I've made my decision on engine

Well, I have committed to purchase:

38887

38888

38889

38890

Just need to finalize payment - wait for it to arrive - sell of the intake and stuff -- order a few things and away we go.

Devin

:smokin:

I have heard some bad things about the LS3 and road racing. I would plan on a dry sump right from the start if I were me.

I have heard some bad things about the LS3 and road racing. I would plan on a dry sump right from the start if I were me.

Jim besides the oil pan -- what other bad things have you heard?
Devin

I frequent this forum http://forums.corvetteforum.com/autocrossing-and-roadracing-23/?id=23
If you do a search on there you should find it. Some of the T1 guys couldn't get the LS3 to last a full race. It was enough to chase me away from an LS3 for a track car engine.

I frequent this forum http://forums.corvetteforum.com/autocrossing-and-roadracing-23/?id=23
If you do a search on there you should find it. Some of the T1 guys couldn't get the LS3 to last a full race. It was enough to chase me away from an LS3 for a track car engine.

Yea, OK... I did the same thing with my LS1.....

I plan on purchasing the LS-B Avaiaid Dry Sump System before heading out for a serious day at the track.

Other than that, I don't see any issues with the LS3 Motor.

Devin

Dry sump or accusump is a MUST!!!

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/autocrossing-and-roadracing/2216993-ls3-oiling-problems-dry-sumps-legal-in-scca.html

Devin, are you going to have this on the road for Triangle Z at CMP in June?

Devin, are you going to have this on the road for Triangle Z at CMP in June?

David,
Since that's where she blew -- I am going to do everything I can. If I can get the dry sump purchased and installed - def - yes.

My wife is not happy at the moment - another 2K on an oil system may take her over the edge...

Anyone willing to take money on a weekly basis so I can hide my transactions and then order when we are whole? :naughty: J/K

Devin

You are talking my language taking weekly payment is what I do best. I am not in the tool business I am in the collecting buisness. I just sell tools to collect money.

You are talking my language taking weekly payment is what I do best. I am not in the tool business I am in the collecting buisness. I just sell tools to collect money.

:smile:

I sell datacenter solutions.... know anyone needing assistance with a large consolidation/refresh/design?

Devin, get a good pan(or modify the moroso with better baffling) and an accusump and run it until you can save your pennys...

The accsusump seems to be working fine and it gives you 10-15 seconds of oil reserve to prevent starvation. has worked well for me so far.

I frequent this forum http://forums.corvetteforum.com/autocrossing-and-roadracing-23/?id=23
If you do a search on there you should find it. Some of the T1 guys couldn't get the LS3 to last a full race. It was enough to chase me away from an LS3 for a track car engine.

Jim, in the feedback around the LS3 have you come across any good technical reasons why it has oil problems compared to say the LS1 or LS2? I see that the stroke is the same in all engines (3.62") but the bore size has been enlarjed with each subsequent version.

What else has been changed to make the LS3 more susceptable to oiling issues? I could understand this if the engine had a longer stroke affecting windage in the pan or the pan on the LS3 was inferior. Is the Corvette chassis just getting better to the stage that a wet sump is no longer cutting the mustard? Whats changed?

Kel.

Jim, in the feedback around the LS3 have you come across any good technical reasons why it has oil problems compared to say the LS1 or LS2? I see that the stroke is the same in all engines (3.62") but the bore size has been enlarjed with each subsequent version.

What else has been changed to make the LS3 more susceptable to oiling issues? I could understand this if the engine had a longer stroke affecting windage in the pan or the pan on the LS3 was inferior. Is the Corvette chassis just getting better to the stage that a wet sump is no longer cutting the mustard? Whats changed?

Kel.

I don't have the answers. The T1 class in SCCA is where the Corvette runs. When the LS3 came out some of the top drivers had major issues with getting them to last.

Here is some good reading on the issues with replies from those that have experience. http://forums.corvetteforum.com/autocrossing-and-roadracing/2462055-ls3-oiling-issues-or-not.html I haven't read some of the latest posts on that thread. I've already eliminated the LS3 for my Panoz.

