cylinder head necessities
sickcallawayc12
02-07-2005, 07:23 PM
Okay this is related to the valve cover repair post i made but thought it would be easier to make a new one since it's a bigger issue. I went to get my car today and we all discovered what my problem was with the oil light and what probably what the bang was i heard a few months back. Cracked cylinder head that was dumpin' oil on the headers. Ouch. Another month to get a grand together just for labor plus i gotta get parts. Obviously a cylinder head is needed (either 1100 sps, 400 something stock, or maybe even sps 3200 powertrain package) head gasket and a valve grind kit (they told me). What does the grind kit include? Plus, is there any other gaskets i will need or are there any parts that could be serviced or i could get new (like piston rings or something)? Will new camshafts be needed? I'll probably take advantage of the SPS intake manifold since it probably needs to be taken off. I'm thinkin of doing an overhaul on everything but don't know if i can get everything i need plus money for an overhaul in 2 months. They said 14 hours labor, which makes the labor total close to a grand. is this bs or not (not that i intend to try it myself, just dont wanna get ripped off). thanks for your help.
sickcallawayc12
02-07-2005, 07:26 PM
Oh and one thing i forgot: is buying a rebuilt cylinder head from like ebay or something recommended?
sierrap615
02-08-2005, 12:27 AM
i would have no problem buying a Ebay head, except don't expect to get the core deposit. even a junkyard wouldn't be too bad. not sure what they meant by a valve grind kit, valve grinding doesn't require extra parts to my knowage. unless they plan on replacing the valve train. also, do not mix used cams and used lifters, they produce a mated wear pattern. piston rings wouldn't be to much more of an effort. you will need the following gaskets:head, intake, exhaust, EGR, valve cover(96+), and RTV (oil pan, front cover, valve cover 91-95), and maybe the throttle body gasket. if you have a air grider, you could port the manifolds and head yourself, but maybe not to SPS quailty. labor rate in my area is about 95/hour so 14 hours would be over $1300. also don't forget the timing chain(i've said that before right?), and a few TTY bolts need replaced.
however, i think even i could replace a head in less then 14 hour with the wrong tools. this does not take an extreme amount of skill, you could do it yourself.
however, i think even i could replace a head in less then 14 hour with the wrong tools. this does not take an extreme amount of skill, you could do it yourself.
travelair
02-08-2005, 10:55 AM
Do all the work yourself. I have learned much about mechanics by doing my own repairs. You won't regret it. Anything is possible now that there are boards like this one to draw knowledge from.
sickcallawayc12
02-08-2005, 02:18 PM
Hmm. You guys have convinced me really well to tackle this myself. I'm pretty scared on doing this cuz i don't wanna mess anything up and stuck gettin it towed to the shop halfway through even though i have a chilton and haynes manual, then again, what could i get with that extra $1000? sounds like all those gaskets would be included in an overhaul gasket set from saturn of colma (saturnparts.net). I don't have an air girder so i will probably get the sps manifold but don't know about the head. I've been thinking of getting the sps head during the winter but not until next fall at least so i may just buy from ebay for now and save $$$. Cams, cam gears, lifters, are definitely needed from what i gather here, piston rings could be done too, throttle body and intake manifold can be swapped for perfomance counterparts (or maybe polished and bored myself if i bought power tools). They just fixed up the valve cover and put on a new gasket so I don't know if i still need to get a new one or not. If there are anything that can be serviced not covered here, i would appreciate the info, i mean, it would be good to take care of anything there that should be taken care of since i'm diggin deep in the heart of this thing. and it would be probably a good idea to ask what tools i need to buy to do this. i hope i don't need jackstands or to lift the car up, i don't know if i can handle that.
sierrap615
02-08-2005, 11:43 PM
i hope i don't need jackstands or to lift the car up, i don't know if i can handle that.
it will be really hard if you don't. the lifters and cams may not need replaced, but if they do, they need replace together. you oil problem changes everything, you will need to inspect EVERYTHING. since the rods come out to change the rings, inspect/change those bearing, from them, determine if you need to replace the main bearings. the only way to replace main bearings with pulling the engine is to roll them, common practice on diesel trunk, never tryed one on a auto. power tools will work for a port job, but air tools will do much better. i would get a new valve cover.if you do have any problems, post or PM me right away.
