Custom Exhaust

[oldsintrigue1123]

Heyy Im new here and I have a couple questions and im hoping someone can gimme a hand..I am in the process of getting ready to build a custom exhaust for my 98 Olds Intrigue 3.8L V6..Heres what Im thinking:
- Keep the headers stock (for now)
- Hogan Aftermarket downpipe with a Magnaflow super hi flow cat (with a 3" flanged outlet)
- 3" piping to replace the resonator and the stock U-bend
- Magnaflow Aftermarket muffler with a 3" side inlet, 3" center outlet
I just wanted to make sure that this is even a functional setup. I'm obviously attempting to obtain a more aggressive tone from the exhaust but Im also after more power. The stock exhaust is pretty terrible so I know any change will help. My questions are
1.) Should I remove the resonator? (I want the exhaust to sound good but not TOO loud)
2.) Should I stick with the stock 2.5" piping? Or upgrade to the 3" piping? Which one will result in a better sound/more power? Will back pressure be a problem with the bigger piping?
3.) Is this setup 100% functional? Do you guys like it? lol
Any suggestions/tips/answers will be appreciated. Im trying to get this thing to be the best out on the road. But im 19! lol I need help! thanks guys. btw if you wanna check my car out take a look:
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/714932

[panzer dragoon]

ENGINE - 3800 Series II, 3.8L v6:

- Thrasher Cold Air Intake
- Performance Chip
- Bosch Platinum +4 Spark Plugs
- MSD 10.4MM Taylor Race Wires
- Oil Breather
- Various Parts Painted Blue
- Custom Setup for increased airflow/lower temps under the hood
- 160 Degree Thermostat
- Throttle Body Heat Shield
- IAT sensor Extension
- MSD Ignition Coils

You have a lot of mods there. If you are going possibly turbo or supercharger your exhaust will dictate. =Do any engine mods first before going to a complicated exhaust. Most people in this Intrigue forum do little modding = you will need to find a forum that specializes in 3800 mods =there are many.

How was the Eibach lowering kit and tire wear? =people here have been having problems with it. Rear wheel wear/alignment mostly.

[oldsintrigue1123]

Originally Posted by panzer dragoon

You have a lot of mods there. If you are going possibly turbo or supercharger your exhaust will dictate. =Do any engine mods first before going to a complicated exhaust. Most people in this Intrigue forum do little modding = you will need to find a forum that specializes in 3800 mods =there are many.

How was the Eibach lowering kit and tire wear? =people here have been having problems with it. Rear wheel wear/alignment mostly.

It is possible that quite sometime down the road i may go with a supercharger. But my goal for now is to just do as much performance work as possible without going into the major power adders and or engine internals. For now I just want to focus on getting every ounce of power out of it without going there yet. Thats why I want to focus on getting rid of the poor stock exhaust on this car next. As you can see from my page there arent many other engine mods I can do. I am going to go with a more powerful battery and ground wires, things like that. But no other major engine mods. Where can i find forums on 3800 mods? So what do u think about the exhaust mods do u think they sound correct?

I have also heard many things about the eibach setup screwing things up, but I have had no problems. Maybe minor noises here and there but everything has been adjusted and it rides and looks great. The tire wear has been pretty consistent since i got it. But i also make sure theryre balanced aligned and aired up on a very regular basis. Thanks for your help!

[LittleHoov]

My opinion...even with "all those mods" you arent pushing nearly enough air to warrant that sort of exhaust setup. I personally think if you open it up that much you will lose low-end torque like crazy.

Ported-Exhaust manifolds might be a good solution, or perhaps headers I guess, but I honestly think your money would be better spent elsewhere. For now I think a high-flow cat and U-bend removal would be good enough, and would be difficult for you to outflow with your current setup. Also I wouldnt remove the resonator, its not a performance restriction, and most people think it makes the car sound like crap, makes it really raspy and annoying loud at times, but some people like that. One of the best mufflers ive ever heard on a 3800 is the Hooker Aero, but that was only through a sound clip, and mufflers wont give you a performance increase at all, at least not on these cars.