It seems as though it's enough of a concern to avoid the LS3 unless you are doing a dry sump set up from the start. It could just be the Corvette pan but there are enough other options to not risk it IMHO. It makes a fine motor in my wife's daily driver Corvette though. :grinyes:

This is from post #14

I'm not an engine guy so I don't know all the issues with the LS2 and 3 internally, but I do know they load up the Right side head full of oil and a bunch of it gets puked into the intake. The oil simply doesn't drain down enough to feed the oil pickup tube. This has the biggest effect/affect on left turns.

The other big problem they saw especially with the LS3 is blow-by. The explosion within the cylinder literally passes by the rings and superheats the oil causing those ultra high oil temps. We saw over 330 even with a cooler. GM came up with a stacked cooler in series that kept it below 300. Without a dry sump, you'll most likely have do some type of cooler stacking to keep the temps below 300. If you have an LS3 and haven't seen those temps yet, it's because you aren't driving hard enough. It will get there!

My current oil cooler is enormous...a Setrab I think...12x12 or 12x16...whatever the biggest one they make...sitting right in front of the radiator to get a direct shot of cool air. The dry sump seems to limit the blow by some and helps to keep the oil cooler too. From what I've seen with this engine, you simply cannot get a big enough oil cooler...especially if you live in the south!

From post #22
To put it simply: If you plan to run an LS3 with racing tires, you need a dry sump...or a new Grand Sport (with a dry sump). NOTHING else will keep that engine alive short of some major internal mechanical mods. We blew them up for 2 straight years without a dry sump. Nothing else worked.

From another thread on the Corvette Forum.
Accusumps do basically nothing for the LS3 engine...just not fast enough. If you are running street tires, you're OK on the engine, but as soon as you bolt on racing tires, you WILL blow up that engine. I guarantee it. Plus the accusump does nothing to correct the incredible oil temps and oil puking issues. Don't waste your money.

When you get some extra scratch, get the battery relocation kit and the ARE dry sump. My oil temps at the VIR test and the ARRC were no higher than 246, the pressure was always between 45 and 75 psi and the intake had no oil in it at all...dry as a bone! I am incredibly happy with mine! The Phoenix guys did a great job...and there are NO leaks! http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:forums.corvetteforum.com/get/images/smilies/biggrin5.gif http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:forums.corvetteforum.com/get/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif

This is from post #14


Thanks Jim, really interesting. The oil accumulation in the covers is an old problem that a number of engines have and has lead to the untimely demise of lots of racing engines. We normally overcome this by using likes of an edge orifice lifter to restrict oil to the top of the engine, an oil restrictor kit (my 347 has these fitted) and if still an issue drain back lines between the cover and the sump. Oil getting into the intake could well be the death knell for engines with this issue as the oil could cause detonation failure due dilution of the intake charge. On engines really prone to this (my last race cars Holden 308 for one) a dry sump is the answer.

The blow by causing high oil temps is a new one on me. Not saying it is not the cause but have just not seen this identified as a factor before in high oil temps. This should be pretty obvious (if real) as the engine would be breathing lots out the covers. Has anyone explored this more - piston design, different rings etc? Cant be hard to fix as its not like the LS3 will have world leading BMEP figures, I am sure.

And what is wrong with a good old Ford engine? Hmmmm....actually I believe I blew them up too until we dry sumped it. Ok so I guess the real answer is we all bought a dedicated race car so why skimp on the oiling system? Dry Sump and safety equipment!!!!

Well, my plans may change yet again:
1.) Jack A_ _ with the motor called me with bait and switch, claims he has another buyer for more money - even though we had agreed on wire transfer tomorrow AM and he PROMISED that it was mine...

SO, now I have a line on an 07 LS7 with 8k miles - needs pan, pump, rockers and timing cover - other than that, based on early pictures, it looks immaculate - researching that one..

More to follow.

