Windstar from hell, brakes,transmission, bearings,noises

I have been working on cars for years and very few vehicles have given me as much trouble as this 97 windstar minivan with only 77,000 miles on it. It all started when I bought it from the previous owner at a surprisingly cheap price ( here's the hook). Ordinarily I would have thought this guy knew about this lemon before passing it on to me but he did not even know how to open the hood. Definately not a car guy! I took it for a test drive and it drove fine, no noises, no flaws, leaks or problems- everything worked properly.

Not long after I bought it ( within weeks), I came back from a drive and parked it. I walked away from it and went inside the house. A few hours later I went back outside and saw the interior light was on. I figured I left it on, but when I checked the switch it was off. I looked for a door switch on the pillar ( thinking it was causing the problem) and there was none. I started the engine and put it in gear and the light went out but once I put it in park the light came back on. I called the ford dealer and was told the problem is usually the switches built into any one of the 4 door lock mechanisms. NICE.... that would have been fun to find, instead I took someones advice and sprayed all 4 locks with penetrating oil and after several times of opening and closing each door the light went out.

I was about to take it on a long trip and decided I would repack and the tighten the rear wheel bearings. In order to grease the bearings you have to pull the rear drums, mine would not come off. After de-adjusting the brakes and I pulled the rear drums I saw the problem, there were only a paper thin brake linings and some parts were already metal to metal gouging both drums. ( you would never suspect this with a nice high brake pedal with no pulsations).
I then checked out the rear wheel cylinders and both were frozen. I replaced ALL the rear brake parts.

I decided to check the front wheel bearings too, there I found the right front to be sloppy and decided to replace it. While removing the knuckle, looking at the right front axle I noticed the gear ring at it's end for the ABS was split open and just dangling on the axle's end. I tried to remove the ABS sensor in the knuckle (before sending it to the machine shop for the new bearing to be pressed into) so that the shop would not damage it and found it completely frozen into it. You guessed it, I wound up breaking it to save it from them.... Ironic isn't it.
I checked the left side wheel bearing and it appeared tight only to almost seize and require replacement a week later!. While in there I discovered the front brake pads and rotors had heavy rust on them. Just for info, there is no rust on the vehicle at all or anything rusty on the undercarriage. I replaced all that was bad & broken.


After putting it all back together I drove it for a few days, parking it one day, I noticed a small pool of transmission fluid under the vehicle and saw it came from between the motor and transmission area. I moved it to another area and it stopped leaking. I drove it a few more days with NO leaks at all, I figured the front seal must have lost it's seal or had dirt in it and fixed itself. About a week later it leaked again and just magically stopped. Having few options at this point I tried some transmission sealer. I checked the transmission stick & it read full.
In the next few days I drove it with no leaks, thinking I solved the problem. ( Enter murphy's law here)

I then went on a pre- trip- trip. It was about 96 degrees that day. I drove about 40 miles and noticed a thin film starting to accumulate on the rear gate glass, the wiper would not remove it. At the next rest stop I pulled over and to my surprise the rear gate was covered with transmission fluid. I checked the transmission dipstick ( hot, idling in park and on level ground) and it read full. I though maybe it had been overfull to start out with and drove on monitoring the situation. I drove about 5 miles and came to a stop light. I looked behind me an it looked like an environmentel spill from the Exxon Valdez... Trans fluid puddles and trails were everwhere. Pulled over again checked the stick.... still reading full after I wiped off the stick & checked it again. I looked under the vehicle while running and saw fluid pouring out between the motor and transmission. I had it towed back.
I spoke to ford dealers, transmission shops and repair shops and got all different opinions. Some said it was probably a front seal, others said they had the same problem, replaced the seal and a few days later the fluid would pour out again. Still others said there was a problem with the seals and also the replacement seals that the manufacturers would not own up to. I took down the transmission pan only to find clean fluid, no metal and almost no particles of dirt, ect.... . The fluid had No burned smell.


Not taking any chances I replaced the AXOD transmission with a nice used unit that had 66k miles on it and was a ford remanufactured. It seems there is still a bit too much play when holding both axle shafts and turning one in the opposite direction of the other. This makes a sound like loose front brake pads clicking against the calipers when stopping or going from a stop. The brake pads and calipers, however, are tight.

I did not mention it earlier, but the first time I took the vehicle over 50mph (did not on the initial test drive when I bought the car) the analog speedometer needle would wildly bounce between 50 and 100mph even though I was doing 50mph. I was hoping the transmission replacement would also cure this - it didn't. The problem, I was told by a shop, is in the speedometer head.

Just after putting in the transmission I noticed the idle getting rougher and rougher and the engine stumbling after 3000 Rpm. I checked everything for the obvious stuff but found nothing. I figued the spark plugs may not have ever been changed so I changed the six of them.
What a horror to get to those 3 rear plugs, they had NEVER been changed! On top of hard to get to, they were frozen into the cylinder head. I finally wedged a block of wood between the strut tower and the rachet handle. I left a small space between the two of the and inserted the spreader jaws from my 10 ton Porta power!! That cracked em loose....HE HE HE. It had better high end power but was still rough on idle. Still looking into that... Any suggestions??

