Hello, all! newbie question for a '98

Hello! I just picked up a '98 Windstar 3.0L with 130,xxx miles on it. It is extremely clean in and out. It's problems are mechanical, but I believe pretty minor, in the grand scheme. It ran pretty poorly, but you could hear it sucking vacuum a mile away... rotted pcv hose...repaired, and running great now..but haven't driven it enough to see if the CEL comes back on yet....My questions are regarding a few electrical "gremlins" these seem to be noted for. The first is the previous owner removed all the interior bulbs because the lights wouldn't shut off. There is no "door ajar" light or chime, the lights just stay on. (I took the time to run continuity tests on ALL of the fuses in both boxes, by the way, and all fuses are confirmed good.) I've read about the electronic switches integrated into the latches, but everything I have read says the light problem is accompanied by the "door ajar" scenario, which mine doesn't seem to have. Does anyone have any suggestions before i spend hours ripping doors apart? The second and third are the rear wiper/ washer and reverse lights don't work. Reverse bulbs check good, and the wiper motor works when 12v is applied directly to it. I think the lights may be the neutral safety switch,and the wiper issue may be the switch also, but I have read about the "GEM module", and a "rear body module"... (all the other exterior lights work.) Is there any way to test these before I start throwing parts at it? Would a faulty GEM cause these types of issues, or do they fail altogether, causing everything to crash at once? I thought I was stealing this van at $200, but if it's going to cost methousands to fix it, maybe not......
Any suggestions anyone can give me is greatly appreciated!
Andy

Check your door jamb switches. The rest, no clue..

It has two plug into it. Spray a bunch of contact cleaner and then hit the latch with silicone spray, then put the latch back in and reconnect the battery. You can see the door ajar comes on. The fuse box that the rear wiper motor in the intrument panel fuse box. Make sure the lift gate is closed and you don't have a door ajar light on to the lift gate. In one of the latches is the door ajar switch and if it saying the lift gate is open the motor will not operate

If the door contacts are clean, I'd hit a local junkyard and pick up a new rear electronic module (REM). It's mounted behind the spare tire "jack".

I would recommend that your read through the "sticky" information posts at the top of the main page.
One SUPER important note is to understand that the electronics in the 1999 is MUCH different from your '98....as 1999 was a MAJOR change year.

Also, the Isolator bolt information is not applicable to your vehicle for 2 reasons......it is ONLY applicable to 1999 and newer (they made major changes to the upper intake manifold starting in 1999)
Also, the isolator bolt issue was ONLY with the 3.8L engine......not your 3.0L.

That said.....the door/light issue will be very similar.
If it is not a door adjar issue....maybe the timer for the interior lights.......that keeps them on for a short time after you close the door?

Don't be so sure that the issue is not a door adjar issue.......the person who removed the interior lamps may have disabled the chime also.
On the sliding door (1998 only has 1), there are some contacts on the door pillar that line up with 4 (If I remember correctly) push-button style contacts on the forward part of the sliding door.
2 are for sensing that the sliding door is closed..........the other 2 are for the power lock in the sliding door.
The push-button switches can become mis-aligned....bent....will be obvious when you look at them......easy to press back into place.
Also, dirt can build up on the electrical contact surfaces (door pillar pads as well as the surface of the push-button part)......a little cleaning is all that is needed there.

The door closed switches are very common in causing your issue.......inside the front 2 doors (part of the latch) as well as the rear hatch.
Have patience......and work your way around.
One person mentioned the rear hatch wiper/washer not working if the hatch is sensed open.......if it is ONLY the hatch that causes this....then that would be a good place to start.
I don't know if the wiper is disabled only by the hatch sensors or by any door sensor.....never messed with it enough.

Use patience......and gradually work things out with your vehicle......don't let it overwhelm you.......when it does.....step back and take a break.

A lot of the pictures in the link in my signature will be applicable to your vehicle....as mine was a '96.
I had it until it was over 229K miles.......and I understand that the person that I sold it to several years ago is still driving it....and very happy with it.

I have pictures that show how to remove the inside trim panels from the front doors......and a picture that shows the location of the door open sensor switch by the door latch.
Cleaning is all mine ever needed.

I would make SURE that the pressure switch on the bottom of the master cylinder is not leaking.....it only takes a slight seapage to cause it to fail (fire hazard).
A new switch is very inexpensive and super easy to replace.
There is a sticky post a the top of the windstar room about this switch.

Many folks overlook the door jamb switch that is at the rear of the sliding door opening ... very near the RH rear wheel well. If your switch has failed, it may have broken in two and dropped out of sight inside the R rear quarter panel trim ... and you may be left with only an open hole in the door opening.

