Windstar trans- any techs> know if

well it finally happened, 118000 miles The front pump or TQ let go. Happened in my driveway so.
Typical no foward or reverse.
Van has been great since I bought it new. never a sign of trans trouble.
My question is this to the guys who have done them.
Who should I get the TQ from?

Can you slide it out to the driver side enough just to replace TQ if you lower the Crossmember? thinking flat rate here;)

Is there any other tricks to pulling unit out?

for any help

Not to scare you off or anything, but I replaced the tranny in my 2000 Windstar and it was a bear of a job. I suspended the engine from above with an engine hoist, and disconnected the subframe. I realize that you aren't completely replacing the tranny, so you could probably have some success lowering the drivers side of the subframe and sliding the transmission down.

Good luck.

Mark

Hello,

welcome to the forum!

I don't think there is enough space to remove the torque converter. As Mark mentioned it is a hard job and the best way is to disconnect the subframe.

Best regards,

Oscar.

Thanks for the info guys,
I have built many hotrods over the years and a few frame off restos. I asked a ford tech and he gave me the factory service manual print out. It looks prettystraight foward. I will wrap a Load strap around the Engine and support it with a Engine hoist. HE says 98% of the time when they go like this it is only the Torque Converter.
So will give it a shot this week. When you said it was hard what was the worst part? What is your Mechanical repair history? I ask because I have been sweating doing this alone! Thanks

You might want to look into a alldatadiy subscription also.
That is a online version of the factory repair manual, plus all the TSB's (Technical Service Bulletins).

It is a access from under the vehicle type of job.
If you separate the transmission from the motor, you might read up on how easy it is to replace the rear shaft seal on the motor and the input shaft seal on the tranny, I'm too lazy right now to look it up......but if it is easy.....I would change those.

Of course, as you have a experienced mechanic to talk to.......pick his brain for any tips he can offer, as that will be far more help than you will get from a manual.
I DO know that there is a small metal shield that goes over the opening......slides up in between the motor and transmission.
When the tranny was replaced on my '96, they did not tighten the screws for that....and it made a nasty rattle noise.

Thanks for the info guys,
I have built many hotrods over the years and a few frame off restos. I asked a ford tech and he gave me the factory service manual print out. It looks prettystraight foward. I will wrap a Load strap around the Engine and support it with a Engine hoist. HE says 98% of the time when they go like this it is only the Torque Converter.
So will give it a shot this week. When you said it was hard what was the worst part? What is your Mechanical repair history? I ask because I have been sweating doing this alone! Thanks

The hard part was pulling the subframe and all associated attached stuff (brakes etc.) off. I used 6 ton jack stands just to get the vehicle high enough to lower the subframe enough that the tranny and subframe could be removed. It was a good 20" off of the ground (thats my estimate, I didn't measure)

The entire subframe is pretty large and cumbersome to lower with a standard hydraulic floor jack. Not too heavy, but just too large. Once its out, it's gotta go back in EXACTLY the same spot because if not, you're alignment will be off. (Although admittedly, your alignment will probably be off anyway because of all of the stuff you have to disconnect.) It would be an easier job on a lift, but who's got one of those? :)

As I remember it, there was one bolt that is extremely deep in there and it too me literally like 48" of socket extension to get a socket on it. It was on the lower side of the engine near the plate that Wiswind refers to.

On the Wiswind note, I second his recommendation of getting an Alldata subscription. I got it before I did mine and it was very helpful. (Although it makes mention of tools that you almost certainly do not have (bars that go from strut tower to strut tower to hold the engine in place, etc.) All in all, it was extremely helpful to have my Alldata subscription. It was well worth the $16 I paid for it. Actually now that I'm a year or two into it, I just have the 5 year subscription, its only $24.

As far as my repair history goes, I've replaced a clutch in a Ford Probe (horrible job also, because it was Front Wheel Drive) I've replaced many clutches in rear wheel drive vehicles and countless general automobile repair tasks (alternators, camshafts, steering gears, etc.) About the only thing I've never done was an attempted transmission overhaul. And frankly, if I never do that, I'd be cool with it. I replaced the entire transmission by myself. I did have a spare vehicle so I wasn't quite as rushed, but it was still about a 3 day job. If you worked constantly, you could probably do it in a long day or over the course of two days.

One last thing. I'd hate for you to pull the torque converter and then it doesn't fix the problem. Whats the likelihood of getting the tranny scanned by a tranny shop. I'm not doubting you, but I don't read too much about torque converters on Windstars just dying.

Good luck,

Mark

I knew several people who own Windstars. None of us have ever had a problem with the torque converter.

In my wife's 2000 Windstar, the reactive hub went south. That was last summer, about 120,000km

You have good information on the replacement from wiswind and Mark so you're in good hands!.

