sway bar conversions

[g--thang]

hey,
im really appriaciating all the replys to my previous posts, there are some very intellegent people that reply...

I have a honda civic 2000 4door.

i heard silver say that he put a rear 15mm sway bar from a DEL SOL!!

Q1) what year did the del sol have a 15mm rear sway bar??? and will it fit perfectly onto my 00 4dr?????

Q2) will there be a big handling change if i get the front 21mm sway bar from a 99 civic SI and installing it on my 2000 4dr?? basically is it worth getting the front sway bar???

thanks

[Kven]

Lots of the Honda ITA racers like to use no front sway bar or a Civic/CRX HF(if it fits, i dont know) front sway; which is basicly the smallest sway bar i think Honda makes(14mm?).

As for the del sol rear sway, i dont really and havent heard of anyone using them on their civics.

[SilverY2KCivic]

Originally Posted by Kven

As for the del sol rear sway, i dont really and havent heard of anyone using them on their civics.

I'm currently running the OEM 15mm Del Sol VTEC rear swaybar on my '00 Civic coupe. I'm running that bar because quite frankly the 13mm Si bar is a joke IMO even though the Del Sol isn't very much bigger. I used to run a 22mm OEM ITR rear bar along with a Beak's kit until it started TEARING OUT my rear subframe after about 2 years of having it on. I was advised once I got the damage fixed (welding the tear rips and then having a "1/8th thick steel plate welded over that) by both my friend's dad who did the repairs for me, and also by a nationally ranked auto-X guy that I should NOT put the ITR bar back on, which I wasn't really planning to anyways. I was lucky it didn't rip the fram completely to the LCA mounting points. Long story short, I explored my OEM rear swaybar choices and setteled on the Del Sol bar since it's the biggest OEM bar that WON'T damage the very thin subframe that all 6th gen EK/EJ Civics come with, and also won't need any reinforcement kit for.

As far as OEM goes, the options are as follows:
13mm '99-'00 Civic Si swaybar
14mm '94-'01 Integra GSR swaybar
15mm Del Sol VTEC swaybar

Obviously the Del Sol bar won't make your car nearly as stiff in handling as the 22mm ITR bar, but at least it won't mess up your car and/or frame either, and it IS more noticeable than the skimpy 13mm Si swaybar.

As for a front bar, NO it's not worth getting if you want to balance out the handling since FF cars like ours will always bias towards understeer. The stiffer you make the front, the more it'll understeer. Adding a rear swaybar and NO front bar like how my Civic is set up, will make the car more balanced towards the rear and allow the rear of the car to rotate out more on it's own, and not understeer as much. With my old ITR rear bar setup, my car was very sensative to being able to kick the rear out very easily. Anyways, for you to add a front bar at least of OEM variety, you'll have to swap out your front LCAs for a set from either an Si or EX Civic of the same year/generation. That's a pain in the ass in itself. Plus something I've heard about how the mar has to go OVER the tranny hump and that's hard to do without dropping the tranny. I'd just stick with a rear swaybar and call it a day.

[g--thang]

Great reply silver!!

i really apriciate your help... you are very informed, and sound trust worthy due to your experiences...

ok enough ass kissing..

what about the civic 99 SIR bar??? i heard that it was thicker then 13mm... can anyone confirm this???

thanks

get back at me

[SilverY2KCivic]

Originally Posted by g--thang

Great reply silver!!

i really apriciate your help... you are very informed, and sound trust worthy due to your experiences...

ok enough ass kissing..

what about the civic 99 SIR bar??? i heard that it was thicker then 13mm... can anyone confirm this???

thanks

get back at me

Firstly front or rear bar, and also the SiR is the US equvallent to the Si in Canada unless you're talking a JDM spec model which I can't remember if there was an SiR or not. In any event, I'm sure it's also 13mm because the subframe should be the same as normal EK/EJ Civics. Only the Civic Type-R and Integra Type-R have a much thicker rear subframe that can withstand the forces that the 22mm bar they both have will exirt onto the frame. But this isn't to say the SiR 100% had a 13mm bar, it just wouldn't seem logical that it would not have it.

But yeah, I guarantee my word as gold on the Del Sol 15mm bar. I've been studying up on Civic suspension and suspension in general for the past 3 years, either by talking to reps from manufactures and companies, as well as personal experience. Anyways, good luck with things. Shoot any other questions you have on it my way, I'll be glad to answer.