If you intend to keep this vehicle, I would strongly advise buying the wireing diagram book originally published as a Ford service manual. About $100 ...and worth every peso!

There is an easy way to tell which door is causing the door ajar issue. All you need is a helper sitting inside the van while you open each and every door one at a time from the outside, the door that won't trigger the chime when opened is the culprit. You need a helper because it's difficult to hear the chime from outside the vehicle, especially over the rumbling of the sliding doors.

Following that test you'll know which door is to blame but unfortunately that doesn't necessarily mean there's anything wrong with that door's switch or wiring, in fact chances are the switch and harness are perfectly sound. Further downstream is the fuse box, can it be the fuse? Only if you're very lucky. Next in line is either the front or rear electronic module, I have no idea which one of these two controls the door ajar system, but they are often to blame when these irritating issues arise. I suspect these modules are female because they seem to be extremely finicky and nothing is ever simple with them. Sometimes replacing the modules will actually fix an issue but also introduce new, even weirder ones. Like that guy whose brake lights were on all the time except when he actually used the brakes, which would cause the headlights to turn off.

Hello.. I was going to dig in today, but mother nature decided to rain on my parade... the trouble with not having a garage! Anyway, I went to the bone yard the other day and pirated a whole bunch of various parts from a '97.... rear module, lock solenoids for the front 3 doors, as they are "lazy"... they jump but don't fully lock / unlock unless you hit the button 3 or 4 times.. 2 neutral safety switches,replacements for every relay and fuse in both boxes, etc., interior bulbs....driver door speaker to replace the buzzing one in mine.....Thank you for all of your advice! I gotta find a manual somewhere... There is no door ajar light or chime, just lights stay on. Someone mentioned that they were possibly disabled by whoever pulled all the interior bulbs...where can I find the chime assembly? until I can score a manual, I'm flying blind...All the fuses are good...one thing I discovered on a shopping trip today is how the power windows will work until you open a door....open the driver's door, and they still work, open the passenger door and they stop .Big clue to a starting point for me....driver's door!

Another thing I noticed today... the flash to pass doesn't work. High beams do, though. I don't really care if they work or not, but maybe it ties into the rest of the issues to narrow down an answer? The biggest issue is the reverse lights, as not having them work is a safety issue, and they are required for New York State inspection. I'll try the neutral safety switch first.... what are the odds the junkyard units are bad, too? all things considered, pretty good! LOL!

Another thing I noticed today... the flash to pass doesn't work. High beams do, though. I don't really care if they work or not, but maybe it ties into the rest of the issues to narrow down an answer? The biggest issue is the reverse lights, as not having them work is a safety issue, and they are required for New York State inspection. I'll try the neutral safety switch first.... what are the odds the junkyard units are bad, too? all things considered, pretty good! LOL!

You shouldn't be too worried too much about junk yard stuff not working. Now that cars last longer and recycling is profitable many junk yards have evolved into large multi-tier operations that offer a warranty on most of the stuff customers cannibalize from vehicles on their lot. In other words you can purchase something and keep returning it until you get one that works. Also prior to purchase you can run basic tests on electronic parts with a multimeter to check continuity and such. My favorite junkyard is huge, it covers 400 acres and has over 100 employees. Obviously the self-service "junk" section doesn't cover the whole area but you can find at least 20 Windstars there on any given day, sometimes over 30.

I often spend hours on end there not only looking for parts, I sometimes go there just to be able to practice removing and installing certain parts without fear of breaking anything. That's how I discovered that the Winnie's windshield has to be one of the easiest to remove I have ever seen, takes all but 5 minutes using a guitar string with handles. Most vehicles on hand there are already standing on blocks (actually steel wheels welded together allowing for easy access underneath when you want to see how everything down there is made, for future reference. Taking hi-res pics is highly recommended.

There's pretty much only one place around here that still lets people go back in the yard... nobody wants to pay the liability insurance, I guess. The place Charges $2 to get in (how they cover the cost of insuring the place), and you have to be 18, and sign a waiver.You have to pay for a guarantee on the parts, but the prices are so ridiculously cheap,I don't bother... it's not a big deal. I would only worry about bigger ticket items, like engines ($99.99) or transmissions ($49.99)....I picked up a sh**load of stuff for $25.00, and pretty much got 2 of everything! The only items they will pull for you are engines and trannys, you're on your own with anything else...