i suggest you post a detailed log on Saturnfans.com like Razorbak and 94SL2withphone. also for tools: http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48630
it will be really hard if you don't. the lifters and cams may not need replaced, but if they do, they need replace together. you oil problem changes everything, you will need to inspect EVERYTHING. since the rods come out to change the rings, inspect/change those bearing, from them, determine if you need to replace the main bearings. the only way to replace main bearings with pulling the engine is to roll them, common practice on diesel trunk, never tryed one on a auto. power tools will work for a port job, but air tools will do much better. i would get a new valve cover.if you do have any problems, post or PM me right away.
i suggest you post a detailed log on Saturnfans.com like Razorbak and 94SL2withphone. also for tools: http://www.saturnfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48630
travelair
02-09-2005, 09:06 AM
An electric die grinder will work well for porting though something bigger than a Dremel would be ideal. The air grinders are smaller and fit further down the pipe but the mating surface is the critical area anyway. I ported an old Celica and it ran much better. I had problems with the manifold studs and ended up replacing them with metric bolts. I drilled the heads and used safety wire to secure them because my lock washers tempered. I like to think porting the manifold made it run better but fixing the exhaust leak may have contributed. Good luck with yours. Worst case scenario -- you get it torn apart, take it in and have the job finished. You might even get a deal on the labor since you've torn it apart for them already. I don't know though I'm just speculating.
sickcallawayc12
02-09-2005, 09:49 AM
Okay, I will spend a good $600-$750 on tools this month and get parts next month (when there isn't as much snow in colorado). Will get jackstands too and maybe even a wheel balancer and such to put tires on myself. One issue is that my working area is gonna suck since it is on ground (not concrete) and outside, no garage.
sickcallawayc12
02-09-2005, 01:09 PM
Oh and i saw some posts on shaving the head to increase compression. Is this hard to do or is there anything i can do to increase compression like better piston rings or something in my scenario? I figure might as well if i get (and probably will) and air grinder.
sierrap615
02-09-2005, 10:14 PM
if you are going to do this not on a driveway you will need to place something under the car(plywood) or the jack stands will sink. shaving the head will require a machine shop to do the work, and if you are going to have them do a valve job, ask for a 3-angle(performance) valve job. 91-93 DOHC valves will also increase compression slightly. increase compression to much and 93 octane will be required.
sickcallawayc12
02-10-2005, 05:06 PM
All right i may just hold off on shaving the head and stuff; just concentrate on gettin her in working order again. I will ask them if i need a valve job; i gather it totally isn't necessary when replacing the head. Will try to find one with cams too.
97sc1sleeper
02-11-2005, 07:26 AM
<<sierrap615-labor rate in my area is about 95/hour so 14 hours would be over $1300. >> is that just to port/polish it? or is that the works?
i went down to a local speed shop and spoke to the mechanic about getting the cylinder head and valves done and he told me to buy a cylinder head assembly (300 cdn. prolly like 120 am) preferably the same year and for about 1000cdn he would do an 80 hour port and polish and a 3 angle valve job..and i forgot how much he said it would flow but when he called sps it was significantly higher than what there sohc ported cylinder head flowed and there will be more compression..also when i am ready to swap in the ported cylinder head it would cost about 120 labour.. he claims anywhere from 20-45 hp gains and 20-50 lbft of torque..to be honest i think that thats a lot better than an sps deal. 1100 american turns out to be like 1430in canadian..this works out to 1420 and more power..plus the ported cylinder head makes the car more reliable when your thinking about goin turbo or nitrous...
i went down to a local speed shop and spoke to the mechanic about getting the cylinder head and valves done and he told me to buy a cylinder head assembly (300 cdn. prolly like 120 am) preferably the same year and for about 1000cdn he would do an 80 hour port and polish and a 3 angle valve job..and i forgot how much he said it would flow but when he called sps it was significantly higher than what there sohc ported cylinder head flowed and there will be more compression..also when i am ready to swap in the ported cylinder head it would cost about 120 labour.. he claims anywhere from 20-45 hp gains and 20-50 lbft of torque..to be honest i think that thats a lot better than an sps deal. 1100 american turns out to be like 1430in canadian..this works out to 1420 and more power..plus the ported cylinder head makes the car more reliable when your thinking about goin turbo or nitrous...
Automotive Network, Inc., Copyright ©2025