The last hurdle ( I hope) will be to track down all the weird thumps and clacks the front and rear suspensions are making. Even when going over the smallest bups on a flat grass lawn a 2mph it sounds like there are items underneath loose enough to fall out. I have SCRUTINIZED every suspension component I can find and none are loose, worn or broken.
I have read the posts here and elsewhere about front springs breaking, spring seats, seat bearings, stones and debris on lower spring seat,stabilizer bar mounts, engine cradle bushings, steel bushings mounted inside the frame breaking loose, radius arm bushings in the subframe, structural weld integrity in rear suspension ect.... being causes of various suspension noises.

What a pile of junk Ford has put together here!!! I checked and this vehicle has scores of recalls and technical service bulletins.
In summary this vehicle should have a warning label on its doors: Do not buy this vehicle before consulting your Psychiatrist and financial planner!!! Hoping a planet falls out of the sky & onto my windstar.
Chuck


12-28-2003 UPDATE

Just wanted to Update this post. I found my front end clunk!!!! After an exhaustive search I found it by accident. I took off my right front wheel and disconnected the lower ball joint just to further investigate that annoying clunk. Everything looked fine, I accidentally moved the lower control arm and heard the clunk. I heard it coming from the front end of the radius ( strut) rod that goes from the lower control arm foward to the frame. I looked at the bushing and it looked as good as the day it was new. I undid the nut and washer, took off the rubber bushing and LO and Behold I saw the problem! There is a metal collar that ford welds inside the frame that the bushing sits in. The cheesy welds had broken loose and that was causing that maddening clunk!!
I mig welded it back in place and the noise was gone forever. ( sanity returned). I took the car to my local garage on the engine running rough problem, after a bit of fiddling they still could not pinpoint the cause but felt that a new service called B&G Injector cleaning might help. They ran it and it worked. I looked for a website for B&G but could not find one, the closest thing that I think describes the process was this- http://www.yellow.co.nz/site/carbonclean/. One Ironic thing with that transmission leak I mentioned above. I put a new front seal in it from NAPA and gave it to someone who needed a transmission for one and told him about what happened. He installed it and the transmission was totally fine and never leaked again. I have since sold my Windstar to a guy that was replacing one that he had owned since new and had almost 300k miles on it and the trans just went. I asked him if he had any trouble with his and he replied "Never, and I Neglected and even abused it"!!
I have just moved to a white padded room where there are no cars.....all is quiet, I am happy.

What would you suggest I purchase if I am looking for a mini-van? Obviously not a Windstar... :p

Yeah, my neighbor's wife had a Windstar until the transmission puked the oil and caught the whole front end on fire. :screwy:

Seems as though you might win the Winstar sweepstakes. I have experienced some of the items you mentioned, but not all. I bought a nice clean 96 with 40k miles in 1998. It ran very nicely for nearly a year, then began to "pop" in the front end. The pitman arms, tie rod ends, brakes, and rotors were all replaced along with "tightening all bolts" by a Ford specialty shop. Didn't do any good. Now it has 132k on it and it's still "popping" and has developed a few other noises as well.

One of the matches we have is the rough idle/running. I also had the plugs changed (rear of engine had to be lowered and I don't have a shop). No luck, EGR valve changed - that's what code said was wrong, no better. Finally, the race shop said let's pull the upper manifold and take a look. Sure enough, it looked like a swamp under there even though they had done the "upper manifold cleaning" by running cleaner and air through it at a high idle. He scrapped the junk off the holes where the fuel goes into the cylinders, blasted it all out with air pressure, buttoned it up and WOW - it ran like brand new! Too bad we did all that other 'stuff' first. However, they had it hooked up to their scanner several times and just a good guess from past experience solved this one.

If anyone reading these posts has figured out the popping issue, I would like to hear about it. It's baffled me.

I'm thinking of buying another minivan - anyone have better luck with the 2000, '01 or '02's???

I would also like to find out what causes the popping or rather clunk in my front end of my 1998 Windstar. It primarily clunks when it is cold and I put it into gear, but it sounds like a spring. I am aware of the recall on springs, however Ford Motor assured me that my springs were fine. I/ve had new brakes and calipers put on. I haven't heard noise lately, but it's been in the shop so much due to the service engine light I haven't driven it much. I did not have any problems at all until I reached 75000 miles.

There are two main causes of popping in the front end that are not easy to diagnose. If you have checked the usual things and found nothing, then replace the outer tie rod ends. I have seen them make the strangest popping noises with no looseness in them. If you can get a mechanic's stethescope and a freind to help you then you can find out if they are noisy. Just work the end of the stethescope around to the back of the tire so it touches the tie rod end. Then have your friend jounce the front of the vehicle up and down. If you here a loud popping/crunching noise then the tie rod ends need replaced. If they check out ok, then put the end of the stethescope on the front strut rod bushing and have your freind jounce the vehicle again. If a loud popping/crunching noise is coming from either on of them then the metal bushing inside of the frame crossmember has cracked and is making the noise. Moog makes a repair kit for this for the Ford Taurus which is what the frontend of the Windstar is based on. I'm not sure if this part will work on the Windstar. I would recommend that for either repair that you take the van to a repair shop as a frontend alignment will be required afterward.