I also failed to mention that cars were my life from the time I got my first one at 13 (a '60 Chrysler New Yorker Town and Country Wagon my Dad bought me for $125, and we worked on it as a project together) . You couldn't pull me out from under a car for years, until I started doing it for a living. After about 7 years of doing it professionally I got burned out on it, to the point I didn't even want to change my own oil, do my own brakes, or anything else. I still take my vehicles to the shop I used to work at for the bigger jobs I don't feel like or don't have the time to tackle.I have had over 54 cars in my 41 years, from many, MANY daily drivers(we'd buy them dirt cheap, beat them to death, then go buy another one!) to classics like the '60 Chrysler, '64 Valiant convert, '71 Vette, '72 RoadRunner, Volkswagen Beetles and a Karmann Ghia, '57 Studebaker Hawk, '66 Barracuda, '56 Cadillac Coupe DeVille, '64 Lincoln, and the last one was a '36 Buick Roadmaster, which I sold to get married... Shouldn't have sold it.. the wife is gone, but I'd STILL have the Buick! LOL!

Sounds like pull-a-part. If you sign up for their VIP club it's only $1 to get in :)

BTW 12ounce... I looked for a "rear" switch on the backside of my slider, jamb and door, and didn't find any sign that there was ever anything there... no switch, no hole, nothing...am I missing it?
Andy

BTW 12ounce... I looked for a "rear" switch on the backside of my slider, jamb and door, and didn't find any sign that there was ever anything there... no switch, no hole, nothing...am I missing it?
Andy

Not really sure about your year model. But on my '99, the ajar switch for both sliding side doors is at the rear of the door opening (not the door itself). The plunger contacts at the front of the doors is for the electric door locks and the radio speakers.

...or so I think!

There's pretty much only one place around here that still lets people go back in the yard... nobody wants to pay the liability insurance, I guess. The place Charges $2 to get in (how they cover the cost of insuring the place), and you have to be 18, and sign a waiver.You have to pay for a guarantee on the parts, but the prices are so ridiculously cheap,I don't bother... it's not a big deal. I would only worry about bigger ticket items, like engines ($99.99) or transmissions ($49.99)....I picked up a sh**load of stuff for $25.00, and pretty much got 2 of everything! The only items they will pull for you are engines and trannys, you're on your own with anything else...

That sounds exactly like the place I go, same fees, same age restriction, but I think insurance is cheaper in QC than NY because they say the $2 is to cover small items that customers throw in their toolbox and "forget" to pay for. Employees don't seem to give a sh1t about that, and I wouldn't either.

Buying a whole engine there in the junk yard section is usually done only if the customer wants it for spare parts or as a visual reference when doing major work on the engine they have in their car. Unless you're real lucky you won't find an engine there with enough parts remaining to make it run, 'cause most customers will remove (or destroy) everything in their path to get at the part they want. Transmissions however are usually in pretty good shape because customers either buy them as a whole unit or leave them alone. I bought two trannies myself, one of which looks almost brand new. Getting them off the engines wasn't easy though, took me like 6 hours. Didn't need them but what the heck, you never know.

'64 Valiant convert

Shoulda kept that one. I never liked the boxy Valiants but I know this particular model is now worth serious money if in top shape. Has to be the convert.

I said I never liked the Valiant but my first car was a '71 Dodge Demon that my uncle helped me rebuild back in '79 when I was 16. In the looks department there was nothing to complain about, the Demon/Duster/Dart Sport are the epitome of early 70's pony cars. But the ride quality and handling was awful and any engine bigger than the 318 was overpower, and lots of trouble besides just guzzling.

As for a manual......I use AlldataDIY.
It is a online version of the factory service manual.
It costs around $25 for the first year and around $15 each year thereafter.
I have found that it is WELL worth the money....and they keep updating it with TSBs (Technical Service Bulletins) and Recalls as they are released by the manufacterer.

Well... I put aside the less critical nuisances today, and worked on the more urgent stuff... The reverse lights, and the "mysterious clunking" from the front passenger side, which I figured to be a broken stab. link. I hadn't been under it, other than a "one knee peek", until today. Turns out to be a lower control arm bushing. I immediately came in and ordered a pair on eBay for $60. Everything else looks amazingly good! I was told it was taken in for the rear axle recall , and to my surprise, it looks like the springs and shocks were replaced with it! I did find the A/C leak... one of the aluminum lines to the rear unit must have been hit by some kicked up debris, because there is a small gash in it.(Back to the bone yard!) I can't figure out the reverse lights. Replaced the trans switch with BOTH j.y. units, and still no go. :banghead: Replaced rear module, ....nope...:banghead:There is 12v getting into the trans switch and van won't start in gear... bulbs are good, getting continuity from - side of light sockets to the body, but no +. Is there any way to test that rear module? All of the other exterior lights work.......:crying:

Is there any way to test that rear module?