About my car experience... well I'm not an expert and most of the work I've done all by myself in my cars ranges from simple to intermediate stuff: water pumps, steering pumps, brake pads, shock absorbers and struts, fuel pumps, plugs, wires, radiators, pulleys, vacuum leaks electrical problems and sensors.

When I used to work with my father and my brother before they died we pulled the engine and transmission of different cars:
1985 Ford Econoline 150 (Engine rebuilt, new rings, etc...)
198x Chevrolet Century (Engine rebuilt)
1988 Buick Century "El Dorado" (Special Edition for Mexico, engine rebuilt)
1992 buick century (Fixed some oil leaks, cleaned engine compartment and rebuilt the transmission along with a new torque converter).
1997 Pontiac GP (Pulled the whole engine too along with the transmission when the differential somehow got screwed...)
2000 Ford Windstar (Engine rebuilt two times after it overheated twice :S because of a cooling problems, also transmission rebuilt and new torque converter when it started to shudder)

So in theory "I have experience" (or at least I should) in rebuilding engines and transmissions (my father taught us), but I've never done one all by myself... I'm more experienced with engines but when it comes to transmissions I only know very basic things and some troubleshooting but am kinda afraid of not assembling it back properly LOL.

Best regards,

Oscar.

Well I will have it apart on tuesday and see if the splines are shot in the TQ.
Several transmision guys I have spoke to said it is most likly the problem. They end up replacing the whole unit because they do not want any problems after they charge someone 1200. in labor to drop the trans. Labor rate here is $100. per hour in most shops and dealerships $120. So for a couple days laying on the shop floor and $250 dollars in parts what the worst that happens??

Well I will have it apart on tuesday and see if the splines are shot in the TQ.
Several transmision guys I have spoke to said it is most likly the problem. They end up replacing the whole unit because they do not want any problems after they charge someone 1200. in labor to drop the trans. Labor rate here is $100. per hour in most shops and dealerships $120. So for a couple days laying on the shop floor and $250 dollars in parts what the worst that happens?? I must say I have a 11. second drag car that sits unused and I miss my Windstar even more..
Also just was given 2 ford windstar shop manuals and it seems straight forward to do, Any problems with exhaust bolts? Also did axles come out of hubs easy?
Was thinking I may only pull drivers side axle since I will be lowering unit and not removing it from under van??

My exhaust bolts came right out. (Although, to avoid any real problems, you really outta soak 'em in penetrating oil now and every day until you get to it.) Axles came right out also. I had more problem getting to slide back into the hubs than getting them out, but even that isn't all that difficult.

I do recommend just lowering the drivers side, but you'll almost certainly have to loosen the passengers side to get it to drop low enough. They are fairly long bolts so you should be fine. I've seen posts of other people purchasing long pieces of all thread, nuts and washers. They remove the bolts one at a time and place the all thread in there. That way they can lower the subframe much lower than would be possible with the factory bolts. It sounds like you know your way around a shop, so you'll be fine.

Keep us posted on whether or not the TQ fixes your problem.

Mark

Well quick update..
Got the van in the garage today and disconnected return line from cooler to trans. Started up van and no ATF came out of trans. So I am feeling a little better that the Converter splines are shot since the pump is not pumping fluid. Will start teardown monday morning after it has time to warm up in there;)

Well quick update..
Got the van in the garage today and disconnected return line from cooler to trans. Started up van and no ATF came out of trans. So I am feeling a little better that the Converter splines are shot since the pump is not pumping fluid. Will start teardown monday morning after it has time to warm up in there;)

That sounds like a broken pump shaft. I've heard that this is common. I think that all you should need to do is remove the valvebody, replace the broken shaft, and change the fluid. (You do not need to remove the trans to remove the valvebody)

That sounds like a broken pump shaft. I've heard that this is common. I think that all you should need to do is remove the valvebody, replace the broken shaft, and change the fluid. (You do not need to remove the trans to remove the valvebody)

Doesn't the oil pump shaft go thru the torque converter which is attached to the flywheel (flexplate) which turns the oil pump input shaft, so you would have to remove tranny and torque converter to replace oil pump?

Doesn't the oil pump shaft go thru the torque converter which is attached to the flywheel (flexplate) which turns the oil pump input shaft, so you would have to remove tranny and torque converter to replace oil pump?

Yup, the pump shaft goes through the torque converter. I noticed this when I changed my valvebody. I thought that the shaft pulls right out once the valvebody is out.
The valvebody will come out by pulling the cover and removing the mount.