Guys - great information -- I really appreciate the feedback and input.
Devin

OK - so here is the final, over and done and on order as of this morning:

38937

LSX376 TECH SPECS
Part Number: 19171049
Engine Type: LSX Series Gen IV Small-Block V-8
Displacement (cu in): 376 cu in (6.2L)
Bore X Stroke (in): 4.06 x 3.62 (103.25 x 92 mm)
Block (P/N 19243171): LSX cast-iron with 6-bolt. cross-bolted main caps.
Crankshaft (P/N 12597569): Nodular iron
Connecting Rods (P/N 12607475): Powdered metal
Pistons (P/N 12166957): Forged aluminum
Camshaft Type (P/N 12603844): Hydraulic roller
Valve Lift (in): 0.551" intake / 0.522" exhaust
Camshaft Duration (@0.050 in ): 204deg intake / 211deg exhaust
Cylinder Heads (P/N 12615879): Aluminum L92 style port, with "as cast" 68cc chambers
Valve Size (in): 2.16 Intake / 1.59 exhaust
Compression ratio: 9.0:1
Rocker Arms (P/N 12569167 int): Investment-cast, roll trunnion
Rocker Arms (P/N 10214664 exh): Investment-cast, roll trunnion
Rocker Arm Ratio: 1.7:1
Recommended Fuel: 92 octane
Maximum Recommended RPM: 6600
Retuctor Wheel: 58X
Balanced: Internal

Block (P/N 19243171): LSX cast-iron with 6-bolt. cross-bolted main caps.

cast iron? Really?

cast iron? Really?

Really.

Block (P/N 19243171): LSX cast-iron with 6-bolt. cross-bolted main caps.

cast iron? Really?

cast iron? Really?

It's not that much heavier than the Aluminum block and still less weight than the original 4.6L that was in there.

Devin

OK - so here is the final, over and done and on order as of this morning:

Nice one Devin, that should do the trick. What cam/manifold/carb will you run? I guess the ones that came off your old engine? Are you still planning to dry sump the engine? I see similar LSX376's (with a cam change are rated at up to 515hp and up to 475ftlbs of torque. Nice gains for little effort.

Kel.

Nice one Devin, that should do the trick. What cam/manifold/carb will you run? I guess the ones that came off your old engine? Are you still planning to dry sump the engine? I see similar LSX376's (with a cam change are rated at up to 515hp and up to 475ftlbs of torque. Nice gains for little effort.

Kel.
Thanks Kel - I see they put these in the Holden's as well... thought you might be familiar with those...

On the Cam, I am going to leave the GM Cam in for now, want to learn the car and get a feel for the new HP.
Intake, I will more than likely go with the victor jr from Edlebrock
Carb, still have the trusty ole Barry Grant Mighty Demon that Brian sold me.

After break in and re-familiarization -- it's anywhere but up from there.

Thanks Kel - I see they put these in the Holden's as well... thought you might be familiar with those...

On the Cam, I am going to leave the GM Cam in for now, want to learn the car and get a feel for the new HP.
Intake, I will more than likely go with the victor jr from Edlebrock
Carb, still have the trusty ole Barry Grant Mighty Demon that Brian sold me.

After break in and re-familiarization -- it's anywhere but up from there.

Yes there are tons of LS motors prowling around NZ strets in Holden Commodores. There is reasonable aftermarket "tweeking" suport for them as well.

I think the Victor Junior will be a good long term choice Devon but will probably not give of its best until you do the cam swap. Victor style manifolds work best from 3500 - 4000 up from my experience.

I learned a new trick with Demon carbs the other day. When we track tested the 347 the engine was cutting out when under hard breaking at the end of the main straight. We have now fitted a tube across (has notches in the top to vent to atmosphere) between the bowl vents to prevent any fuel surging out of the secondary vent and flooding the engine while pulling braking G's. Have now dynoed with this on buthave yet to track test. Will let you know if it cures the problem as with slicks fitted could also occur for you.

Kel.

Kel - do you have any pictures of the tube you did for the carb -- interested.

thanks

Kel - do you have any pictures of the tube you did for the carb -- interested.

thanks

Not as yet Devin. I will track test then take a pic and post if it cures the problem.

Kel.

Iron block is about 80lbs more than the aluminum one.... LS3s don't like road racing for some reason... not sure if they redesigned the pickup tube. I know Chris Ingle had issues in T1 and GM developed a "new" oil pan for him that looked much like the old batwing pans on the C5s. I know that all of the T1 cars Phoenix builds now have dry-sump setups.

