we have had that's had these problems. He said that if I was able to pull up step-by-step instructions via this website as to how to fix the problem, then he would give it a try. He's very eager to learn auto mechanics, and it would be extremely helpful to save the money, if possible....

To make sure on my 2001 that is was a vacuum leak I sprayed
Ether,, all around the intake while engine was running and it DID
rev up every time!! (sprayed at intake to plenum)

Fordina
12-27-2005, 02:50 PM
Here's the site link I was referring to in my previous post:
http://leckemby.net/windstar/windstar01.html for any newcomers that haven't seen it yet....

Phil a, I'll show what you said about spraying the ether to determine if it's a vaccuum leak to my husband....

DRW1000
12-27-2005, 03:15 PM
I am not sure if the TSB for the 171/174 actually applies to 98's.

171/174 are caused by lean conditions being read by the 02 sensors. It is usually caused by unmetered air getting into the intake stream.

Fordina
12-27-2005, 04:20 PM
I am not sure if the TSB for the 171/174 actually applies to 98's.

171/174 are caused by lean conditions being read by the 02 sensors. It is usually caused by unmetered air getting into the intake stream.

__________________________________________________ ___________So, if you were in our shoes, would you just proceed with the leckemby site's instructions or do you feel that there is a chance that the 98 is so different from the 99 that we could get ourselves into a real mess of things...?

What normally changes on a model from year to year?

wiswind
12-27-2005, 05:47 PM
The steps on that site are ONLY for 1999 and newer windstar.
They changed to a different upper intake manifold in 1999 that had those problems.

One very easy check.....before you try taking anything apart. Give the PCV vaccum line a very thorough checking over. Start with the 90 degree elbow that is located on the top of the upper intake manifold....next to the throttle body. Mine developed a crack on the inside of the elbow.
Next, Follow the PCV vaccum line all the way to the PCV valve.....and make sure everything is connected....and that the PCV valve is seated into the valve cover. Next.....check to make sure that any vaccum lines that you can find are seated and not leaking. Do your heater controls work correctly?.....If not, this is a possible source of vaccum leak... This is because the heater controls are run by vaccum......which comes from one of the vaccum lines that is connected to the back of the upper intake manifold.

It IS possible that you have a vaccum leak relative to the rear side of the engine.....or that the sensor for the rear bank is just more sensitive.

If you wonder if the Oxygen sensor it causing the problem (Not likely...but possible)...you could try switching the "upstream" sensors from side to side.
The upstream sensors are the 2 oxygen sensors that are before the catalytic converters.....1 before each convertor. You can buy a oxygen sensor socket from most autoparts stores.
If the code changes to "P0174", your problem moved with the sensor. I would strongly recommend that oxygen sensors be replaced in pairs....so if you end up replacing one of the upstream sensors......replace the other upstream sensor.

Do not bother messing with the "downstream" sensors...the ones after the catalytic converters as they have nothing to do with these codes.
The downstream sensors monitor the "catalyst efficiency" to make sure the catalytic converters are working. The downstream oxygen sensor on the rear-most converter on my '96 was mounted into the rear part of the catalytic converter body....instead of into the pipe. This sensor mounting ring broke out of the converter VERY easily.....so be very careful around it.

If one of the sensors has a green stain on it....then that would indicate a coolant leak into the cylinder(s) of the engine. You will want to fix that...should that be happening. If it is a very slight leak.....I would put some Bar's "Stop Leak" into the radiator.
I have used Bar's "Liquid Alluminum" with success.

I have pictures posted (link is in many of my posts) of what things look like with the upper intake manifold removed. It is not hard to remove.....and you can then clean the upper intake manifold gasket seating surface on the lower intake manifold....and clean the upper intake manifold gaskets themselves. You will see them in my pictures. The upper intake manifold is the large black part that is on top of the engine. The lower intake manifold is alluminum.

While you have the upper intake manifold off....
Clean the EGR ports....and carefully inspect ALL the vaccum lines and connections. The vaccum lines are a very likely cause for leakage.

Autozone has some free repair information on their website. They have a link to Alldatadiy which provides much more information.

Fordina
12-27-2005, 06:11 PM
Wiswind, thank you for taking the time to go into so much detail on preliminary steps to take to test for the problem. I am printing your reply now, and as soon as it gets light enough tomorrow morning to see straight, my husband will be out there seeing what he can find.... Thanks again!

Fordina
12-30-2005, 02:50 PM
We found a vaccum line that wasn't seated properly, but the code PO101 remains. Does that mean that we haven't found the totality of the problem, or is there some way to re-set the code? ....Or does it take starting up the engine a certain number of times before the code resets itself...?

Fordina
12-30-2005, 03:03 PM
Code's off now!! In the process of trying to see if we might be able to re-set the code, we noticed that the ground wire on the battery -- the part that's attached to the frame of the van -- was loose as well. We reconnected that properly, turned the engine back on, and the service engine soon light was history. Now, I'm just curious as to whether or not the battery ground wire had anything to do with the code itself or whether or not it just re-set it or what after we had re-seated the vaccuum line on top of the intake manifold thingamabob properly. Anyway, a million thanks to you guys for helping us save big $$$ taking it in to a dealer. It turned out to be a fairly good educational experience for us beginners dying to learn.... THANKS!!!

DRW1000
01-01-2006, 03:44 PM
Disconneting the battery (even for a repair) will reset the codes. When did P101 appear? (Or was it a typo?).

If the problem has been corrected (and a loose hose certainly could have been the problem) then the code will not come back. If the problem still persists then the code and CEL will appear again in a few drive cycles.

If the CEL is on and one makes the repair the light (and code) will eventually clear itself after a few drive cycles.

Fordina
01-01-2006, 05:17 PM
Disconneting the battery (even for a repair) will reset the codes. When did P101 appear? (Or was it a typo?).

If the problem has been corrected (and a loose hose certainly could have been the problem) then the code will not come back. If the problem still persists then the code and CEL will appear again in a few drive cycles.

If the CEL is on and one makes the repair the light (and code) will eventually clear itself after a few drive cycles.


Sorry, it was supposed to be PO171 -- not PO101. We've completed at least 8 drives in the van since we hopefully fixed it, and still no service engine soon light so hopefully that vaccuum line was the totality of the problem....

DRW1000
01-01-2006, 07:42 PM
Generally you need the test drives to be what are known as "OBDll Drive Cycles." Most longer drives (>10m) that include some highway should do it. I have seen it take longer however.

If I had the 171 code and found a loose vacuum line I would be fairly confident that I had found the problem but I would ask myself why I did not get 174 too. Maybe the leak was slight and one 02 sensor is more sensitive than the other or perhaps the hose let more outside air into one bank due to where it was mounted in the intake

I would do nothing unless your light re-appears.

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