OK update...
As of today I have about 6 hours into this and I have the trans out. With all this snow I have been plowing I have not had time to work on this.
Well The torque converter splines are worn away. The input shaft is fine and spins nice and can hear the pump sucking . So i will pick up converter on monday from dealer. When you look at it you can see it was a poor design. Shaft is about 1/2 in dia. and looks like in only enters the converter splines about 1/4 of an inch. by the wear line in the shaft. The magnet in the pan was thick with metal dust from splines wearing away for 100k miles. no chips or other pieces in pan so I am hoping for a nice $350.00 dollar repair plus my time. Will let you know what happens next week after I install unit. Hope it is fixed since I am holding out for a new designed Flex next year.

I would replace any "normal wear" items around the area that you have apart.
I would also put a new in-pan filter in......it is the "felt" type, not just a screen.
The OEM pan gasket is re-usable and of very good quality.
I also recommend that you install a magnefine filter in the cooler RETURN line, the one that fluid flows INTO the transmission through.

You might give my transmission fluid exchange series of pictures a look (the link in my signature will take you to my windstar pictures).
In there, I show detail about how the gasket on the neck of the in-pan filter sticks up in the transmission......

When the transmission seriously acted up in my '96, back in about 2001 with about 100K miles on it......I did a LOT of reading, which is when I found out about online forums.
From many hours of reading, and feeling that I would like to keep my vehicle, I had my local FORD dealership install a FORD remanufactured transmission.
I got another 9 years out of the vehicle and over 120K miles on the replacement transmission before I sold the vehicle last spring.
I can certainly hear you on a shop being reluctant to do much repair and have the risk of a return for another problem in the unit.
Some of those shops that offer "rebuilt" transmissions at 1/2 of the cost of the FORD unit only replace what is defective.
My reading back when I was in the market for a replacement found me a LOT of unhappy customers of the cheap way out.
FORD replaces normal wear items and also makes updates as appropriate (1995 was the WORST year for windstar transmissions, and they were improved a number of times after that).

FORD issued a couple of TSB's that indicate that a major cause for come backs on transmission replacements is junk that has become lodged in the transmission cooler(s), located inside the radiator and (for vehicles with auxillary coolers) in front of the radiator.
This junk then flows back into the transmission causing the replacment unit to fail.
THIS is the reason that I recommend a magnefine filter in the return line from the cooler(s).
Also, the magnefine filters to a nominal particle size of around 30 microns, where the best of the best in-pan filters go down to around 80 microns.
Clean fluid is critical in keeping those solenoids in good shape.

UPDATE!!!!
Well today I started to put it back together with the reman ford torque converter.
Total of 13 hours from when I took it apart till tonight when I drove it!!
So recap, torque converter splines did strip out, change converter , seal,filter and refill unit total cost was $370.00 Trans shifts great so I will be keeping it for a while!! Thanks to those on here for their input it was a big help.

That's great

Can you give us a quick writeup on how you did it.

How did you hang the engine while you removed the trans
Did you drop the entire cradle or just 1 end
Did you pull the trans out from under the vehicle or just down enough to swap the converter

Any thing else that would help someone else doing the same job

I did drop the cradle out. I left the axles in the trans and pulled them out of the spindles. I also unbolted the srtuts and took them right out so I could have more room to slide trans out. when I did this I unpluged the ABS sensors at the frame since pulling them out of spindle leads to breakage. I unbolted brake calipers and wire tied them out of the way. I used a engine hoist to support motor using a 2 inch 3000 lb Car hold down strap around oil pan and not touching exhaust manifolds so they would not crack.
Worst parts to do... Steering rack nuts frozen, sway bar mounts frozen but I only took 2 bolts out on driver side and 1 on pass side just enough to get to rack nuts.
And the worst part was putting it back in, Aligning the trans with the block must be perfect since not much play in converter studs and the block dowel pins Almost 2 hrs. 2 floor jacks with a piece of 3/4 plywood 12" wide to steady trans.

Good luck if I can help more just ask.. Todd

Thanks, just what I was looking for. I hope mine never goes but it's good to know how to do it if it does. The strap around the engine is a great idea as is leaving the shafts in the trans.

Hope to keep mine going another 2 or 3 years, the spline striping out without any warning does scare me. Nothing worse than being far from home and having troubles that you know you could fix if you had your shop and tools.

Had a trans problem a few years back, was 900 miles from home and it felt like it was sliping in and out of OD even if it was not in OD. The tach would jump up about 100RPM and settle back to normal then repeat about 15 seconds later. Was sure I was done and would be junking it out of state and flying home.

As a last resort I purchased 12 quarts of Mercon V a gas container and some hose. Did the cooler line flush in the motel parking lot and it cured it. I now do it once a year, reminds me it's due to be done this month.

Thanks again, hope it's the last time you get to see the bottom of the van for a while.