I know that me and various friends have been been beating the snot out of LS1s and LS6s with nothing more than adding an extra 3/4 quart of oil and an oil cooler for years w/o issue.

Best of luck w/ the new setup :)

Devin, the two tubes that stick out of the top of the carb already... (there are only two) with the ends cut at a 45 degree angle, he saying he basically made an upside down U pipe with holes in the top, this will still vent the bowls, but not let gas spill out...

With the said, i bought a carb from Pro-systems, it was equal in price to a decent Demon carb, and has been FLAWLESS!, I gave him my engine specs he built the carb, I dropped it on, dyno checked it and did not have to tweak a single jet size!

It is a great, TRUE race carb! I HIGHLY recommend one!

Devin, the two tubes that stick out of the top of the carb already... (there are only two) with the ends cut at a 45 degree angle, he saying he basically made an upside down U pipe with holes in the top, this will still vent the bowls, but not let gas spill out...

With the said, i bought a carb from Pro-systems, it was equal in price to a decent Demon carb, and has been FLAWLESS!, I gave him my engine specs he built the carb, I dropped it on, dyno checked it and did not have to tweak a single jet size!

It is a great, TRUE race carb! I HIGHLY recommend one!

Yup, thats the mod Devin. The Mighty Demons do have an anti surge contraption (vent whistle) in the top of the float bowl to prevent surge but it is possible that this is being swamped. Braking area that this is happening in is a stop from 145mph down to 35mph.

Eric, not sure what price you pay for a Pro Systems carb but the Mighty Demon I am using was USD$250 on E Bay and was practically new when purchased. Have used Demon carbs on a number of race engines now and this is the first time I have had to contemplate modifying one. Problem may still turn out to be something else so I wouldnt go modifying your carb just yet Devin!

Kel.

:o) with the 3 items left to purchase
1.) Intake
2.) Oil Pan
3.) Headers
I don't think I can honestly tell my wife that I am buying a new carb...I will use the BG Mighty Demon until it fails me.

Eric - thanks for the information on the tube - that makes sense.
Kel - would love your feedback when you track -- not sure I had this issue, but you never know.

:o) with the 3 items left to purchase
1.) Intake
2.) Oil Pan
3.) Headers
I don't think I can honestly tell my wife that I am buying a new carb...I will use the BG Mighty Demon until it fails me.

Eric - thanks for the information on the tube - that makes sense.
Kel - would love your feedback when you track -- not sure I had this issue, but you never know.

Ah yes, the thing that every loving wife wants to hear from hubby first thing in the morning.............by the way dear, I need to buy a new race carb today...........NOT!!

What pan are you buying Devin? Are you going dry sump or not? On the header front Devin, take the time to build equal length headers, you will not regret it.

So, did you stick with the LS3?

and devin, you only drove like 4 laps! ;-)

Kel, I paid @ $600 for the carb, which is @ $60 more than I paid for the Pro-Form carb I tried first, (that carb may have been ok, but it was a vacuum secondary and wasnt working properly)


header project, that's what I am working on now/soon...

So, did you stick with the LS3?

and devin, you only drove like 4 laps! ;-)

Kel, I paid @ $600 for the carb, which is @ $60 more than I paid for the Pro-Form carb I tried first, (that carb may have been ok, but it was a vacuum secondary and wasnt working properly)


header project, that's what I am working on now/soon...

$600 for a custom race carb seems like a pretty good deal to me Eric. As you have probably figured out I am an avid buyer of used race parts to keep things affordable. Having said that there are a couple of things worth buying new in my view and these are the cam and carb. Will maybe look at that option next time around.

Kel.