I hope this helps.

I would also like to find out what causes the popping or rather clunk in my front end of my 1998 Windstar. It primarily clunks when it is cold and I put it into gear, but it sounds like a spring. I am aware of the recall on springs, however Ford Motor assured me that my springs were fine. I/ve had new brakes and calipers put on. I haven't heard noise lately, but it's been in the shop so much due to the service engine light I haven't driven it much. I did not have any problems at all until I reached 75000 miles.

Ok, I know what's causing the popping noise.!!!! It sounds like bad CV joints only you need not be in a turn. I went through this drill--drive axles, had one bad hub bearing so replaced them both, inner and outer tie rods. None fixed the problem. I discussed the problem with a Ford parts guy who recommended replacing the subframe mounts. No way I said. It worked. Subframe mounts??? About $50 a pair. Incidentally, they looked just fine.

Replace the subframe mounts after all else fails. Promise it will fix the popping.

Seems as though you might win the Winstar sweepstakes. I have experienced some of the items you mentioned, but not all. I bought a nice clean 96 with 40k miles in 1998. It ran very nicely for nearly a year, then began to "pop" in the front end. The pitman arms, tie rod ends, brakes, and rotors were all replaced along with "tightening all bolts" by a Ford specialty shop. Didn't do any good. Now it has 132k on it and it's still "popping" and has developed a few other noises as well.

One of the matches we have is the rough idle/running. I also had the plugs changed (rear of engine had to be lowered and I don't have a shop). No luck, EGR valve changed - that's what code said was wrong, no better. Finally, the race shop said let's pull the upper manifold and take a look. Sure enough, it looked like a swamp under there even though they had done the "upper manifold cleaning" by running cleaner and air through it at a high idle. He scrapped the junk off the holes where the fuel goes into the cylinders, blasted it all out with air pressure, buttoned it up and WOW - it ran like brand new! Too bad we did all that other 'stuff' first. However, they had it hooked up to their scanner several times and just a good guess from past experience solved this one.

If anyone reading these posts has figured out the popping issue, I would like to hear about it. It's baffled me.

I'm thinking of buying another minivan - anyone have better luck with the 2000, '01 or '02's???
The rough idle could be caused by the Idle Air Control Valve. One mechanic recommended replacing it ($80-$100 for the part alone) or taking it off and cleaning it with a degreaser. Still waiting for my husband to do the same thing on my 2000 windstar, which incidentally also has the clunking! Hope this helps.

Ok, I know what's causing the popping noise.!!!! It sounds like bad CV joints only you need not be in a turn. I went through this drill--drive axles, had one bad hub bearing so replaced them both, inner and outer tie rods. None fixed the problem. I discussed the problem with a Ford parts guy who recommended replacing the subframe mounts. No way I said. It worked. Subframe mounts??? About $50 a pair. Incidentally, they looked just fine.
What exactly are subframe mounts? Do they have another name, where are they located, and where would I purchase? Thanks!

We have a 1998 WS 3.0L, and aside from the terrible problems getting the rear drums off, it has been trouble free to 91,000 miles. I know it needs front brakes, and one CV boot leaks a *little*, but aside from regular servicing and tires it's VERY reliable.

The WS is the "Taurus" of the van segment. Built for crash test and cost, NOT quality or durability. I would not buy another, new or used, eventhough we've had good luck with two now. Our "luck" is bound to change, for the worse.

The WS is the "Taurus" of the van segment. Built for crash test and cost, NOT quality or durability..
That's true, but the same goes for all domestic minivans. The venture & it's GM clones are based off the "lumina" platform. Daimler-Chrysler has been the only one with it's own chassis- as far as I know. None of them (domestics anyway) are build for longevity. The big three build & market them for the trade-in every 3-4yrs segment. You still can't beat a second hand windstar for a lot of van for the buck. I'd NEVER buy one new.
G/luck
Joel

Seems as though you might win the Winstar sweepstakes. I have experienced some of the items you mentioned, but not all. I bought a nice clean 96 with 40k miles in 1998. It ran very nicely for nearly a year, then began to "pop" in the front end. The pitman arms, tie rod ends, brakes, and rotors were all replaced along with "tightening all bolts" by a Ford specialty shop. Didn't do any good. Now it has 132k on it and it's still "popping" and has developed a few other noises as well.

If anyone reading these posts has figured out the popping issue, I would like to hear about it. It's baffled me.

I'm thinking of buying another minivan - anyone have better luck with the 2000, '01 or '02's???
Have a 2000 Windstar with popping, and it turned out to be a broken washer/nut on the sway link bar.(behind where it attaches to the vehicle) Advance had a univeral one to replace it for $24.99. Hope this helps!

just from seeing all these posts I thought maybe the stabilizer bar is broken between the frame bushings. The broken ends would flip around like a hammer and be hard to see while parked.