HelP! 92/93 Summit DL No start ignition

[BareFoot1]

I think i need an expert on this question. Unless you have had a similar problem with a colt vista/eagle summit/ mitsu mirage or you are a master tech with a lot of EFI diagnostics and repair experience, you probably cant help. I go in for surgery in 5 days and wont be able to fix this car afterward to get to take my family to see the rest of my family for Xmass.

i have a 92 eagle summit dl wagon with the 4G93 1.8L 16v SOHC eng with CMP and CKP in the dist with the power transistor. Initial cond, ran day before, now no start w no ing on following morning. I have been using a 1993 Mitsu mirage manual someone one sent me.

the ECU is pulsating at .5 sec intervals indicating NO FAULTS.

Ing transistor appears to fail the 1.5v batt test and A DMM diode test also reports continuity both ways pin 5 and pin 6 of dist connector.
Ref 16-61 Engine Electrical of the factory manual.

removed white power transistor base wire from computer to the distributor at the dist, connector A66. All other wires connected.
o scope reports approximatly +1v with no voltage variation (pulsation) on the white wire with all other wires connected. This of course means no fire signal to the power transistor.

at DIST connector A66 there appears to be pulsation CKP (crank sensor) on wires Pin 3 Br/G
correctly corrisponding to a pulse each rev

at DIST connector A66 there appears to be pulsation CMP (cam sensor) on wires Pin 4 Br/R
correctly corrisponding to a pulse every other rev

the voltage display on the oscope shows approx 2v or less cranking on pins 4 and 3

Pin 1 A66 dist connector Black wire, verified ground to chassis.

fuel pump relay in the MFI relay does not pull in. It has been taken apart and checked. it is functional. there is no pull in signal to operate the relay to run fuel pump. Pump does not cycle on on START. Manualy depressing relay arm starts pump with ING on.

voltage on the Volume Airflow Sensor on the (pin 1) Connector A74 Gr/L wire which supposedly supplies +5v to the air sensor from the ECU reports a +1v. Comp schematics show +5 here. Ref 00 General electrical pg 137.


the comp does not appear to be developing the +5 volts necessary to run the system. Unless there is somthing drawing more current at 5v than the computer can supply and dragging down the voltage, then the power supply in comp is bad.
I desperatly need to fix this prob without going to a local shop. All they will do is start swapping parts. The dist is $300 reman and over $500 new. I guess this means the comp is over $1200.

for the power trans, i have a NPN power transistor which i can substitute. Yes, i do know how to fudge this in without a screw up. I dont think it is worth it to fully dissisemble the dist to put the power transistor under everything else in there.

Could someone help me to be sure whether i need a new computer or dist? Such as an ironclad way to check the comp for function.
I understand some mitsu comps had problems with capacitors failing and eating up the board. I dearly hope this is not one of them.

[mark1600rs]

I have the same no start problem, no ing. with our 92 Eagle Summit wagon DL with a 1.8. I tried a rebuilt dist. Still no spark. I was wondering if you ever got yours repaired?

[BareFoot1]

The problem is resolved now. The computer or ECM had bad capicators on it which leaked on the motherboard causing traces to fail open. I have repaired the main board and have been driving it for 3 days now and all appears to be well. Computers range from 175 to fix yours to 945 for a new one. Message me if you need help.

[jjautomotive]

hello... saw your post for your sunmmit....

I have similar problem with mitsubishi manual...... yesterday.... I fried my onboard computer... one of the capacitors went bad.... switch ECU and things worked out... this morning car started then turned off.... started to have same problem as before... so cranked a couple more times but decided not to keep cranking....


Ignition power transistor test 16-59 fails
ignition coil (man sepc0.9-1.2 KoHm) was actually 1.4KoHM

vaccum (man spec 18 in.Hg) but was actually ~13 in.Hg
caused by catalytic converter & bad oxygen sensors.... was going to replace next week. Believe ctalytic converter ruined by faulty spark distribution to cylinder #4 possibly by coil??? or injector???


I have been diagnosing this car for hard starts for about 4 months.... using the mitsu manual as well as other retail manuals, everything I know about cars is from the last 4 months reading online and books.

How would I know if the problem is with the ignition power transistor as you had mentioned in one of yoru posts that that part was also faulty with your car but it was actually your ECU? Is your summit still running fine? any commebnts would be greatly appreciated. thanks.