You guys have me scared to death.
I got my LS2 engine built and am ready to put it in the car and now I’m hearing I’ll blow up the engine unless I spend $4000 on a dry sump, wife will just love to hear this!!!
So, is there another way out? Right now I have a Moroso oil pan, it looks like a drag pan with some small side wings. Anyway, on my Cobra, I had a 392W motor and started to modify the stock oil pan by adding a circle track pan modification kit from Speedway Motors. This kit comes with 2 sheet metal wings and trap doors that you cut and weld to a stock pan to add capacity and trap doors to prevent oil from leaving the center of the pan on high G’s. Our Panoz’s have plenty of room for this pan modification and it would add about 3 quarts of oil capacity to the 7 quart Moroso pan.
If you have to have a dry sump to make an LS motor work, so be it, but coming up with another $4000 will slow down getting back to the track.
Thoughts? :runaround:
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Small-Block-Chevy-Claimer-Oil-Pan-Kits,3512.html

Kel, I am an AVID cheapskate myself, I historically buy ALL my parts used when possible, except for brakes and internal engine parts. But I learned hard lessons and sometimes its best to start with the right tool for the job!


Paul, per our discussion on LS1tech, at MINUMUM I would do an accusump setup, they can be had on ebay for $ $350 for a full 3qt setup, just add braided hose and a back flow valve.

It's a much easier sell to the wife(or easier to hide from the wife in devin's case than $4000! -D

I didn't understand the comment up in the post about the "accusump not being fast enough". I would think an accusump with the electronic valve would be ready to supply 3 qts of oil in an instant, thats what they are designed for. Accusump was the direction I was heading, I could also add the additional oil pan capacity with G-load doors for some extra safety. Most of us are cheap and restricted by budget, otherwise we hould have a team building and servicing our cars and we would fly in to the events in our G4's, but that's not going to happen.
By the way, do you have a source on used race parts other than LS1tech, RacingJunk.com,and ebay?

I didn't understand the comment up in the post about the "accusump not being fast enough". I would think an accusump with the electronic valve would be ready to supply 3 qts of oil in an instant, thats what they are designed for. Accusump was the direction I was heading, I could also add the additional oil pan capacity with G-load doors for some extra safety. Most of us are cheap and restricted by budget, otherwise we hould have a team building and servicing our cars and we would fly in to the events in our G4's, but that's not going to happen.
By the way, do you have a source on used race parts other than LS1tech, RacingJunk.com,and ebay?

I would like to see some debate on the capability of Accusumps. I have used one before when I had a car with limited sump capacity and not a lot of room for sump mods.

I am not convinced however that an Accusump is even a close substitute for a dry sump. I see them as a band aid that will help but not alleviate the real problem. I say this as an Accusump will push oil into the engine when a low pressure situation arises. The low pressure situation arises when the pickup in the sump is momentarily uncovered and the oil pump gulps some air. This air still has to travel through the engine oiling system so there will still be some bearing degredation (due to momentary interuption of the oiling pressure wedge around the bearing) but not as much as if the Accusump did not push oil in.

A dry sump on the other hand addresses the root cause by keeping the oil supply to the pump and hence bearings constant by not allowing the pickup to be exposed at any time.

I think an Accusump will help for momentary situations for a period of time but at some point a failure is likely to occur if the engine is continually operated in a starvation situation.

Lets see some debate on this.

Kel.

Paul, go with a different pan or at least a different baffle - the moroso is a drag pan and baffled front/rear -- ask me why I won't use this one again, even with an accusump setup (see Kel's comment).

Kel - your points are valid, very valid - but in the end, the dry sump is a band aid too and not what I could call a fix for the real issue.... so, the question is - why does the oil not drain/flow in high G corners - is it a valley issue? Is it a pump and baffle design issue combined? If there was a hi-flow pump and a properly baffled pan with proper drain back to the pan - would that not solve the real issue? debate continues...

I am going initially with the accusump for break in timeframes - I especially like the EPC and the "oiling" design feature prior to engine startup - really nice for a motor that's never had a drop of oil in it.

Once the engine is past it's breaking in period, Ill install the dry sump for the best of the band aid fixes. Wife has approved the concept!! woo hoo.

Paul, I have a line on a brand new Aviaid system for 2300.00 - reach out to those guys - http://www.aviaid.com/ look at the LS-C system.

So, did you stick with the LS3?

and devin, you only drove like 4 laps! ;-)

Kel, I paid @ $600 for the carb, which is @ $60 more than I paid for the Pro-Form carb I tried first, (that carb may have been ok, but it was a vacuum secondary and wasnt working properly)


header project, that's what I am working on now/soon...

