electrical weirdness on 95 windstar
lordmundi
10-30-2004, 09:51 PM
The history:
1. The van had a car alarm installed by a previous owner. The alarm did many crazy things, and once eventually torn out.
2. Something was spilled on the dash (which made it to the fuse box) - probably coke.
3. Ever since the alarm was installed, there has been a electrical leak - you get a dead battery if it isn't driven for a few days.
4. The windows still go up and down after the car is off with the key removed.
Current events (No pun intended):
The power plug in the center console was only reading 5 volts. I decided to unplug and begin looking for corrosion or a short, thinking this might be the reason my battery is getting drained. Everything was fine and clean up until the fuse box. This is when I noticed the slight corrosion on each fuse.
Jiggling the fuse for that plug (I forget which one) I noticed the voltage go back up. Thinking these fuses might be the cause of my electrical leak as well, I replaced every fuse (except 2) and sprayed thoroughly with contact cleaner in each fuse socket. I also removed each relay and sprayed in there with contact cleaner.
After putting everything back together, I now have good voltage at the power plug, and my power locks work with a bit more "umph". BUT, the electrical leak remains. It appears that when I turn the key off, certain relays stay on - battery save (isn't that ironic) and delay acc specifically. Since these relays remain on, I can still use my power windows. Here comes the sherlock holmes clue: when I remove fuse 19 (GEM/Instrument Cluster), the relays click off, and when I insert it back in, BING BING BING - I get my chime back! The thing chimes telling me the key is in the ignition, the windows no longer roll up and down - it works like it is supposed to when the key is in the off position. As soon as I start it, and then turn it off, my relays latch again, and no chime, windows still work, and the battery continues to drain.
The question:
What the heck is going on here? Is something left over from the alarm latching my relays? Has anyone else heard of this? Also, I should point out that I did not do anything with any of the fuses under the hood - just in the fuse panel under the driver's side dash.
Any ideas would be greatly appreciated!!!
FG
1. The van had a car alarm installed by a previous owner. The alarm did many crazy things, and once eventually torn out.
2. Something was spilled on the dash (which made it to the fuse box) - probably coke.
3. Ever since the alarm was installed, there has been a electrical leak - you get a dead battery if it isn't driven for a few days.
4. The windows still go up and down after the car is off with the key removed.
Current events (No pun intended):
The power plug in the center console was only reading 5 volts. I decided to unplug and begin looking for corrosion or a short, thinking this might be the reason my battery is getting drained. Everything was fine and clean up until the fuse box. This is when I noticed the slight corrosion on each fuse.
Jiggling the fuse for that plug (I forget which one) I noticed the voltage go back up. Thinking these fuses might be the cause of my electrical leak as well, I replaced every fuse (except 2) and sprayed thoroughly with contact cleaner in each fuse socket. I also removed each relay and sprayed in there with contact cleaner.
After putting everything back together, I now have good voltage at the power plug, and my power locks work with a bit more "umph". BUT, the electrical leak remains. It appears that when I turn the key off, certain relays stay on - battery save (isn't that ironic) and delay acc specifically. Since these relays remain on, I can still use my power windows. Here comes the sherlock holmes clue: when I remove fuse 19 (GEM/Instrument Cluster), the relays click off, and when I insert it back in, BING BING BING - I get my chime back! The thing chimes telling me the key is in the ignition, the windows no longer roll up and down - it works like it is supposed to when the key is in the off position. As soon as I start it, and then turn it off, my relays latch again, and no chime, windows still work, and the battery continues to drain.
The question:
What the heck is going on here? Is something left over from the alarm latching my relays? Has anyone else heard of this? Also, I should point out that I did not do anything with any of the fuses under the hood - just in the fuse panel under the driver's side dash.
Any ideas would be greatly appreciated!!!
FG
Dngrsone
10-31-2004, 04:47 PM
Check to make sure your ignition switch is fully off. The Ford ignition switches wear down to the point where you can pull the key out while the engine is running and if you are in a hurry then you can pull the key and the switch is still partially engaged.
In some models the windows are supposed to be active while the ignition switch is off for a certain amount of time or until one of the doors is opened (in case you turned the vehicle off and forgot to roll windows up).
Fuse 19 is the power to the Generic Electronic Module (GEM). The GEM enables both the Battery Saver Relay and Delayed Accesory Relay.
The Battery Saver Relay is powered by fuse 29. If you disable this relay, you will lose interior lighting and possibly your power windows.
If you hear the realys click off when you kill the GEM, then that would be a good indication that the relays are good and the GEM is malfunctioning. When you turn off the engine and remove the key, open and close your door and wait. After a delay (I can't rmember how long, sorry) you should hear the realys clikc off and the interior lights will go out. If you are sitting there for more than say, three minutes, then your GEM isn't turning off the battery saver relay.
There is a possibility that all the alarm components weren't removed and something is attached to the always on circuit, draining your battery that way.
Invest the $15 or so on a Haynes manual with wiring digrams, this will help you isolate your problem.
Dngrs
In some models the windows are supposed to be active while the ignition switch is off for a certain amount of time or until one of the doors is opened (in case you turned the vehicle off and forgot to roll windows up).
Fuse 19 is the power to the Generic Electronic Module (GEM). The GEM enables both the Battery Saver Relay and Delayed Accesory Relay.
The Battery Saver Relay is powered by fuse 29. If you disable this relay, you will lose interior lighting and possibly your power windows.
If you hear the realys click off when you kill the GEM, then that would be a good indication that the relays are good and the GEM is malfunctioning. When you turn off the engine and remove the key, open and close your door and wait. After a delay (I can't rmember how long, sorry) you should hear the realys clikc off and the interior lights will go out. If you are sitting there for more than say, three minutes, then your GEM isn't turning off the battery saver relay.
There is a possibility that all the alarm components weren't removed and something is attached to the always on circuit, draining your battery that way.
Invest the $15 or so on a Haynes manual with wiring digrams, this will help you isolate your problem.
Dngrs
lordmundi
10-31-2004, 06:18 PM
thanks for the advice... I will probably get the haynes manual sometime next week.
I am pretty sure it is not an ignition switch problem - resetting fuse 19 without moving the key or switch at all usually brings the chime back, so I don't think it is the ignition switch.
also, I don't think this model has the window "grace period" you mentioned. My grace period to roll up the windows... is... well, however long before the battery drains :)
After turning the engine off and removing the key, I open and close the door. The lights come on when the door is open, and go off immediately when I close it. I never hear any other relays click.
What exactly is the GEM? Where is it located?
Thanks for this help!!
FG
I am pretty sure it is not an ignition switch problem - resetting fuse 19 without moving the key or switch at all usually brings the chime back, so I don't think it is the ignition switch.
also, I don't think this model has the window "grace period" you mentioned. My grace period to roll up the windows... is... well, however long before the battery drains :)
After turning the engine off and removing the key, I open and close the door. The lights come on when the door is open, and go off immediately when I close it. I never hear any other relays click.
What exactly is the GEM? Where is it located?
Thanks for this help!!
FG
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