Unfortunately we can't just throw in a different rear module in our van and hope it will fix issues, and this is why: you need to use a scan tool to retrieve data from the old module before removing it, then flash that data to the new module for it to work. Failure to do so will result in the PCM still using data from the old module even if it's gone. That's because the PCM stores a backup copy of both EM's (front and rear) in its own memory, if it encounters a module it doesn't recognize it will ignore it and use the stored old module data instead, repeating the same bugs over and over. Flashing the data from the old module to the new/different one also transfers the ID codes of the old unit, allowing it to be recognized by the PCM which will then allow the new unbugged (hopefully) unit to take over the duties of its predecessor.

Once again, I say leave it to Ford to complicate the simple :screwy:!!! That sounds like an expensive proposition :crying:!
If it comes down to it, I'll tap into the "load" side of the trans switch because 12v is getting through at that point, and run a line directly back to the backup lamp sockets (I'm not above doing the same for the rear wiper!), since I'm not restoring it.. It's just a pretty nice $200 family truckster to replace the '01 Pontiac Montana we had that was totalled in a broadside accident .I just want it safe, inspection passable, and to get from point A to point B. Plus, with 3 young kids, having the interior courtesy lights working is a plus. I'm not going to dump a boatload of bucks into it, but I don't want to hack it together, either....If we get a couple years out of it, that's great. I got out of automotive in '95 and have been an electrician ever since, so fishing some 16 gauge wire front to back is really no biggie...

BTW Windstartled... You're right about the Valiant... It was a nice little 6 cyl cruiser. It had the little 170 ci with auto. Couldn't get outta it's own way, but it really was good on gas. BUT... If I could have only one of them back, it would be the '60 New Yorker T&C wagon.Turns out there were only 624 of them built, and it was cool as hell! You could keep your '57 Chevys and '59 Caddys....It had huge fins with boomerang taillights, "astrodome" dash, 413 ci V8, push button auto, A/C, cruise, power everything!It also had the "panelescent lighting" that Nissans are touting as "new". Each gauge face and needle, as well as the radio and clock were layers of mica with chemicals sandwiched between, and when a high voltage is introduced, they glowed a beautiful blue. I got knocked on my A$$ with my hand under the dash reinstalling the clock with the lights on! It was a real head turner! Never see yourself coming and going in that one!
I can't find my pics at the moment, but here's one. Mine had a light blue top and teal bottom.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jacksnell707/5762075088/

Once again, I say leave it to Ford to complicate the simple :screwy:!!! That sounds like an expensive proposition :crying:!

It's not that bad, it is in fact a 15-minute job. I forgot to mention you have a choice of flashing the new module with factory defaults instead of the data from the old module. The point is to force the PCM to read the new module. Because these modules are programmable some people who have scan tools (it looks like a multimeter) will attempt to mod parameters without really knowing what they're doing and wreak havoc.

Oh... I thought that it would have to be done by the dealer.... I don't have a scanner anymore, unfortunately....When i got out of working on cars, I sold pretty much every specialized tool I owned...I just kept enough to do basics.Like I said, I got so disgusted with it, I didn't even want to change my own oil... brakes would be grinding and throwing off shavings before I would do anything about it :nono:! I've slowly been willing to do more, maybe I've mellowed since I've gotten older. The bug has bitten me again, and I've been thinking about maybe getting another classic project... when our house is finished, and we get outta this d@#$ garageless apartment! No more total basket cases, though! I'll take it to my friend who owns the shop I used to work at and have him do it when he's got time....He's a friend, but he ain't cheap...even with the discount he gives me :crying:.

Oh... I thought that it would have to be done by the dealer.... I don't have a scanner anymore, unfortunately....When i got out of working on cars, I sold pretty much every specialized tool I owned...I just kept enough to do basics.Like I said, I got so disgusted with it, I didn't even want to change my own oil... brakes would be grinding and throwing off shavings before I would do anything about it :nono:! I've slowly been willing to do more, maybe I've mellowed since I've gotten older. The bug has bitten me again, and I've been thinking about maybe getting another classic project... when our house is finished, and we get outta this d@#$ garageless apartment! No more total basket cases, though! I'll take it to my friend who owns the shop I used to work at and have him do it when he's got time....He's a friend, but he ain't cheap...even with the discount he gives me :crying:.

It's unlikely you'll need to have this done more than once. BTW most of the time in the Windstar REM issues are caused by humidity from water seeping behind panels and onto the module's connectors after someone left their van in the rain with rear vent windows open. They are easy to forget.