I can tell you right now that opening up to 3 inches is a bad idea, just dont do it, I think youll end up hating it if you do. You might check out some forums for the Grand Prix or the other W-bodies with the 3800, they should be able to help you out better, even some forums for cars like the Bonneville would be great...weren not supposed to recommend other forums, but if you go to google and type "bonneville forum", the first result will be about the best forum you could ever join.

On a sidenote I also think a 160 T-stat is far too cold for a car with those mods, its probably doing more harm than good. I understand that you want it to be the best on the road, but you probably want it to stay on the road too, if I had a car with the 3800, I would be replacing those manifold gaskets as preventive maintenance before getting too mod happy. Ive been through a 3800 gasket failure, and lemme tell ya, its no fun.

[oldsintrigue1123]

Originally Posted by LittleHoov

My opinion...even with "all those mods" you arent pushing nearly enough air to warrant that sort of exhaust setup. I personally think if you open it up that much you will lose low-end torque like crazy.

Ported-Exhaust manifolds might be a good solution, or perhaps headers I guess, but I honestly think your money would be better spent elsewhere. For now I think a high-flow cat and U-bend removal would be good enough, and would be difficult for you to outflow with your current setup. Also I wouldnt remove the resonator, its not a performance restriction, and most people think it makes the car sound like crap, makes it really raspy and annoying loud at times, but some people like that. One of the best mufflers ive ever heard on a 3800 is the Hooker Aero, but that was only through a sound clip, and mufflers wont give you a performance increase at all, at least not on these cars.

I can tell you right now that opening up to 3 inches is a bad idea, just dont do it, I think youll end up hating it if you do. You might check out some forums for the Grand Prix or the other W-bodies with the 3800, they should be able to help you out better, even some forums for cars like the Bonneville would be great...weren not supposed to recommend other forums, but if you go to google and type "bonneville forum", the first result will be about the best forum you could ever join.

On a sidenote I also think a 160 T-stat is far too cold for a car with those mods, its probably doing more harm than good. I understand that you want it to be the best on the road, but you probably want it to stay on the road too, if I had a car with the 3800, I would be replacing those manifold gaskets as preventive maintenance before getting too mod happy. Ive been through a 3800 gasket failure, and lemme tell ya, its no fun.

I appreciate your feedback.. I am only 19 and I could always know more, I'm sort of learning on the fly that's why I really try and take the time to talk to as many people as possible before going ahead with things. To be honest I actually know someone personally with a 3.8l trigue (with NO ENIGINE MODS) who has a pretty much identical setup to the one I am thinking about getting and his car sounds absolutely nuts..I mean it truly sounds like a v8 roaring down the road. so i dunno what to do lol any suggestions on what to do now instead? I mean u said i could put my money somewhere else what would u suggest? AGAIN THANKS SO MUCH GUYS

[LittleHoov]

It really just depends on what you want to do, don't worry about being only 19, as a matter of fact I'm only 19 myself.

My priorities right now are to have a car that runs and gets me reliably where I need to go, so thats where Id be putting my money, and where I have/will be in the future. Yes I have some mods, but maintenance comes before modding in my book. If I had a Series II 3800, I wouldnt be waiting till the gaskets failed, and they will at some point, its almost guaranteed. So Id be spending the money to get the parts needed to do it up right, and do it when I want to do it, instead of being put in a jam when it does happen. Im just saying if it were me, I wouldnt want to go spend all my money on mods, then have my gaskets fail and have a 3500lb piece of scrap metal sitting in my yard.

http://www.bonnevilleclub.com/forum/...e=article&k=91
that might be a good read for you, its geared toward the Bonneville/H-body cars, but they have the same engine as you, so its pretty good advice.

Just a few things to mention after reading the article again myself, there IS a turbo kit or two available for your car, but its going to be short lived fun if you dont modify your transmission heavily as well.