Eric - correction:
It was a fun filled - 3 - laps..... :runaround:
LOL

I would not consider a proper dry sump a band aid. It is the appropriate oiling system for any engine subject to high G's. If oil is not flowing out of the valley or valve covers, scavenge lines should be run from those areas. That's kind of the idea behind a dry sump. Pump the oil out of the areas it is accumulating to a reservoir that will have oil available for the pump regardless of the G load. I think that having oil drain back by gravity to a pan at the bottom of the engine is more of a band aid.

I ran my C5 Z06 for about 10k miles on the track without an oiling issue. Just the standard over fill. Are the LS6 crate motors no longer available? My current 5.0 doesn't care about oil. I get the red flashing light in 17 almost every lap. It must be made of industructium. I guess that's what happens when your waiting for the current motor to blow up before you upgrade.....

I ran my C5 Z06 for about 10k miles on the track without an oiling issue. Just the standard over fill. Are the LS6 crate motors no longer available? My current 5.0 doesn't care about oil. I get the red flashing light in 17 almost every lap. It must be made of industructium. I guess that's what happens when your waiting for the current motor to blow up before you upgrade....

Jim, the industructium made me chuckle out loud on the elevator - got some strange stares ... too funny.

Devin

the industructium made me chuckle out loud on the elevator

Better then being made of Unobtanium. That stuffs impossible to get, even if you happen to have enough money.

Kel: thanks for the thoughts.
Devin: so how did you sell the wife on the dry sump? I will need some help there.
Jim: We have used the term "Unobtanium" for 40 years at Pratt Whitney as that special material that would solve every problem, but when I heard Unobtanium in the Avatar movie as the material they were mining I couldn't keep from laughing. Of course no one else in the movie thought that was funny, and they sort of looked at me strange.

So the real question is how to get a low cost dry sump. Off to find out.

LOL I'm in agreement w/ Jim on this one... :)

LOL I'm in agreement w/ Jim on this one... :)

So the real question is how to get a low cost dry sump. Off to find out.

There's a real slick LS dry sump set up that has the pump mounted right to the pan. All of the pan scavange lines are machined into the pan. This avoids the problems and expense of a mount and scavenge lines in one solution.

Jim, your are killing me, so who is the supplier, I'm diying to know, so I can see how much begging I'm going to have to do with the wife. :):confused:

I just stopped by Total Engine Concepts here in town, he is a complete engine developing, building, and machining facility located in Riviera Beach, Florida. Specializing in both domestic and foreign engines including the GM GEN III for road race, circle track, and drag race applications,we are equipped to deliver. His engines have won races including the prestigious 24 Hours of Daytona to local circle track races in your area. He is the custom engine supplier for the Mosler MT900 in both the US and Europe. With over 45 years of performance engine building experience, his staff can develop your engine program or rebuild your current race engine. Our DTS engine dyno facility can can handle 1500 ft/lbs of torque and 2000 horse power, both fuel injected and carbureted.
Anyway, his suggestion was to run, not walk to Aviaid and get the LS-C dry sump and put all the worries about oil starvation behind us. The LS-C package is $2700.
So I guess i need to save my $$'s or sell a kidney. Anybody need one, I guess we have 2, so maybe I could let one go for say $2700, plus shipping and handling.

Jim, your are killing me, so who is the supplier, I'm diying to know, so I can see how much begging I'm going to have to do with the wife. :):confused:

Paul / Devin, I have been down this track with a previous car/engine. If I were in your shoes (possible oiling issue and on a budget) I would fit a reputable large capacity road race pan to the engine (Canton or similiar) that has 4 way baffles with gates, -12 breather lines off the valve covers to a 2 liter catch can, ensure there is some form of restrictor in the oiling to the top end, perhaps fit oil drain lines to the rocker covers and an accusump. Definitely fit a low pressure switch that activates a very bright and obvious light in front of the driver that warns when oil pressure drops below 30psi. It is also useful to have an oil pressure gauge that you can watch as you test. When I had problems with wet sump the oil pressure would drop away from 70psi to 0 as engine rpm increased above 6400 - 7200. I had done all of the mods above and had to fit a dry sump. Bingo problem solved and more hp. Wasted months trying to resolve with wet sump and quite a few $$.