[Nackattack]

Not trying to take this thread over but while we are on the subject...do I have to worry about the same type of wear from putting a thick rear sway bar on my ls. Is the subframe stronger than that of a civ? I want to get a sway bar really bad. THere is already an small oem one up front. Sounds like it would be pointless to upgrade that one because of the understeer.

[SilverY2KCivic]

Originally Posted by Nackattack

Not trying to take this thread over but while we are on the subject...do I have to worry about the same type of wear from putting a thick rear sway bar on my ls. Is the subframe stronger than that of a civ? I want to get a sway bar really bad. THere is already an small oem one up front. Sounds like it would be pointless to upgrade that one because of the understeer.

Best I can offer is to find out (H-T maybe?) if there's any tearout issues with DC2 Tegs. I haven't heard of any personally, then again I never did about Civics WITH the Beak's kit till after I got mine. I'd imagine the subframe is thicker than an EK, like how an EG/5th gen subframe is thicker, it's definitely nowhere as thick as an ITR. Remember the GSR came with a 14mm bar, and my guess is that's about as thick as they thought the subframe would handle. If you do go for an ITR bar or something similar in size, do so at your own risk. A company called A-Spec Racing makes a SWEET subframe brace for running an ITR or similar bar on thinner metal subframe Hondas. Might also be worth looking into. The $190 cost of it makes VERY affordable by far compared to your subframe ripping and having to get it repaired like i did with mine. Luckily a friend of mine's dad hooked up the welding and fabrication of the plates we welded on, FREE of charge to me. At a machine shop that would have cost me hundreds of dollars otherwise.

[Kven]

Originally Posted by SilverY2KCivic

A company called A-Spec Racing makes a SWEET subframe brace for running an ITR or similar bar on thinner metal subframe Hondas.

That's what im planning on getting. Looks very beefy; some people are running 32mm hollow sways on them with no problems.

I think someone did tearout their subframe on a DC(non-ITR), just search around on H-T.

[SilverY2KCivic]

Originally Posted by Kven

That's what im planning on getting. Looks very beefy; some people are running 32mm hollow sways on them with no problems.

I think someone did tearout their subframe on a DC(non-ITR), just search around on H-T.

Unless one has the super thick ITR subframe, I'd think it's possible on any EF/EG/EK/DC2/DA Honda or Acura.

I've heard that too about the subframe brace. I figure I've spent enough on my stuff thus far to make buying the A-spec brace not justifyable to me anylonger, esp. when I can revalve my Teins and get the same results with no risk or tearing anything which is what I'll end up doing with them. I did back some time ago want to get the 26mm Mugen rear bar, but not for the $270 asking price for it. Problem with the ITR bar is that it's solid and not hollow, so it has NO give to it what-so-ever. I'm surprised really that the frame gave out using it with me before any of the bolts holding it on gave out.

[Nackattack]

cool where are you getting your aspec bar from? Should I get tower as well as tie bar or will tower be cool for a while and I could eventually upgrade to tie....which on first?

Is this weapon r a piece of crap? http://www.eautoworks.com/html/ORD-1-1-1-24380.cfm

[Kven]

http://www.a-spec-racing.com/ email him for more info.

get the tower bars first.

that weapon r looks like some others ive seen except it uses 2 connecting bars(or whatever theyre called); never really heard anything bad about them(the company).

[SilverY2KCivic]

Originally Posted by Nackattack

cool where are you getting your aspec bar from? Should I get tower as well as tie bar or will tower be cool for a while and I could eventually upgrade to tie....which on first?

Is this weapon r a piece of crap? http://www.eautoworks.com/html/ORD-1-1-1-24380.cfm

With the swaybar you won't really need tiebars at all. For the front I'd suggest an H-brace like I have over a tiebar. I have the Megan Racing one, if you check their website they ripped off a picture of the one on my car to show how it looks installed.

[Nackattack]

Originally Posted by SilverY2KCivic

With the swaybar you won't really need tiebars at all. For the front I'd suggest an H-brace like I have over a tiebar. I have the Megan Racing one, if you check their website they ripped off a picture of the one on my car to show how it looks installed.

coo. Thanks for the info everyone. Does ls come stock with front tower, cuase I have a really small one up front already? I heard that the rear is more important cause if the front is too strong it will be more prone to understeer.

[Kven]

ive always thought the Type-Rs were the only ones with stock tower bars, unless you are talking about sway bars, then yes alot of the Hondas have stock ones up front.

[Nackattack]

Originally Posted by Kven

ive always thought the Type-Rs were the only ones with stock tower bars, unless you are talking about sway bars, then yes alot of the Hondas have stock ones up front.

Sry I did mean sway frnt sway bar(located above engine) not tower.