There are a lot of things you can do to make your car more "fun" without even touching the engine/exhaust. Have you considered mods like upgraded brakes and suspension/handling upgrades? Out of the mods Ive done, my favorite has probably been the brakes, makes a nice difference. I just now looked at your cardomain page and thats a nice lookin Intrigue, all I know, is if I had those wheels, Id be tuckin some Corvette calipers on 12 inch rotors. Theres no point in driving fast if you cant stop.

I could go on and on forever, its just the way I am, but Ill stop. If you seriously want to go fast in this car, then get serious. You can turbocharge it, but a much easier option is to do an L67 top end swap, where basically you take the top end of a Supercharged Series II 3800 and attach it to your regular ol Series II. It can be done, Ive seen it done several times, makes for some good times. But I will tell you that you will need some transmission work to make it reliable, the added power from a mod like that will kill your transmission in a hurry.

https://www.zzperformance.com/grand_...=382&catid=109
Warning...the above link will make your car go pretty fast There may be some things that are slightly different between the Intrigue and the GP, but it should be pretty much the same. I believe Intense Racing also sells a similar kit, and both Intense and ZZP have good customer service, so if you ask them they might be able to help you out if youre wanting to go that route.

Oh yeah I was stopping, seriously though, just read up on some other forums and see whats out there. Youve got a nice car already, I thought my Intrigue was pretty nice, but Im actually quite jealous right now, and I wish I had the cash to make mine look like that.

Happy modding!

[oldsintrigue1123]

lol wow man ur 19 too?! lol well then u know a hell of alot more than i do..thanks for ur help, trust me i have already put mucho money into the ext and everything..as much as i would absolutely luv throwing a sick turbo or SC on this monster, that is an amount of cash that i dont have lol..so what do u think? based on what ur saying i am now thinking of saving for sum manifolds lol..but whats the diff between manifolds and headers?? advs and disadvs?

[LittleHoov]

Heck for what youve spent on the exterior/interior you could have a dang fast Intrigue, but hey to each their own. You have a good looking car, that will handle most ricers easily, not a thing wrong with that.

As for headers vs manifolds you can read this http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question172.htm
Im not good at explaining things sometimes, and that article explains it pretty well.

Porting the exhaust manifolds will just open them up a little more in certain areas to allow a little more flow. Theyre usually just cheaper than headers.

I dont think I know that much Ive just seen a little bit, Ive been hanging around 3800 based forums since I was about 15-16, spending a lot of time just reading and learning. That would be my advice to you, hit up some forums for cars like the Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, and Impala that have the 3800 and are popular to mod. Get some advice and feedback from people who have actually done what youre wanting to do, most of what Im giving you is stuff Ive read and seen, never personally experienced.

Another mod I forgot to mention is something like this http://www.intense-racing.com/Mercha...ategory_Code=T
A shift kit will firm up your shifts and make them shift faster as well, so you spend more time putting power to the ground than shifting, plus it will help your transmission out in the long run.

Theres several things you can do to an Intrigue to make it a fun car, especially if you have the 3.8, once again, you want to make sure you spend your money the best way you can, so do your homework before you plop down the cash.

[oldsintrigue1123]

yeah ive looked into the shift kit, that is most def next on my mod list but something like that is a no brainer..theres not 15 dif types and cuts and all that bs..most likely my recent mods are going to be:
1.) Shift kit (trans filter kit as well)
2.) Optima battery
3.) HiFlow Cat
4.) Aftermarket Muffler and piping
5.) Headers
6.) Then I was thinking about throwing a strut bar on and sum aftermarket sway bars for my handling.

Like u said man i can most def take the ricers out there..ive had my share of races and ive come out on top everytime but twice..once was against a 4dr jag and once against a mercedes (one of those crazy 5liter 400hp ones lol) but hey lol..i agree with u completely in that I DEFINITELY want this baby running for a long time, the longevity and quality of the car is more important to me than the short run performance..thats why im starting small and trying to do the little things to help the car run the best it ever has..coils, plugs, wires, intake etc..it truly is running the best it has ever run right now..but i def want more, anyway i can help it i want to...every1 i speak to says u def need to open up the exhaust..cuz every1 loves my intake and based on tests im getting a ridic amount of air than that from the stock box, but every1 says "thats great but you need to help the car get rid of all that air now, air in air out, it has to be good at both, efficiently" as for brakes i have 12inch slotted and drilled on the front and 10s on the back..umm hawk pads, eibach springs, KYB struts..so it def stops GREAT pretty damn sickly actually lol and the handling is good but it could always be better when ur throwing 3500 lbs around a corner at 65 lol..so what do u think