Then you need to do some dedicated testing (NOT racing) with the car to ensure that you have a good set up. This system may be OK and will probably cost say 30 - 40% of a dry sump by the time you plumb it up.

If you still have to go to a dry sump then you have spent some additional money on the pan and valve cover drain backs. The rest of the work would have needed to be done with a dry sump anyway.

Devin, Jim is quite correct. A dry sump is the solution. You will note that full on dry sumps have 5 or 6 pump sections or stages. 4/5 of these are for scavenging from valley, pan and wherever else the particular engine needs scavenging from. This is not a band aid but a reality of what is required to survive 7000+rpm and high G loads.

Not all engines are born equal when it comes to oiling and any engine that has a long stroke is way more inclined to have oiling problems due to additional windage.

Kel.

I just stopped by Total Engine Concepts here in town, he is a complete engine developing, building, and machining facility located in Riviera Beach, Florida. Specializing in both domestic and foreign engines including the GM GEN III for road race, circle track, and drag race applications,we are equipped to deliver. His engines have won races including the prestigious 24 Hours of Daytona to local circle track races in your area. He is the custom engine supplier for the Mosler MT900 in both the US and Europe. With over 45 years of performance engine building experience, his staff can develop your engine program or rebuild your current race engine. Our DTS engine dyno facility can can handle 1500 ft/lbs of torque and 2000 horse power, both fuel injected and carbureted.
Anyway, his suggestion was to run, not walk to Aviaid and get the LS-C dry sump and put all the worries about oil starvation behind us. The LS-C package is $2700.
So I guess i need to save my $$'s or sell a kidney. Anybody need one, I guess we have 2, so maybe I could let one go for say $2700, plus shipping and handling.


At $2,700 (assuming this is a complete system), dont waste your time with trying to make a wet sump work. Bite the bullet and go dry sump from day 1.

I like the run bit.............he has obviously seen LS devastation is action before. Damn, reminds me of all the bad habits of my last GM race car :-)

Mike K. at TEC (Total Engine Concepts) is the guy I have been SCREAMING ABOUT SINCE DAY 1 on this forum. I am so glad you went to talk to him! He is an old school Trans-Am road racer too.

He built our motors... He is AWESOME. Do everything he says. He is coming to the track on Sat. to do a check up tune on my carb for me (about the 3rd track visit to help and even a visit to my garage once). 2+ years after I bought 2 motors and he is still supporting us. One time we were pressed for pulling and engine and he took care of it for us.

He is honest and knows his stuff. 561.842.2813

I have said this before. Buy all your car parts from PAD and chevy or ford engine parts from Mike at TEC.

I wasn't sure how Mike would react, I showed up just looking for free advice and he was as nice and as informative as possible. He was busy building and engine and taking two phone calls, but he took the time to give me a bunch of free advice and was very nice about it. I liked him.

I wasn't sure how Mike would react, I showed up just looking for free advice and he was as nice and as informative as possible. He was busy building and engine and taking two phone calls, but he took the time to give me a bunch of free advice and was very nice about it. I liked him.

See, told you the AviAid was the ticket..... :smokin:
Devin

So Devin, how did you sell this $$$ to the wife? I need some help here. :)
Paul

So Devin, how did you sell this $$$ to the wife? I need some help here. :)
Paul

Paul, the cool thing about my wife, is she understands. We sat down and discussed the investment in the new engine and what it's going to take to protect it from the incident we had in January. Good honest discussion usually leads to good results.

All I can say is be gentle yet firm and explain to her in a way that she will understand. Honestly the cost of the Aviaid system is inexpensive when comparing to yet another engine and time away from the family for rebuilding....

I think after she saw the engine today, all shiny and new, she is leaning for me to purchase the dry sump now vs my initial tact of using the Accusump during the initial break in period...so, I may just do this all at once and be done -- which, is the route I prefer.

Good Luck - maybe our next trip to South Florida, we can introduce our wives and let them discuss this habit of ours... :evillol:
> Devin <

wow, you had me going there for a minute. i tell my wife tires cost $25 ea, brakes $30 and a new engine runs around $450. this seems to work just fine.