[BareFoot1]

Hello JJautomotive
thanks for asking, i resoldered the motherboard with info from the internet, if you take the board out and look at the caps on it, they will probably have failed and corroded the motherboard, this is a common problem i am told.
Since the power transistor and the hall effect are in the distributor with the coil (which in your case appears ok) i would check the mb and then check to see if you have any intermittent contacts on any of the affected circuits. According to the manual my test of the power tranistor indicated it to be bad. This was not the case as it has been running since november last when i fixed the motherboard. At the time i fixed it there was only one left in the US that was original and the price was close to 1K usd. I used an Oscope to check that the hall effect was producing a varying waveform on cranking and realized that i did not have power to that part of the circuit on the (5 wire i think) connnector to the coil. That is when i went to the motherboard. CHECK it. Any swollen capacitors on the mboard are most certainly bad. IF you see any green connections with maybe a black area in the center you might have an open circuit. If anything is pulling more than the rated power it might have failed your new MB. I went as far as substituting an external power transistor to see if the power transistor was the problem. You could do that also for a test.
1, is there a switching signal on the wire to the base of the transistor?
2 is the lead to the coil going to ground as this switching is occouring?
good luck, if you liked this post and wish to copy the manual and send me a copy of it i would appreciate that. I will share anything i have in return

[doug_61]

Originally Posted by BareFoot1

, i resoldered the motherboard with info from the internet,

i,m having the same problem with a car my father has. was woundering what internet resources you used any links would be apreacated. also i have taken the board out of the ecm there is some green corosion near the center of the board but the capasitors appear ok. what capistors were bad in yours.

[ielenia]

The same thing happened to my 93 eagle summit wagon. We had the distributor replaced b4 my dad figured out it might be the computer. My fiance pulled it out and sure enought it was. The compasitors on the computers go bad especially if you live in a very hot and humid area. There is a place in Florida that will clean and fix your board for about $160. You can find their website online. I don't remember the name though. Sorry

[Condo141]

Name of the place in Florida is AvPro. Does good work with really quick turnaround.

[TNTomboy]

I was having the same no start problems, (seemed to be getting spark at least part of the time) replaced the fuel filter. Then it decided it wouldn't start when it rained but started fine on dry days. Replaced plugs and wires, distributer cap and rotor button. Still wouldn't start checked spark again had one so I replaced the fuel pressure regulator was getting gas infront of it but not behind (I thought!). Now it starts when cold, dies when it warms up say oh about 5 miles into a drive, then won't start again for about 30 minutes. I pulled the computer this evening, inspected it and found no swollen or leaking anything, no discolorations.. nothing. During all of this frustrating mess I have been hearing loud relay sounds from under the dash when it won't start but not when it does. There is another lil thingy under there (pardon me I am just a tomboy part swapper) I am going to pull it in the morning and see if I can get into it and clean what ever relays it has in it. I have two questons 1) what is that other lil thingy under there so I know what to buy if I can't clean it and 2) is there anything else I haven't checked?

NOTE this is a '92 and I have yet to find any part that is not the original.. it had 13 year old plugs, wires distributer cap etc. in it!!

[georgi]

Hi.friends. My Eagle Summit 2 weeks ago jerked on a run and next morning died. No start.Pump dead but I connected 12v from fuzes box, pump runs. Sparks Yes,Plags wet, injectors on-off OK (I gave
12v and checked by mouth),ECM OK (I bought other remanuf.in vane). No start.Explain me, where is (are)Relay(s) for Pump-Fuel-Injectors? Where is Relay others for ignition? How check them?Where oxigen sensor?What may I check else and how?
And where in Internet can I find info? HELP me!!
J confused with use this forum too:how to get the help?Or in my Email?How to send my cry?My Eagle 93, 173Kmiles.
Else question: here is fuel pressure regulator? I suspect, but doubt:
the regulator if it's precise hole, cannot refuse unexpectedly.
Something is nearby, but what? Thanks

[kissmygrits]

i've got a 92 summit dl, same starting problems. it would start, run, but if i stopped somewhere it would have to sit a while before it would turn over and start. when it wouldn't start there was a fast clicking under the dash on the passenger side. i've been starting it with a booster pack when problems have risen.

thought it was the fuel pump, so that was replaced. the car was fine for a few weeks.

we've just had a few weeks of disgusting humid/wet weather. last night i'd driven the car down the highway and it stalled. i pulled over, and there was a 'ribbon' of smoke that trickled from the glove box. most definately was not oil or antifreeze.. more electrical. would this be a wet and then shorted/fried comp?

car is driving me out of my mind