[LittleHoov]

Did you have 12-inch front brakes stock? If so you've got an Autobahn Intrigue on your hands, which basically doesnt mean a whole heck of a lot, other than it had better brakes stock, and should actually do the speed the speedometer goes too. Buuut I wouldnt test that.

There are a few suspension kits available for the Intrigue, the best bang for your buck one is this

For the strut bar that comes with it, you will either have to drill holes using a template, or buy some pre-fabbed mounting brackets for about 60 bucks a piece from a guy on ClubGp...I went the drilling holes route myself, and I still have the templates saved, because I had to contact customer service to get them.

If you decide to go with that kit, you might order some Energy Suspension Endlinks to fit instead of the OEM ones, a place like Summit should be able to help you get the right ones.

[oldsintrigue1123]

yeah my intrigue came with the autobahn package and all that so they were big brakes stock..but yo i gotta question for u, what do u think about a PCM? have u heard of any that would help out? i know ive heard that sum cause more trouble than good lol but i figured thats another thing i gotta look into eventually..hit mebak

[LittleHoov]

With the mods you have now, a PCM probably wont do you a whole lot of good. In these cars, a PCM is basically only good to "wake up" more hardcore mods that the stock PCM cant adapt too. The stock PCM does have some amount of leeway to adapt to the basic mods.

As was said over on BC, I would really get that 160 out of there and put in a 180, it might actually be hurting your performance, and I know it has to be hurting gas mileage.

I would say you wouldnt need to consider an upgraded PCM until you started modifying internal engine parts, but thats just my opinion.

If you do get a PCM, get one from Intense Racing, ZZ Performance, and theres another brand called DHP, which I believe is Domestic High Performance. The only company I've ever delt with is Intense though, so I recommend them. If you do decide to get one in the future you might e-mail them to let them know your situation, and they can probably hook you up. Working with your engine should be cake for them, but Im almost positive that the Intrigue transmission does have different gear ratios than some of the other W-cars. You should be able to supply them with the basic info of your car and they should be able to hook you up. It might be "custom" though, so they might charge you a tad more.

I would tell them you have an Intrigue, that its a W-body, that you have the 3800 Series II naturally aspirated engine, and that you have the 4T65-E transmission with whichever gear ratio you have. You can tell which one your car has by looking at the RPO codes on the inside of the trunk lid. FR9 is the 3.29 ratio and F83 is the 3.05. A lot of vendors don't know that the Intrigue will work with their products, and heck even GM doesn't advertise that some of their products will work with it. Which is personally why I've dubbed it the forgotten W-body.

[oldsintrigue1123]

thanks again man lol..yo believe it or not i have worked out my gas mileage with every mod i have done, i was getting something like 22 mpg (city and highway) before the thermostat, after it i was actually getting something liek 23. something, thats pretty much where im at now..so if u were me lol what do u think my next say 5 mods should be..just curious lol thanks man

[LittleHoov]

I think you'd do fine with a 2.5" downpipe, high-flow cat and a u-bend removal. At this point I personally think that PEMs or Headers is probably a waste of money. If you plan on doing more serious mods in the future though, then it might not hurt. I also think the shift kit is a good idea.

Thats 4 mods right there I guess, Im not sure how many miles are on your car, but ive seen the gaskets fail at 40,000 miles or 250,000 miles, doesnt really seem to matter. But I would seriously consider doing it as preventive maintenance. If I ever own another 3800, you can bet Ill be doing it.

[oldsintrigue1123]

yeah so based on what every1s saying i think im gonna go with the shift kit and trans filter kit next..followed by the 2.5 downpipe, high flow cat, 2.5 piping to get rid of the resonator and u-bend, and a simple aftermarket muffler..